X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Wed, 02 Jan 2013 18:16:59 -0500 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from nm40-vm7.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com ([72.30.239.215] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.0.1) with ESMTPS id 5991959 for lml@lancaironline.net; Wed, 02 Jan 2013 15:05:00 -0500 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=72.30.239.215; envelope-from=bu131@swbell.net Received: from [98.139.212.151] by nm40.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Jan 2013 20:04:26 -0000 Received: from [98.136.87.73] by tm8.bullet.mail.bf1.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Jan 2013 20:04:26 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by smtp124-mob.biz.mail.ac4.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 02 Jan 2013 20:04:26 -0000 X-Yahoo-Newman-Id: 241901.62804.bm@smtp124-mob.biz.mail.ac4.yahoo.com X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 X-YMail-OSG: FHuRLtQVM1ncneWpBZVyEE7ShVHlUPH2gfeYWdvY45Vz.pr V6a3w7FQ6F0yfuxowfASVVpwWr.s273poZVoRWxFD7rUKtWEq_1XjQvM0nUw ZxYFtwQ25FTpjDxUrhwGQfrrxnTn1HOJQOhj_YENEKodq.t04qdqvTAVKXxB Sa8IwE02TtyQVSP5TjhIteWt96dv4o_naDU1K1uj8lFwoZNhKWxBGNjs1ZQJ Mqoje8AnsqLTYUKLI3UV15Ks5wtOGC3N8olRy.H6bjPv.c.4i2sMk9oBfOeo Wwwto8oY1gruHHkB1iqJY4rStyJXAFPjhhvzzXjbN7yNg.s9r8esYwuxVzJE jXzYmZprjFB9QVJoxvOKv4jBFG6R34U57njV6EYoodksH6TJ6ZgvM2D.a8Wc GM1oRap3svmFr7BheuazIHN1gTgj11hzMzzCxlyVXaoImZicxeYISS.wJU24 6QYFwsY4Pca6knlO9VFj.uVirCcKgZVg3NAqHfT.sO.U7._4S8hxWsjeI.Eq 3FyEp3LY- X-Yahoo-SMTP: eERJTJCswBCu0l0QxPF_oyc3n8.DQSe28zFd2dc- Received: from [192.168.1.103] (bu131@99.181.53.104 with xymcookie) by smtp124-mob.biz.mail.ac4.yahoo.com with SMTP; 02 Jan 2013 12:04:25 -0800 PST Subject: Re: [LML] Re: stalls References: From: Andres Katz Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-357A947F-ABD3-4F65-B3DA-8AD0D19A443C X-Mailer: iPad Mail (9B206) In-Reply-To: X-Original-Message-Id: <01CDB529-B7E6-4F4B-9F42-074387BEA2C5@swbell.net> X-Original-Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2013 14:04:25 -0600 X-Original-To: Lancair Mailing List Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) --Apple-Mail-357A947F-ABD3-4F65-B3DA-8AD0D19A443C Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii The Zlin and all lancairs have in common one thing: you exceed the angle of a= ttack vs lift and like other airplanes they will stall, I guess there is not= hing else in common.... It would be foolish to go solo and do stalls without instruction specially i= n a IV-P with small wings, I practice stalls solo in the evo and the IV ( I f= ly solo 90% of the time, who is going to help me?) Sent from my iPad On Jan 2, 2013, at 1:04 PM, Colyn Case wrote: > aerodynamically, I don't know what a Lancair has in common with a Zlin. = One thing it doesn't have is excess control authority. I'm all in favor o= f stall recognition training but I wouldn't advocate everyone going out in t= heir Lancair's solo and doing it.... >=20 > On Jan 2, 2013, at 9:45 AM, Andres Katz wrote: >=20 > Why not? > If you never stall the airplane when it happens you won't be able to recog= nize what is doing and how to react. Learning what your airplane does when i= t stalls and recovering from it is essential to safe flight. In flying Acro w= e stall the airplane multiple times, at low altitude and in front of ungrate= ful critical sobs that will laugh at you when you screw up but will give you= good tips about recovering from it. Every airplane stalls differently, righ= t wing drop, left wing drop, bucking etc. learning what the airplane does pr= e stall is the most important. My ZLIN 50 is so nice it begins to buckle and= bitch at me and tells me what I need to do (lower the stick) before it kill= s me. I advise you to get a good instructor and go to 10,000 feet and spend t= he best 2 hrs of your life stalling your airplane and getting to know her. I= t's=20 > Ike making love to your wife and knowing when she is happy..... > Sorry about that but > My old savvy instructor when checking me out in single seat airplanes alwa= ys told me the same, go out to a safe altitude, stall the airplane, learn wh= en it does it look at the speed when it happens, add 10 knots and come and l= and, it has never failed to get me down safely ie yak55, Jungmeister, ZLIN, c= hipmunk etc. > My few cents worth of it. You will live longer. >=20 > Sent from my iPad >=20 > On Jan 2, 2013, at 7:15 AM, "David M. Powell CRFA" wr= ote: >=20 >> I have made the decision prior to purchasing to avoid stalls altogether i= n my 360. After reading the stall and stall spin accident information, I ju= st don't think it's worth the risk. On take-off, I stay in ground effect fo= r the half second it takes to make it into the green after wheels up; on lan= ding, I approach well above stall for my flap configuration, and let the spe= ed bleed off only a few feet above the threshold. During normal flight, I d= on't even get near a typical slow flight speed. Too many variables in a hom= e built airplane with no precise envelope, a header tank that is PROBABLY wh= ere I think it is, but could be off by 30 or 40 pounds if the gauge is stuck= ; possible extra wait in the tail area (water retention after heavy rain). >>=20 >> From: Lancair Mailing List [mailto:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Ed= Gray >> Sent: Tuesday, January 01, 2013 9:43 PM >> To: lml@lancaironline.net >> Subject: [LML] stalls >>=20 >> Colyn, As I said, AVOID STEEP TURNS IN THE PATTERN. If you are flying lo= w under the hood, I hope you have a well qualified safety pilot >> No virus found in this message. >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >> Version: 2013.0.2805 / Virus Database: 2637/5980 - Release Date: 12/23/12= >> Internal Virus Database is out of date. >>=20 >=20 --Apple-Mail-357A947F-ABD3-4F65-B3DA-8AD0D19A443C Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8
The Zlin and all lancairs h= ave in common one thing: you exceed the angle of attack vs lift and like oth= er airplanes they will stall, I guess there is nothing else in common....
It would be foolish to go solo and do stalls without instruction spe= cially in a IV-P with small wings, I practice stalls solo in the evo and the= IV ( I fly solo 90% of the time, who is going to help me?)

