X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2012 11:16:32 -0400 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from [205.186.160.203] (HELO server.rmcginc.com) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.4.6) with ESMTPS id 5655712 for lml@lancaironline.net; Tue, 17 Jul 2012 11:08:02 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=205.186.160.203; envelope-from=r.rickard@rcginc-us.com Received: (qmail 24452 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2012 08:07:27 -0700 Received: from ip70-162-225-148.ph.ph.cox.net (HELO ?192.168.1.103?) (70.162.225.148) by rmcomserver.com with SMTP; 17 Jul 2012 08:07:27 -0700 Subject: Re: [LML] Re: Experimental TCAS system? References: From: Bob Rickard Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-21B91B64-D861-4B6D-A4B5-22731C79C3F7 X-Mailer: iPad Mail (9B206) In-Reply-To: X-Original-Message-Id: <05763DC5-8C1C-4FD4-A5FD-BB029F5EDE64@rcginc-us.com> X-Original-Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2012 08:07:27 -0700 X-Original-To: Lancair Mailing List Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) --Apple-Mail-21B91B64-D861-4B6D-A4B5-22731C79C3F7 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Look up ADS-B on Wikipedia. The system works by communicating directly with= other ADS B units for traffic as well as displaying the "system" traffic an= d other information. An excerpt: Safety ADS-B makes flying significantly safer for the aviation community. When usin= g this system both pilots and controllers will see the same radar picture. W= ith past systems such as the Traffic Alert and Collision Avoidance System (T= CAS) aircraft could only see other aircraft equipped with the same technolog= y. With ADS-B, information is sent to aircraft using ADS-B In, which display= s all aircraft in the area, even those not equipped with ADS-B technology. [edit]New services Traffic - When using an ADS-B In system a pilot is able to pull up traffic i= nformation on surrounding aircraft. This information includes altitude, head= ing, speed, and distance to aircraft. Weather - Aircraft equipped with UAT ADS-B In technology will be able to rec= eive weather reports, and weather radar through Flight Information Service-B= roadcast (FIS-B). Terrain - ADS-B In technology, broadcasts a terrain overlay for pilots to vi= ew in the cockpit. Flight information - Not to be confused with FIS-B, Traffic Information Serv= ice-Broadcast (TIS-B) transmits readable flight information such as TFRs and= NOTAMs to aircraft equipped with either UAT or 1090 Squitter ADS-B systems.= Recommend getting smart on this (and finding out where the current weather d= ata is available, it's not conus wide yet) before spending a bucket of cash o= n a "legacy" system. Bob R On Jul 16, 2012, at 9:23 AM, Colyn Case wrote: > Scott, >=20 > Do I understand correctly that ADS-B traffic information comes via a groun= d station somewhere? How does that actually perform when you are in a val= ley somewhere? >=20 > I used to have TIS-B. I loved it when and where it worked but there were e= nough discrepancies + the fact that you had to have line of sight to the Rad= ar facility that I was really enthusiastic about getting my ryan 9900BX. T= he very best thing about TIS-B is that it showed me how much traffic I wasn'= t seeing. However, the delay and coverage issues are real. One incident= I had, I was at the range limit of the Sacramento facility when I saw a bli= p at less than two miles 10 O'clock. I looked up and there was a mooney he= aded straight at me. I dove to the right and no sooner than he had passed m= y tail, he disappeared off the screen. If I had been a mile further south I= never would have seen him. Another incident: as I was going into Palo Alt= o I had several targets coming up at me. One was 12 O'clock and reported as= 300' below me and climbing. I was about to climb when I spotted it alread= y above me. That is where the delay was really a problem. >=20 > Dico, >=20 > IMO in a IVP you will be very happy to have an active system like the avid= yne TAS 600 or 605. The former is only $8490 and you can install it yourse= lf. The latter list is a little over $10,000. (You can probably find it c= heaper....or you can find someone who is gaga over ADS-B and make them an of= fer....) You'll find it works much more reliably, regardless of geography= and doesn't have the delay of going through a ground station. > The 600 gives you coverage up to 18,500 above which you have radar separat= ion because you will be IFR. >=20 > http://www.avidyne.com/products/tas600/index.asp > http://www.avidyne.com/downloads/brochures/AV645_Retail_PL.pdf >=20 > Colyn >=20 >=20 > On Jul 16, 2012, at 10:09 AM, Sky2high@aol.com wrote: >=20 > Dico, > =20 > For the present and future, consider ADS-B. > =20 > Here is an example: > =20 > http://skyvisionxtreme.com/ > =20 > Scott Krueger > =20 > In a message dated 7/16/2012 7:13:32 A.M. Central Daylight Time, dico@inte= rnetworks.ca writes: > Hello All, >=20 > Is there a good TCAS system available for our experimental airplanes. I r= eally like the skywatch systems with the 2 antennas.. however with the price= s $10k - $15k, its pretty crazy high. The Zaon systems are a bit to far on t= he other end of the scale and have deadspots. Does anyone know of other goo= d systems -- or if systems for experimental planes are being developed? Or p= erhaps were we could get one from a written off Cirrus or something that had= a system? >=20 > Thanks, >=20 > Dico >=20 --Apple-Mail-21B91B64-D861-4B6D-A4B5-22731C79C3F7 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8
Look up ADS-B on Wikipedia= .  The system works by communicating directly with other ADS B units fo= r traffic as well as displaying the "system" traffic and other information. &= nbsp;An excerpt:


