X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com From: "Neil Unger" Received: from nsstlmta07p.bpe.bigpond.com ([203.38.21.7] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.1.13) with ESMTPS id 9245799 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 07 Dec 2016 17:04:04 -0500 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=203.38.21.7; envelope-from=unger1948@bigpond.com Received: from smtp.telstra.com ([10.10.24.4]) by nsstlfep07p-svc.bpe.nexus.telstra.com.au with ESMTP id <20161207220342.ICJU4466.nsstlfep07p-svc.bpe.nexus.telstra.com.au@smtp.telstra.com> for ; Thu, 8 Dec 2016 09:03:42 +1100 X-RG-Spam: Unknown X-Junkmail-Premium-Raw: score=10/50,refid=2.7.2:2016.12.7.213315:17:10.433,ip=,rules=__BOUNCE_CHALLENGE_SUBJ, __BOUNCE_NDR_SUBJ_EXEMPT, __SUBJ_ALPHA_END, __TO_MALFORMED_2, __TO_NAME, __TO_NAME_DIFF_FROM_ACC, __REFERENCES, __HAS_FROM, __FRAUD_WEBMAIL_FROM, __HAS_MSGID, __SANE_MSGID, __USER_AGENT, __MOZILLA_USER_AGENT, __MIME_VERSION, __IN_REP_TO, __CT, __CTYPE_MULTIPART_ALT, __CTYPE_HAS_BOUNDARY, __CTYPE_MULTIPART, __BAT_BOUNDARY, __TO_IN_SUBJECT2, __MIME_TEXT_P2, __MIME_TEXT_H2, __ANY_URI, __URI_WITH_PATH, URI_ENDS_IN_HTML, __STOCK_PHRASE_25, __CP_URI_IN_BODY, __INT_PROD_MOTORBIKE, __C230066_P2, __SUBJ_ALPHA_NEGATE, __MULTIPLE_URI_TEXT, __URI_IN_BODY, __HTML_AHREF_TAG, __HTML_FONT_BLUE, __FORWARDED_MSG, __HAS_HTML, __HTML_TAG_DIV, HTML_NO_HTTP, BODY_SIZE_10000_PLUS, BODYTEXTH_SIZE_3000_MORE, __MIME_TEXT_H1, __MIME_TEXT_P1, __MIME_HTML, __TAG_EXISTS_HTML, __STYLE_RATWARE_NEG, __URI_NS, HTML_50_70, __FRAUD_WEBMAIL, TO_IN_SUBJECT, IN_REP_TO, __MIME_TEXT_H, __MIME_TEXT_P, REFERENCES, NO_URI_HTTPS, MSG_THREAD, __TO_REAL_NAMES, LEGITIMATE_SIGNS, LEGITIMATE_NEGATE X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using ID unger1948@bigpond.com Received: from [10.0.0.136] (101.175.36.222) by smtp.telstra.com (9.0.019.11-1) (authenticated as unger1948@bigpond.com) id 58231D0903725A2A for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Thu, 8 Dec 2016 09:03:42 +1100 Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Gonna be a lean year or which way do I lean To: Rotary motors in aircraft References: Message-ID: <9dc6254b-7399-6b76-6f4f-8f7d12e530e6@bigpond.com> Date: Thu, 8 Dec 2016 09:03:07 +1100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.5.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------A15FDC3E9D6050F8F606FACE" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------A15FDC3E9D6050F8F606FACE Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Bobby, good reading, I have never seen these figures and hotter than I like, but they make the engine! Neil., On 12/8/2016 8:19 AM, Bobby J. Hughes wrote: > > Neil, > > I have seen 1800 F also but I think it was from an overly rich mixture > in the 11:0 range. I assumed it was excess fuel being burned in the > exhaust header. I have attached a couple of pages from Star Mazda that > I assume would be a near perfect tune. Although they run higher oil > and coolant temperatures and Racingbeat and other recommend. The last > page has the typical egt operating range for each rotor. > > Bobby > > *From:*Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] > *Sent:* Wednesday, December 07, 2016 3:33 PM > *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft > *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Re: Gonna be a lean year or which way do I lean > > Gents, Bobby, very interesting figures.Mine are somewhat different to > the extent that I have just ordered a fueltech ECU as it will self > tune on A/F and the drag racers tell me that the exhaust is cooler at > full power which I desperately need. I can get up to 1800 degrees > with egt's burning off. Currently running a microtech ECU which has > been good, but does not do what the fuel tech does and Microtech are > 'variable" with backup. Neil. > > On 12/8/2016 7:13 AM, Bobby J. Hughes wrote: > > Rich, > > A wideband O2 meter is your best friend. Get a PLX device O2 if > you don’t have one. It will support Wideband or Narrow Band > outputs to your EC3.It will shorten you tuning time and give you a > hard number to look at during tuning and flight operations. > > These are _my_ power settings and EGT’s. EGT location makes a big > difference. EGT numbers are ball park with probes located 2.5” > -3” from header. > > Take off Power – Target 12:7:1 F/A – EGT typically under 1675F at > 38”MP / 7000 rpm. > > Best Power – target 13.5:1 F/A –EGT’s typically under 1600F > below 30” MP > > Complete fuel burn– target 14:7:1 - Produces hottest EGT’s . I > have seen up to 1700 F+ at high power settings at less than 30” > MP so be careful. > > Lean operation with power loss – Target 15.8:1 or lower. Power > drops dramatically. I see EGT’s between 1475F and 1525 F depending > on engine rpm. > > Stay away from 14:7:1 F/A except for ground and low power flight. > > Bobby Hughes > > *From:*Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] > *Sent:* Wednesday, December 07, 2016 1:59 PM > *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft > *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Gonna be a lean year or which way do I lean > > Greetings fellow roteryophiles. > > I am about to overhaul my renesis and in an effort not to destroy > the thing, as I use it, I have a leaning question. > > It is normally aspirated with an RD1-C box > > Using Tracy's EC-3 (or is it the em or rc-- whatever) what is a > safe leaning procedure. > > Is it suggested to run these things LOP, ROP O(n)P or just go for > smoothness at any fuel burn? > > My understanding is to run the beast full throttle and control the > power output by the RPM (IVO prop--ughish) > > Of course my concern is with detonation and destruction of the > apex seals since they, at certain parts of the rotation, from my > reading, show a longer face to the chambers. > > Someone, please help me so I don't have to restrict my carnivorous > activities to "lean" meat. > > Thanks > > Rich > > > > -- > Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ > Archive and UnSub: http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html --------------A15FDC3E9D6050F8F606FACE Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

