X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com From: "Home" Received: from [209.235.141.1] (HELO mail101c7.megamailservers.com) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.1.14) with ESMTPS id 9365600 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Fri, 13 Jan 2017 09:09:48 -0500 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.235.141.1; envelope-from=hjjohnson@sasktel.net X-Authenticated-User: hjjohnson.sasktel.net X-VIP: 69.49.109.87 Received: from [10.10.70.53] (71-17-141-84.msjw.static.sasknet.sk.ca [71.17.141.84]) (authenticated bits=0) by mail101c7.megamailservers.com (8.14.9/8.13.1) with ESMTP id v0DE9SWH022040 for ; Fri, 13 Jan 2017 09:09:30 -0500 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-16062F59-D39A-4333-BC43-EBC98B3DE73B Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) Date: Fri, 13 Jan 2017 08:09:26 -0600 Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: What I'd do differently... or the same. Message-Id: <590799EA-2DD1-43D5-BB35-63264B2527FC@sasktel.net> References: In-Reply-To: To: Rotary motors in aircraft X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (14C92) X-CTCH-RefID: str=0001.0A020206.5878DF99.03F7,ss=1,re=0.000,recu=0.000,reip=0.000,cl=1,cld=1,fgs=0 X-CTCH-VOD: Unknown X-CTCH-Spam: Unknown X-CTCH-Score: 0.000 X-CTCH-Rules: X-CTCH-Flags: 0 X-CTCH-ScoreCust: 0.000 X-CSC: 0 X-CHA: v=2.2 cv=Zd1tDodA c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=9ji1m9vp4rDSZHPlsJdRDw==:117 a=9ji1m9vp4rDSZHPlsJdRDw==:17 a=Ia-xEzejAAAA:8 a=7g1VtSJxAAAA:8 a=LvaTSAIXMRhYH2T69AAA:9 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=Qa1je4BO31QA:10 a=1XWaLZrsAAAA:8 a=pa7DD8osN-gms7bbWzgA:9 a=4JX4MuuNPjRTXDaB:21 a=_W_S_7VecoQA:10 a=Urk15JJjZg1Xo0ryW_k8:22 a=grOzbf7U_OpcSX4AJOnl:22 a=nJcEw6yWrPvoIXZ49MH8:22 --Apple-Mail-16062F59-D39A-4333-BC43-EBC98B3DE73B Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Looks to me like it's what I'd call 'barn door' track? Generally a bit more r= obust vs the residential garage door track. It's a well build looking crane!= Fwiw Jarrett All grammar and spelling errors, compliments of my iPhone > On Jan 13, 2017, at 07:58, Charlie England w= rote: >=20 > Nice. Got a closer image of the trusses & track? Most garage door track he= re in the USA is basically C channel (more of a notched 0) that's typically= supported only on the ends. >=20 > Thanks, >=20 > Charlie=20 >=20 >> On Fri, Jan 13, 2017 at 3:08 AM, Nigel Baker wrote: >> When I built my workshop I knew I would need to lift stuff around and I=E2= =80=99m not getting any younger and like to be self-sufficient. >>=20 >> So I guess you mean something like attached. >>=20 >> I designed it for 250 KG which is plenty for my activities. >>=20 >> I used 250KG garage door track with good support for the spans. >>=20 >> The travelling beam spans 5.8 mts. >>=20 >> The electric hoist (250KG) was AUD$104.00 including postage. >>=20 >> All up I spent about AUD$600.00 building it 4 years ago so not that expen= sive. >>=20 >> Cheers. >>=20 >> Nige. >>=20 >> =20 >>=20 >> =20 >>=20 >> From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]=20 >> Sent: Friday, January 6, 2017 10:53 AM >> To: Rotary motors in aircraft >> Subject: [FlyRotary] What I'd do differently... or the same. >>=20 >> =20 >>=20 >> Yeah, this is a good topic because of that damn hindsight thing! >>=20 >> =20 >>=20 >> I already listed the one thing about the overhead crane or engine hoist, b= ut on another more practical note. I got my airplane in the air in 3 years f= rom knowing nothing about airplanes to choosing a kit, building (not a quick= build), designing and building an alternative engine FWF to first flight, th= en learning to fly. >>=20 >> It was all great fun at home in my shop where I could work on it every= spare minute. There was many very late nights where the creativity was comi= ng fast and furious and lots of times I'd wake up in the middle of the night= with a great idea and head to the shop. >>=20 >> Then I was in a hurry to move it to