----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, August 16, 2009 5:33
AM
Subject: [LML] Re: OSH arrival
Bill,
I absolutely agree with you. I avoid flying
into Oshkosh and Sun n Fun for much the same reasons as you detail
below.
Tried to get the warbird arrival last year.
I even arranged it with the tower at Fond du Lac. On my way in to
Oshkosh, I was asked if I was a Warbird - I honestly told them I was not
- they told me I could not have the warbird arrival. I then tried
to get the "turbine arrival" - they asked me if I was a turbine - again I
replied honestly and they told me I could not have the "turbine
arrival". I was forced to make a short pattern and land on the taxiway -
which actually worked OK.
I don't think the Oshkosh controllers have any
idea about the V speeds of the planes they are controlling. Their
emphasis is on getting everyone in as quickly as possible whether safely or
not.
Because of my experience coming in to Oshkosh
last year, I came in to Fond du Lac this year.
D. Brunner
N241DB
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, August 15, 2009 1:10
PM
Subject: [LML] OSH arrival
If you have any comments on the Oshkosh arrival
procedure you can send them here. My $0.02 below.
https://secure.eaa.org/airventure/atc_feedback.html
Two comments.
1... I flew my Lancair 360 using
the high approach. All traffic was landing 27 and it was busy. The
first half of the approach to Fisk went well. At Fisk I was instructed
to descend and merge with traffic in the low pattern.
Merging
fast with slow traffic miles from the airport out of sight, and
instructing them to maintain 1/2 mile spacing with no S turns is
requiring them to violate fundamental limitations of physics.
The situation will get worse each year as light sport planes
proliferate. This is why pilots of many fast aircraft are switching to
the warbird arrival. If that is what you want eliminate the high
approach and instruct fast aircraft to use the warbird
arrival.
My recommendation is to keep the fast and slow
aircraft separated by altitude until the controller has them in sight
and calls the turn to base on 27 or final on 36 R/L. The controller
can point out the aircraft to follow and there are at least two sets
of eyes looking for a potential collision instead of one. You could
position another controller out at half mile final watching the merge
up close. That controller would remain silent unless a conflict
develops.
2... There was a substantial north crosswind.
the controller repeatedly instructed me to fly a close in downwind,
which I refused to do as I was already at my comfort limit. The
controller called a very close-in base behind a slow moving Cessna.
Half way through base he instructed the Cessna to land long and
for me to land on the pink dot, closest to the threshold.. This called
for a steep power off turn to final. With a continuous steep
turn from downwind I still overshot the centerline somewhat due to the
tailwind on base. Had I flown as close in as the controller wanted,
the overshoot would have been been much greater.
With 2,200
hours in the aircraft including countless practice dead stick landings
and many Oshkosh arrivals I found the situation challenging. I flew on
hair trigger, prepared to go around if at any point it became
"uncomfortable".
I am concerned for the new builders who have
just completed flying off the 25 hours on a high performance aircraft
and are bringing it to Oshkosh for the first time, especially
inexperienced pilots who feel compelled to do whatever the controller
calls for.
Asking them to perform such an unusual and
challenging maneuver is too dangerous. The compounding of multiple
factors, following a slow aircraft, close in downwind, tailwind on
base, close in base and last minute land short instruction can
overload the pilot into a situation where he is low and slow pulling
too much G in a steep turn. That could easily end with a snap roll
into the ground.
Fast aircraft should not be expected to fly as
close in on downwind as a the slower aircraft.
The call to
turn base should include the proposed touchdown point so that he can
set the right power setting, and give the pilots at least a 1/3mile
final to the proposed touchdown point allowing them enough time to
stabilize their approach.
Given the wide range of experience of
Oshkosh pilots, the arrival procedure should not ask them to do things
that are dramatically different and more difficult than what they do
in their normal flying.
Regards,
Bill Hannahan
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