Sent from my iPad

On Jan 2, 2013, at 1:04 PM, Colyn Case <= ;colyncase@earthlink.net> w= rote:

aerodynamically= , I don't know what  a Lancair has in common with a Zlin.    = One thing it doesn't have is excess control authority.   I'm all in fav= or of stall recognition training but I wouldn't advocate everyone going out i= n their Lancair's solo and doing it....

On Jan 2, 2013, at= 9:45 AM, Andres Katz wrote:

Why not?
If you never stall the airpla= ne when it happens you won't be able to recognize what is doing and how to r= eact. Learning what your airplane does when it stalls and recovering from it= is essential to safe flight. In flying Acro we stall the airplane multiple t= imes, at low altitude and in front of ungrateful critical sobs that will lau= gh at you when you screw up but will give you good tips about recovering fro= m it. Every airplane stalls differently, right wing drop, left wing drop, bu= cking etc. learning what the airplane does pre stall is the most important. M= y ZLIN 50 is so nice it begins to buckle and bitch at me and tells me what I= need to do (lower the stick) before it kills me. I advise you to get a good= instructor and go to 10,000 feet and spend the best 2 hrs of your life stal= ling your airplane and getting to know her. It's 
Ike making l= ove to your wife and knowing when she is happy.....
Sorry about th= at but
My old savvy instructor when checking me out in single seat= airplanes always told me the same, go out to a safe altitude, stall the air= plane, learn when it does it look at the speed when it happens, add 10  = ;knots and come and land, it has never failed to get me down safely ie yak55= , Jungmeister, ZLIN, chipmunk etc.
My few cents worth of it. You w= ill live longer.

Sent from my iPad

On Jan 2, 2013, at 7= :15 AM, "David M. Powell CRFA" <sup= erdmp@sonic.net> wrote:

I have made the decision prior to p= urchasing to avoid stalls=20 altogether in my 360.  After reading the stall and stall spin accident=20= information, I just don't think it's worth the risk.  On take-off, I st= ay=20 in ground effect for the half second it takes to make it into the green afte= r=20 wheels up; on landing, I approach well above stall for my flap configuration= ,=20 and let the speed bleed off only a few feet above the threshold.  Durin= g=20 normal flight, I don't even get near a typical slow flight speed.  Too m= any=20 variables in a home built airplane with no precise envelope, a header t= ank=20 that is PROBABLY where I think it is, but could be off by 30 or 40 pounds if= the=20 gauge is stuck; possible extra wait in the tail area (water retention after=20= heavy rain).

From: Lancair Mailing List=20 [mailto:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Ed Gray
Sent:=20= Tuesday, January 01, 2013 9:43 PM
To:=20 lml@lancaironline.net
Sub= ject: [LML] stalls

Colyn, As I said, AVOID STEEP=20 TURNS IN THE PATTERN.  If you are flying low under the hood, I hope you= =20 have a well qualified  safety pilot

<= p align=3D"left" color=3D"#000000" avgcert??=3D"">No virus found in this=20 message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com=
Version: 2013.0.2805 / Virus=20 Database: 2637/5980 - Release Date: 12/23/12
Internal Virus Database is o= ut=20 of date.


= --Apple-Mail-357A947F-ABD3-4F65-B3DA-8AD0D19A443C--