Safety

ADS-B makes flying significantly safer fo= r the aviation community. When using this system both pilots and controllers= will see the same radar picture. With past systems such as the Traffic Aler= t and Collision Avoidance System (TCAS) aircraft could only see other aircra= ft equipped with the same technology. With ADS-B, information is sent to air= craft using ADS-B In, which displays all aircraft in the area, even those no= t equipped with ADS-B technology.

<= span class=3D"editsection" style=3D"-webkit-user-select: none; float: right;= font-weight: normal; margin-left: 5px; ">[edit]New services

    =
  1. Traffic - When using an ADS-B In system= a pilot is able to pull up traffic information on surrounding aircraft. Thi= s information includes altitude, heading, speed, and distance to aircraft.
  2. Weather - Aircraft equipped with UAT= ADS-B In technology will be able to receive weather reports, and weather ra= dar through Flight Information Service-Broadcast (FIS-B).
  3. Terrain - ADS-B In technology, broadcasts a terrain o= verlay for pilots to view in the cockpit.
  4. Flight information - Not to be confused with FIS-B, Traffic Informati= on Service-Broadcast (TIS-B) transmits readable flight information such as T= FRs and NOTAMs to aircraft equipped with either UAT or 1090 Squitter ADS-B s= ystems.

Recommend getting smart on this (and fi= nding out where the current weather data is available, it's not conus wide y= et) before spending a bucket of cash on a "legacy" system.

Bob R


On Jul 16, 2012, at 9:23 AM, Colyn Cas= e <colyncase@earthlink.net= > wrote:

Scott,
Do I understand correctly that ADS-B traffic information co= mes via a ground station somewhere?    How does that actually perf= orm when you are in a valley somewhere?

I used to h= ave TIS-B.  I loved it when and where it worked but there were enough d= iscrepancies + the fact that you had to have line of sight to the Radar faci= lity that I was really enthusiastic about getting my ryan 9900BX.   The= very best thing about TIS-B is that it showed me how much traffic I wasn't s= eeing.   However, the delay and coverage issues are real.    = One incident I had, I was at the range limit of the Sacramento facility when= I saw a blip at less than two miles 10 O'clock.   I looked up and ther= e was a mooney headed straight at me.  I dove to the right and no soone= r than he had passed my tail, he disappeared off the screen.   If I had= been a mile further south I never would have seen him.   Another incid= ent: as I was going into Palo Alto I had several targets coming up at me. &n= bsp;One was 12 O'clock and reported as 300' below me and climbing.   I w= as about to climb when I spotted it already above me.  That is where th= e delay was really a problem.

Dico,

<= /div>
IMO in a IVP you will be very happy to have an active system like t= he avidyne TAS 600 or 605.   The former is only $8490 and you can insta= ll it yourself.   The latter list is a little over $10,000.  (You c= an probably find it cheaper....or you can find someone who is gaga over ADS-= B and make them an offer....)   You'll find it works much more reliably= ,  regardless of geography and doesn't have the delay of going through a= ground station.
The 600 gives you coverage up to 18,500 above whi= ch you have radar separation because you will be IFR.

http://www.a= vidyne.com/products/tas600/index.asp

Colyn


On Jul 16, 2012, at 10:09 AM, <= a href=3D"mailto:Sky2high@aol.com">Sky2high@aol.com wrote:

Dico,
 
For the present and future, consider ADS-B.
 
Here is an example:
 
 
Scott Krueger
 
In a message dated 7/16/2012 7:13:32 A.M. Central Daylight Time,=20 dico@internetworks.ca writes:
Hello=20 All,

Is there a good TCAS system available for our experimental=20 airplanes.  I really like the skywatch systems with the 2 antennas..=20= however with the prices $10k - $15k, its pretty crazy high.  The Zaon= =20 systems are a bit to far on the other end of the scale and have=20 deadspots.  Does anyone know of other good systems -- or if systems f= or=20 experimental planes are being developed?  Or perhaps were we could ge= t=20 one from a written off Cirrus or something that had a=20 system?

Thanks,

Dico

= --Apple-Mail-21B91B64-D861-4B6D-A4B5-22731C79C3F7--