Bobby,  good reading, I have never seen these figures and hotter than I like, but they make the engine!  Neil.,


On 12/8/2016 8:19 AM, Bobby J. Hughes wrote:

Neil,

 

I have seen 1800 F also but I think it was from an overly rich mixture in the 11:0 range. I assumed it was excess fuel being burned in the exhaust header. I have attached a couple of pages from Star Mazda that I assume would be a near perfect tune. Although they run higher oil and coolant temperatures and Racingbeat and other recommend. The last page has the typical egt operating range for each rotor.

 

Bobby

 

From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]
Sent: Wednesday, December 07, 2016 3:33 PM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Gonna be a lean year or which way do I lean

 

Gents,  Bobby, very interesting figures.Mine are somewhat different to the extent that I have just ordered a fueltech ECU as it will self tune on A/F and the drag racers tell me that the exhaust is cooler at full power which I desperately need.  I can get up to 1800 degrees with egt's burning off.  Currently running a microtech ECU which has been good, but does not do what the fuel tech does and Microtech are 'variable" with backup.  Neil.

 

On 12/8/2016 7:13 AM, Bobby J. Hughes wrote:

 

Rich,

 

A wideband O2 meter is your best friend. Get a PLX device O2 if you don’t have one. It will support Wideband or Narrow Band outputs to your EC3.It will shorten you tuning time and give you a hard number to look at during tuning and flight operations.

 

These are my power settings and EGT’s. EGT location makes a big difference.  EGT numbers are ball park with probes located 2.5”  -3” from header.

 

 

Take off Power – Target 12:7:1 F/A – EGT  typically under 1675F at 38”MP / 7000 rpm.

Best Power – target 13.5:1  F/A –EGT’s typically under 1600F  below 30” MP

Complete fuel burn– target 14:7:1  - Produces hottest EGT’s . I have seen up to 1700 F+ at high power settings  at less than 30” MP so be careful.

Lean operation with power loss – Target 15.8:1 or lower. Power drops dramatically. I see EGT’s between 1475F and 1525 F depending on engine rpm.

 

Stay away from 14:7:1 F/A except for ground and low power flight.

 

Bobby Hughes

 

 

 

From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]
Sent: Wednesday, December 07, 2016 1:59 PM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Gonna be a lean year or which way do I lean

 

 

 

Greetings fellow roteryophiles.

 

I am about to overhaul my renesis and in an effort not to destroy the thing, as I use it, I have a leaning question.

 

It is normally aspirated with an RD1-C box

 

Using Tracy's EC-3 (or is it the em or rc-- whatever) what is a safe leaning procedure.

 

Is it suggested to run these things LOP, ROP O(n)P or just go for smoothness at any  fuel burn?

 

My understanding is to run the beast full throttle and control the power output by the RPM (IVO prop--ughish)

 

 

Of course my concern is with detonation and destruction of the apex seals since they, at certain parts of the rotation, from my reading, show a longer face to the chambers.

 

Someone, please help me so I don't have to restrict my carnivorous activities to "lean" meat.

 

Thanks

 

Rich 

 



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