Return-Path: Received: from mail.tsisp.com ([65.23.108.44] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.2b8) with ESMTP-TLS id 321266 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 14 Jul 2004 12:25:43 -0400 Received-SPF: error receiver=logan.com; client-ip=65.23.108.44; envelope-from=steve@tsisp.com Received: from stevehome by mail.tsisp.com (Technical Support Inc.) with SMTP id CQA74584 for ; Wed, 14 Jul 2004 12:25:07 -0400 Reply-To: From: "Steve Brooks" To: "'Rotary motors in aircraft'" Subject: RE: [FlyRotary] Re: New Scoop Date: Wed, 14 Jul 2004 12:27:03 -0400 Message-ID: <02a701c469bf$6619bf90$6400a8c0@WORKGROUP.local> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_02A8_01C4699D.DF081F90" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook CWS, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_02A8_01C4699D.DF081F90 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Kelly, I would tend to agree, but according to information I received from other on this group, I was told that the common practice was to measure the coolant at its hottest point, and oil at it’s coolest point. I don’t understand all of the reasons for this, but I guess as long as you know what the temperatures should be at a particular point, I guess that it really doesn’t matter too much. I’m really hoping that the new scoop solves the problem, and I can just start flying more. Steve -----Original Message----- From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]On Behalf Of keltro@att.net Sent: Wednesday, July 14, 2004 12:10 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: New Scoop Steve, I would be more interested in the coolent temp after the radiator just before entering the engine. FWIW Kelly Troyer -- Dyke Delta/13B/RD1C/EC2 -------------- Original message from "Steve Brooks" : -------------- > John, > > > Before that, the temps would climb up, what I think is too high, > especially the oil. > That's part of the point. Maybe you're expecting temps to be lower than they > need to be. Also - how accurately is you're gauge calibrated? (I calibrated > mine with hot wax, but I'm still not sure I really trust it within 10 > degrees or so.) I'm looking forward to getting my EM2, then I'll know better > whats going on. So far though, I think I'm within acceptible limits - I'm > not loosing any coolant and the engine keeps on running :) > > First let me say that my oil temperature is a digital display from Aerospace > Logic. Its' accuracy is +/- 1/2 degree, but would depend on the sensor. > Sensor is Westach made for aviation. Coolant is a VDO gauge and sensor. I > didn't verify accuracy of either one. > > I went to the airport this morning to fit the new scoop, and since the > visibility was pretty good, I decided to take the plane up since I hadn't > flown it since I put all off the mods back that gave me fairly decent > results. The OAT was 80F, and I took off from GRD elevation 600 MSL - > density alt was already 2200' I climbed to 2200 MSL with 5lbs of boost > (5300 RPM), leveled off, and pulled the throttle back to zero boost (4600 > RPM). Oil 190 and rising, coolant 200 and rising. Oil stabilized at 217F > and coolant went up to 225 after about 2 minutes or so. That's the highest > coolant temperature that I've seen in a long while. Throttled back to -10 > boost (4200 RPM), and temperatures stabilized at 215 Oil and 200 coolant. > > I throttle up a little bit to about -5 boost, and oil temp up to 217 coolant > about the same. Cruised at that throttle setting for about 5 minutes. > Everything pretty steady. Speed only about 120 kts. Didn't retract the > nose gear. > > When I throttled down to descend and land, the oil was 180 and coolant also > about 180. My temperature gauges seem to be tied to the throttle, which > tells me that I've not got sufficient cooling. > > Last time I flew I was getting a stabalized 205/210 in the climb > (coolant/oil). When I leveled off at 5000 it settled down to 185. At 11000 > it was lower until I opened the throttle, then it stabalized at 185. > > I'd be happy with those temps. I don't know what is different between the > tow set ups. My coolant sensor is in the water pump housing, and it has a > pretty long probe on it, so I have no doubt that it's in the coolant stream. > This point is just before the coolant goes to the radiator, so it is at the > hottest point. My oil sensor is in the top of the remote oil filter, mounted > to the PSRU mounting plate. I drilled and tapped a hole directly above the > tube that the filter screws onto. This probe isn't very long, but I tapped > it in as far as possible, and I ASSUME that it's in the oil flow. The oil > filter is after the oil cooler, and just before the oil re-enters the > engine, so it should be at the coolest point. > > Your oil coolers are set up differently. I'm using one of the 2nd gen, > where you are using 2 smaller ones. Your coolers sit in the side of the > plenum, where mine sits end-to-end with the radiator. The oil cooler is > closest to the scoop, so should be getting more air. > > > > I am curious about what your temperatures are running. What do you see in > > climb ? and what do you see in cruise ? > Climb - 205/200, 1400 EGT, 100kts, 1000fpm on a 90F day. > Cruise - 185/190, 1300 EGT, 178kts, 5150 rpm, 38 MAP 11,000 ft. > > Again, these temps looks very good to me. > > I'd be interested in other perspectives on this one. > Me too. > > > Steve Brooks ------=_NextPart_000_02A8_01C4699D.DF081F90 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Ke= lly,

I = would tend to agree, but according to information I received from other on = this group, I was told that the common practice was to measure the coolant at = its hottest point, and oil at it’s coolest point.  I don’t understand all of the reasons for this, = but I guess as long as you know what the temperatures should be at a particular = point, I guess that it really doesn’t matter too much.  I’m really hoping that the new scoop solves the = problem, and I can just start flying more.