the airport. I hated working on it= out there. I could go on with a long list of reasons why, but it was hard t= o continue experimenting with it out there and I started regretting doing so= me things that I was otherwise glad that I tried. I tried to deny this to my= self and stay excited and positive about it all. >>=20 >> By the time that I took it home 2 years later, I was not really inter= ested in dealing with it. And since we had just bought the land across the r= oad, I had a new shop to build, barns to build, a kid to raise and a thousan= d other distractions, so that it took till now to get interested again.=20 >>=20 >> Fortunately, my wife only once made mention of selling it, but from my= reaction never mentioned it again, but I can see how so many projects get a= bandoned at this point. >>=20 >> =20 >>=20 >> So from that, what would I do differently? Hard to be sure since I didn'= t have the flight experience to make some different choices, but even an ext= ra year in the shop going at a little slower pace wouldn't have hurt. That o= ld saying about if you don't have time to do it right the first time, then w= hen are you going to find time to do it the second time, is even harder when= you are no longer in your well equipped shop while doing it the second time= . Now it's not like the workmanship is bad, when I say about doing it right,= but rather if some of our design choices are constrained by the amount of w= ork involved. Now I would rather do an almost unreasonable amount of work in= the comfort of my shop than almost anything in the field. I really enjoy bu= ilding at home, but when it's not at home I just want to fly it. >>=20 >> Previously I would cling to questionable half-baked ideas because of t= he time and money that I'd invested in it. That's not to say that half-baked= ideas are all bad, but now I'll be far more likely to move on and try somet= hing else regardless of time and money investment if I don't feel good about= something. >>=20 >> So when you're considering something like relocating a cooler and are c= ertain that it would improve performance but don't want to to do the work in= volved, just do it when you're still in a well equipped and convenient work s= pace. >>=20 >> And all you lucky SOB's that have an airstrip and hangar at home, you c= an disregard this advice. >>=20 >> I could fill several more posts about more specific items that I'd do dif= ferently but this was really the big picture and once again it may seem obvi= ous to many but that has been my experience. >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> Todd Bartrim >>=20 >> RV9 13Bturbo >>=20 >> =20 >>=20 >> Ps. I often get asked about how many hours are involved in building this p= lane. I just laugh and say I don't know or care. It doesn't matter. >>=20 >> Ernest Christley >>=20 >> 7:35 AM (7 hours ago) >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> to Rotary >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> George started us on a good topic. Building an airplane is an expensive a= nd labor intensive process. I've made many decisions where I didn't really l= ike something, but liked the prospect of the time and expense to change it e= ven less. Those things don't tend to get as much coverage in discussions as= what was actually done, even though there is a real lesson in what the pers= on who just did something wishes they'd done differently. >>=20 >> =20 >>=20 >> This thread could be renamed "What I'd done differently" >>=20 >> =20 >>=20 >> Another good one would be "What I'd do again" >>=20 >>=20 >> -- >> Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ >> Archive and UnSub: http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/Lis= t.html >>=20 >=20 --Apple-Mail-16062F59-D39A-4333-BC43-EBC98B3DE73B Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Looks to me like it's what I'd call 'b= arn door' track? Generally a bit more robust vs the residential garage door t= rack. It's a well build looking crane!
<= br>
Fwiw
Jarrett


