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Al, well with just a quick search, I can find it
either :-) I'll have to take a closer look, possibly back into the site
archives.
I took a look at the link you provided and two
things pop into mind when I read it. #1 they are predominatly talking about
thermoset plastics with glass fiber re-enforcment. As of yet no-one not even
Boeing is building airframes with thermoset plastics. [At least not to my
knowledge] And the one time they tried to do it, they actually scrapped a VERY
expensive wing due to issues in the fiber and the resin [ thermal-set resin]
matrix. This was back during the JTF design/proto type competition with Northrop
[ Northrop ended up w/ the contract... as an aside note]. #2 they talk
about the resistance of Fiberglass to corrosion and in its context it would seem
that they are talking about the glass fibers themselves which are resistant.
This I totally agree on, its the resin matrix which is/has and will cause us the
many problems we potentially can have with Fiberglass. [ No I'm not
anti-fiberglass, I'm currently building one :-) ] I'll do some
more in-depth searching and see it I can't find that email about all of this
wonderfull stuff.
Jarrett
I'm unable to find anything to substantiate this water
theory. If you find something, let me know. Here's a pretty good
link:
-al wick
Resistance to Aggressive Environments
Resistance
to corrosion in aggressive environments is one of the primary reasons for
specifying fiberglass tanks or piping. Typical types of corrosion do not
affect fiberglass. This would include galvanic, aerobic, pitting and
inter-granular corrosion which harms metals but not fiberglass. Although
fiberglass resists a wide range of chemicals and temperatures, it requires the
right design, fabrication and installation to match the appropriate
application. For example, fiberglass may be subject to chemical attack from
hydrolysis, oxidation, pyrolysis or incompatible solutions. The proper
resin/glass matrix will minimize chemical attack.
Al,
I guess ( if it is not so, I apologize for the
assumption and bring into play myself :)), Jarrett wanted to point out the
(possible) change of properties of the Gas/Fuel/Water mix.
I understand ( assume) that each by itself is less
problematic.
Mix Fuel with Alcohol and it starts to eat tanks,
rubber, O-rings, etc.
Bring some water into the mix and the eating becomes a
feast!
Plain - it seems the alcohol makes the mix more
agressive and water does it again.
Water and Fuel WITHOUT Alcohol doesn't seem to be a
problem (chemically...).
So the question is: How much does Water aggravate the
Fuel/Alcohol problem?
Thomas J.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2006
10:12 AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Auto
fuel
No, never heard that theory before. I've had auto fuel in my tanks
since day one. Alcohol has great affinity for water, real quick to absorb
it. That's how you test for alcohol content. Add water, swirl. So that's
the other less scientific test.
-al wick
Al, were these experiments done at some point with some level of
water included in the fuel? It's my understanding that with water mixed
in it becomes an even bigger Bear to contain due to some chemical
reaction.
Curious...but still building in Fiberglass...
Jarrett Johnson
> No, I wasn't speaking of polyester. You can buy epoxies of
different
> ratios. I'm told by expert (Gary Hunter) that all
epoxies which use
> ratios like 80/20 have significantly better
mechanical and chemical
> properties. This is measurable, and
agrees with my and other peoples
> tests. Like I say, I tested
all of the fuel tank components in various
> batches of alcohol
fuel for years (you know how I don't like design
> assumptions).
None of the components were affected. The only exception
> was
when I exposed 50/50 epoxy mix to fuel. It slowly got mushy.
>
> I have seen fuel tanks destroyed, leaking like a sieve from
> exposure to
> alcohol fuel. One reportedly had old
version of proseal inside. It
> completely peeled off tank
inside. Clogged fuel port. Forced
> landing. If
> memory
serves me correct, it also had poly that degraded by
> erosion.
It
> looked like someone had etched the poly out of the tank.
>
>
> -al wick
> Artificial intelligence in
cockpit, Cozy IV powered by stock
> Subaru 2.5
> N9032U
200+ hours on engine/airframe from Portland, Oregon
> Prop
construct, Subaru install, Risk assessment, Glass panel
> design
info:
>
http://www.maddyhome.com/canardpages/pages/alwick/index.html
>
>
> On Wed, 18 Jan 2006 20:07:41 +1000 "george lendich"
> <lendich@optusnet.com.au> writes:
> Al,
>
You must be speaking about Polyester as Epoxy must absolutely
>
maintain a
> strict ration mix, as per manufacturers
instructions, to allow proper
> molecule to molecule bonding of
the hardener and the resin.
> Polyester on
> the other
hand has flexibility in that, more hardener promotes
>
hardeningsooner.
> George (down under)
> I tested the hell
out of that. No effect. Years of exposure to
> differentbatches
of known alcohol. I understand that if you use a
> resin of high
> proportions of hardener to resin, it's resistant. If you use
> 50/50, it
> isn't. I had 50/50 get soft from fuel
exposure.
> This info consistent with all the other guys that did
the same test.
>
>
> -al wick
> Artificial
intelligence in cockpit, Cozy IV powered by stock
> Subaru 2.5
> N9032U 200+ hours on engine/airframe from Portland, Oregon
> Prop construct, Subaru install, Risk assessment, Glass panel
> design info:
>
http://www.maddyhome.com/canardpages/pages/alwick/index.html
>
> On Tue, 17 Jan 2006 22:21:34 -0600 "William"
<wschertz@ispwest.com>
> writes:
> It will make it
less attractive for those with fiberglass tanks.
> Alcohol/gas
mixes are more aggressive than either gas or alcohol
> alone.Bill
Schertz
> KIS Cruiser # 4045
> ----- Original Message
-----
> From: John Downing
> To: Rotary motors in aircraft
> Sent: Tuesday, January 17, 2006 8:17 PM
> Subject:
[FlyRotary] Auto fuel
>
>
> By the Farm Bureau
Paper it is stated that Wisconsin has passed a law
> that all 87
no lead will contain 10% alcohol and that nine other
> statesare
considering it. It didn't mention the other no lead
>
grades. Here in
> Michigan it is under consideration at
this time, and there is a good
> chance it pass. Other than
cutting the power some what, is going to
> effect the operation
of the rotary in some other way. JohnD
>
>
>
> -al wick
> Artificial intelligence in cockpit, Cozy IV
powered by stock
> Subaru 2.5
> N9032U 200+ hours on
engine/airframe from Portland, Oregon
> Prop construct, Subaru
install, Risk assessment, Glass panel
> design info:
>
http://www.maddyhome.com/canardpages/pages/alwick/index.html
>
--
Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/
Archive and UnSub: http://mail.lancaironline.net/lists/flyrotary/
-al wick
Artificial intelligence in
cockpit, Cozy IV powered by stock Subaru 2.5
N9032U 200+ hours on
engine/airframe from Portland, Oregon
Prop construct, Subaru install,
Risk assessment, Glass panel design
info:
http://www.maddyhome.com/canardpages/pages/alwick/index.html
-al wick
Artificial intelligence in
cockpit, Cozy IV powered by stock Subaru 2.5
N9032U 200+ hours on
engine/airframe from Portland, Oregon
Prop construct, Subaru install, Risk
assessment, Glass panel design
info:
http://www.maddyhome.com/canardpages/pages/alwick/index.html
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