 

St= eve

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Rotary motors in = aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]On Behalf Of keltro@att.net
Sent: Wednesday, July 14, = 2004 12:10 PM
To: Rotary motors in = aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: = New Scoop

 

Steve,<= /p>

  I would be more interested = in the coolent temp after the radiator just<= /p>

before entering the engine. = FWIW<= /p>

 <= /p>

Kelly Troyer<= /p>

--
Dyke Delta/13B/RD1C/EC2

<= /p>

-------------- Original message from "Steve Brooks" : --------------
> John,
>
> > Before that, the temps would climb up, what I think is too = high,
> especially the oil.
> That's part of the point. Maybe you're expecting temps to be lower = than they
> need to be. Also - how accurately is you're gauge calibrated? (I calibrated
> mine with hot wax, but I'm still not sure I really trust it within = 10
> degrees or so.) I'm looking forward to getting my EM2, then I'll = know better
> whats going on. So far though, I think I'm within acceptible limits = - I'm
> not loosing any coolant and the engine keeps on running :)
>
> First let me say that my oil temperature is a digital display from Aerospace
> Logic. Its' accuracy is +/- 1/2 degree, but would depend on the = sensor.
> Sensor is Westach made for aviation. Coolant is a VDO gauge and = sensor. I
> didn't verify accuracy of either one.
>
> I went to the airport this morning to fit the new scoop, and since = the
> visibility was pretty good, I decided to take the plane up since I = hadn't
> flown it since I put all off the mods back that gave me fairly = decent
> results. The OAT was 80F, and I took off from GRD elevation 600 MSL = -
> density alt was already 2200' I climbed to 2200 MSL with 5lbs of = boost
> (5300 RPM), leveled off, and pulled the throttle back to zero boost = (4600
> RPM). Oil 190 and rising, coolant 200 and rising. Oil stabilized at = 217F
> and coolant went up to 225 after about 2 minutes or so. That's the = highest
> coolant temperature that I've seen in a long while. Throttled back = to -10
> boost (4200 RPM), and temperatures stabilized at 215 Oil and 200 = coolant.
>
> I throttle up a little bit to about -5 boost, and oil temp up to = 217 coolant
> about the same. Cruised at that throttle setting for about 5 = minutes.
> Everything pretty steady. Speed only about 120 kts. Didn't retract = the
> nose gear.
>
> When I throttled down to descend and land, the oil was 180 and = coolant also
> about 180. My temperature gauges seem to be tied to the throttle, = which
> tells me that I've not got sufficient cooling.
>
> Last time I flew I was getting a stabalized 205/210 in the climb =
> (coolant/oil). When I leveled off at 5000 it settled down to 185. = At 11000
> it was lower until I opened the throttle, then it stabalized at = 185.
>
> I'd be happy with those temps. I don't know what is different = between the
> tow set ups. My coolant sensor is in the water pump housing, and it = has a
> pretty long probe on it, so I have no doubt that it's in the = coolant stream.
> This point is just before the coolant goes to the radiator, so it = is at the
> hottest point. My oil sensor is in the top of the remote oil = filter, mounted
> to the PSRU mounting plate. I drilled and tapped a hole directly = above the
> tube that the filter screws onto. This probe isn't very long, but I = tapped
> it in as far as possible, and I ASSUME that it's in the oil flow. = The oil
> filter is after the oil cooler, and just before the oil re-enters = the
> engine, so it should be at the coolest point.
>
> Your oil coolers are set up differently. I'm using one of the 2nd = gen,
> where you are using 2 smaller ones. Your coolers sit in the side of = the
> plenum, where mine sits end-to-end with the radiator. The oil = cooler is
> closest to the scoop, so should be getting more air.
>
>
> > I am curious about what your temperatures are running. What do = you see in
> > climb ? and what do you see in cruise ?
> Climb - 205/200, 1400 EGT, 100kts, 1000fpm on a 90F day.
> Cruise - 185/190, 1300 EGT, 178kts, 5150 rpm, 38 MAP 11,000 ft. =
>
> Again, these temps looks very good to me.
>
> I'd be interested in other perspectives on this one.
> Me too.
>
>
> Steve Brooks

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