Mike,
Do you recall was your idle way rich or way lean when you were getting high
MP?  Chris just installed larger injectors so what you are saying is a
possibility.
Bill

-----Original Message-----
From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On
Behalf Of Mike Wills
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 10:15 PM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Consistant progress...not sure how to act?

Bill,

I beg to differ. When I first started to tune my engine about a year ago I
had similar indications. Best I could do was about 1700 RPM and about 14.5"
to 15". Attempting anything below this the engine refused to run. I spent
many hours trying to find the vacuum leak. There was no vacuum leak. My
problem was that below this point my engine simply wouldnt idle because the
MCT was too far out of whack. Once I was completely convinced that there was
no vacuum leak I went back through my tuning procedure repeatedly and
finally got a decent idle down around 1500 RPM and 13". My EC2 is one of the
oldest around, did not have an EM2 (Tracy wasnt making a monitor when I
built mine), and no auto tune.

Some time after my first flight I knew there was still more tuning to do so
bit the bullet and bought one of Ed's EFISM. I was shocked when I was able
to actually see the MCT contents at how poorly my MCT was programmed after
all of my careful and repeated efforts to get it right. And yet it ran well
enough that I was comfortable flying it.

After more tuning using the EFISM my idle is now at about 1300 and about
11". It runs smooth at this setting and accepts throttle with no burps or
hiccups. Finally seem to have cured my staging hiccup by setting my staging
point at 18" and very carefully tuning the MCT locations at 17.5" and 18"
for a smooth transition. I still think the MCT could be improved, but it's
certainly on par with the carbureted Lyc I used to fly in my RV-6A.

I'm not saying that you are wrong in Chris' case, but a vacuum leak is not
necessarily the only possibility.

Mike Wills
RV-4 N144MW

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Bradburry" <bbradburry@bellsouth.net>
To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 5:49 AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Consistant progress...not sure how to act?

Chris,
If you are idling at 15 inches, you have a leak somewhere.  First check
your
manifold pressure in the closed hangar against your altimeter set for
field
elevation.  You are at what? 500 ft?  The MP should be within a half inch
of
the altimeter setting in the Kollsman window.  If your MP reading is
correct, then find the leak.
I have seen several methods for finding leaks on this list.  Get a can of
WD-40 with the little red tube on it so you can control it and not make
much
of a mess, and with the engine idling, spurt(very small spurt) WD-40 on
each
crack and cranny on the intake system. Spurt, listen for the idle speed to
increase, spurt next place.  Don't forget where the injectors install, it
could be leaking around them.  Idle increase=leak.  No change=no leak.
Be careful there is a prop on there.  Do this with someone. Don't spray
the
exhaust!
To explain what I think might be happening with your fuel flow and HP
numbers in a couple of words, its your new large injectors.  The EM-2
looks
at pulse duration to start to make its calculations.  The big injectors
have
a smaller duration to satisfy the fuel requirement.  You will have to
recalibrate your fuel flow to fix this.  Dennis is doing this now as well.
You should start all over with your tuning from the very beginning.  Do
the
check the injector flow rate at 22 inches Mode 3. Tracy suggested this
order, Mode 3, 6, 2, 1, then auto tune.  You don't want to be doing auto
tune now, cause every time you do, it will change something.
Fix the leak before you do anything else.

Bill B

-----Original Message-----
From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On
Behalf Of Christopher Barber
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 4:43 AM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Consistant progress...not sure how to act?

I went out tonight and checked for leaks and could not find any, but you
are
right, it is likely idling too high.  I will likely remove the suspect
part
of the manifold and give it a more diligent inspection.
The Mistral intake is two major parts.  The part that is bolted onto the
engine has nothing that could leak.  It is connected to the throttle body
portion by aluminum tubes.  The throttle body portion has a couple of
places
that could leak.  That being said, I was intense in my method to seal the
the openings that Mistral provided to attached various hoses that I am not
using.  However, I will verify.

I did verify that the throttle is closing all the way, so I got some more
investigating to do.

In a similar note and perhaps this should be more directed at Tracy but
how
does the EM2 determine Horsepower and Percent of power.  Tonight when I
cranked the power to full at about 5870 rpm's I was looking at a fuel flow
of about 11 gph (which if I read previous post correctly is
low) and a HP of about 93 which indicated 50% power.  Now, I was at FULL
power, but is was indicating 93 HP and 50% power.  Whats up with that?
OH OH OH, the MP was showing 29. (for once I remembered to look <g>)

I did learn something tonight.  If I forget to turn on the fan while
sitting
on the ramp at 86 degree Houston night, my temps shoot up much faster.

I do think my staging point is either 15 or 15.5 by looking at the
asterisk
coming on and off while near idle.  I have had my EC2 since
2005 and even though Tracy has updated it, I think the staging is the
same.

I am still working out EC2 issues.  While it is running much, much better,
it still seems to change subtle elements of the MAP table on its own.  I
don't know yet if this is due to my attempt at using Auto Tune mode or
not.
It seems when I shut it down at night and come back the next days, minor
difference are present. Not sure why it seems to have a mind of its own.
Of
course, getting time to focus on the differences is difficult.  I know, I
am
preaching to the choir, as we all have time constraints.

I hope I am actually making progress <g>

All the best,

Chris

Al Gietzen wrote:

I meant to note the MP but forgot.  IIRC the MP was what I considered
a bit high at about 15.  Since this is where Tracy has the staging
point by design
(15 or 15.5 I think) I noticed it

Chris;

I see Map of 10 - 11" at idle.  By 15 it's putting out some serious
power.
Either the throttle isn't closing or you have a pretty serious leak.

I think on the more recent versions Tracy has been setting  the
default staging higher, like 16.5 - 17".

Best,

Al



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