All grammar and spe= lling errors, compliments of my iPhone

On Jan 13, 2017, at 07:= 58, Charlie England <flyro= tary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

Nice. Got a closer image of the trusses & track? M= ost garage door track here in the USA is basically C channel (more of a notc= hed 0)  that's typically supported only on the ends.

Thanks,

Charlie 

On Fri, Jan 13, 2017 at 3:08 AM, Ni= gel Baker <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

When I built my workshop I knew I would need to lift stuff a= round and I=E2=80=99m not getting any younger and like to be self-sufficient= .

So I guess yo= u mean something like attached.

I designed it for 250 KG which is plenty for my activities.=

I used 250KG g= arage door track with good support for the spans.

The travelling beam spans 5.8 mts.=

The electric hoist (2= 50KG) was AUD$104.00 including postage.

All up I spent about AUD$600.00 building it 4 years= ago so not that expensive.

<= span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;co= lor:#1f497d">Cheers.

Nige.

=  

&nbs= p;

From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net= ]
Sent: Friday, January 6, 2017 10:53 AM
To: Rotary mot= ors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Subject: [FlyRotary] W= hat I'd do differently... or the same.

 

Yeah, thi= s is a good topic because of that damn hindsight thing!

 

I already listed the one thing about the overhead crane or engin= e hoist, but on another more practical note. I got my airplane in the air in= 3 years from knowing nothing about airplanes to choosing a kit, building (n= ot a quickbuild), designing and building an alternative engine FWF to first f= light, then learning to fly.

   It was all great fun at home in my shop where I could work o= n it every spare minute. There was many very late nights where the creativit= y was coming fast and furious and lots of times I'd wake up in the middle of= the night with a great idea and head to the shop.

   Then I was in a hurry to move it to t= he airport. I hated working on it out there. I could go on with a long list o= f reasons why, but it was hard to continue experimenting with it out there a= nd I started regretting doing some things that I was otherwise glad that I t= ried. I tried to deny this to myself and stay excited and positive about it a= ll.

    By the t= ime that I took it home 2 years later, I was not really interested in dealin= g with it. And since we had just bought the land across the road, I had a ne= w shop to build, barns to build, a kid to raise and a thousand other distrac= tions, so that it took till now to get interested again. =

   Fortunately, my wife only= once made mention of selling it, but from my reaction never mentioned it ag= ain, but I can see how so many projects get abandoned at this point.<= u>

  

 So from that, what would I do differen= tly? Hard to be sure since I didn't have the flight experience to make some d= ifferent choices, but even an extra year in the shop going at a little slowe= r pace wouldn't have hurt. That old saying about if you don't have time to d= o it right the first time, then when are you going to find time to do it the= second time, is even harder when you are no longer in your well equipped sh= op while doing it the second time. Now it's not like the workmanship is bad,= when I say about doing it right, but rather if some of our design choices a= re constrained by the amount of work involved. Now I would rather do an almo= st unreasonable amount of work in the comfort of my shop than almost anythin= g in the field. I really enjoy building at home, but when it's not at home I= just want to fly it.

&nb= sp;  Previously I would cling to questionable half-baked ideas because o= f the time and money that I'd invested in it. That's not to say that half-ba= ked ideas are all bad, but now I'll be far more likely to move on and try so= mething else regardless of time and money investment if I don't feel good ab= out something.

  &nb= sp;So when you're considering something like relocating a cooler and are cer= tain that it would improve performance but don't want to to do the work invo= lved, just do it when you're still in a well equipped and convenient work sp= ace.

   And all= you lucky SOB's that have an airstrip and hangar at home, you can disregard= this advice.

I could fil= l several more posts about more specific items that I'd do differently but t= his was really the big picture and once again it may seem obvious to many bu= t that has been my experience.


T= odd Bartrim

RV9 13Bturbo<= u>

 

<= /div>

Ps. I often get asked about how many hours a= re involved in building this plane. I just laugh and say I don't know or car= e. It doesn't matter.

Ernest Christley

7:35 AM (7 hours ago)

to = = Rotary

=

George started us on a good topic.  Building an air= plane is an expensive and labor intensive process.  I've made many deci= sions where I didn't really like something, but liked the prospect of the ti= me and expense to change it even less.  Those things don't tend to get a= s much coverage in discussions as what was actually done, even though there i= s a real lesson in what the person who just did something wishes they'd done= differently.

 

This thread could be renamed "What I'd done differently"<= u>

&nbs= p;

Another g= ood one would be "What I'd do again"


--
Homepage:  http://www.flyrotary.com/
Archive and UnSub:   http://mail.l= ancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html


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