X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com From: "William Jepson" Received: from mail-vk0-f47.google.com ([209.85.213.47] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.1.12) with ESMTPS id 9051882 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Thu, 20 Oct 2016 14:06:07 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.213.47; envelope-from=wrjjrs@gmail.com Received: by mail-vk0-f47.google.com with SMTP id q126so84499139vkd.2 for ; Thu, 20 Oct 2016 11:06:08 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=/2WrN0ozYQpDjdNMpzWmLRNolN+rz8yYJv4baCWrBhc=; b=DLRCy2M7r0e1zOy9aV1DEnuepHDEMd44y8h7fPYjNXyTAqSlolOI4T+87Ed04GQnaD A+i+M6RxkFXR3h9i4CZSh01jk65yag7JV8Zqm6IQvi5HyXYbe8GFipSQkLaB2VfMmBYt fXptA0zYaFhpwdc+q/+gfXCOSJsRKkurOJFuWwXo44cKt9kMaZbGxqapi4ClXMqyWdt8 GQonAejUv+RPDALkn2VH8oWufkE5w3ODjCfVV6YrnxyRIA53KohnJMFfT8GsY/SHPMyU Fwc1tQSlisaS2EI4TxOK7qZKxbXqX+y1RdXtfX9SNwGcGp//ZX20DtFnDk+qq3ctHqLM TktQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=/2WrN0ozYQpDjdNMpzWmLRNolN+rz8yYJv4baCWrBhc=; b=cKhmUchUBvlkP2WsJ67LNPn4qjGcqzu3Xmacj4pb6Y4s136HJ240EglsYPDo3abWnH zPmIvlNGeTiDXvlzHxfDq1KA6PJXEPYh2MaXjfmkQtrRzgUuzJL+UB7ePnLG6CAZpxt7 hxZ7EfMTuqm5NyaBfEREftpNJRmexXqTjdZRKNMfzj7Pbd8fZIyhbT7mqRKtVvfUR00X QtJK3s4c9+MBf0hGrZE9zCVdfRUSWKTommsbdrESGtWhpor8iXpS75FBVciyzs1lKD0+ igNDPnONsQUB1BCTntxeja8zUsATpi0RAHCctmoQdYsfXUbNJxpEh+p4OFKwe/Ezazw1 eoZQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AA6/9RlXXeFwXKOMc0pt1q3OiQNUhnrMbL/UVaJOaVf63Aw4NTtyW4Nc8KjedA0tb8mVBQIxeJ/zLXgEJiJMYg== X-Received: by 10.31.128.2 with SMTP id b2mr2664590vkd.81.1476986750617; Thu, 20 Oct 2016 11:05:50 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.103.81.201 with HTTP; Thu, 20 Oct 2016 11:05:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.103.81.201 with HTTP; Thu, 20 Oct 2016 11:05:49 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2016 11:05:49 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: [Flyrotary] Re: Just a bit of a update To: Rotary motors in aircraft Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a1142947a9bcce1053f4fc61e --001a1142947a9bcce1053f4fc61e Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I'm replying to a couple posts here so if I'm a bit disjointed bear with me. First, for Charlie. I have been working with Steve, at the location of the dyno frequently. Yes I obviously have heard the muffler first hand. It works great. I am glad there isn't a huge HP penalty! For Bobby, Mark's work was super he spoke to Steve and I on several occasions. His passing is very sad. With regard to the welded p-port. You can do it if you want but I won't fly behind it. Just too risky without post-weld heat treatment. A crack with any water pressure behind it will put water directly into the combustion chamber. Bill Jepson On Oct 20, 2016 8:37 AM, "Bobby J. Hughes" wrote: > I intended to say the =E2=80=9Cguy=E2=80=99s=E2=80=9D down under referrin= g to Neil and Christian. > I=E2=80=99m really happy to see the renewed development efforts for PSRU = options > and P-Port housings. Also enjoying the increased flyrotary list activity. > > > > Bobby > > > > *From:* Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] > *Sent:* Thursday, October 20, 2016 9:05 AM > *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft > *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Re: [Flyrotary] Re: Just a bit of a update > > > > Bill, > > If no sealant is used then I=E2=80=99m assuming the coolant passages are = not > totally blocked. Mark Steitle=E2=80=99s P-Port has about 150 hours with = the > inserts welded to the liner. Mark was an excellent welding and I=E2=80=99= m sure he > back purged to minimize crystallization. But who knows how long they wil= l > last and the failure mode. Small coolant leak, large coolant leak or apex > seal failure. At least with the 20B an apex seal failure is not likely to > stress the gearbox and should allow for a safe landing with a reasonable > smooth engine. Not so with 2 rotors. > > > > Any chance you guys will offer the p-port housing service to folks on thi= s > list? I=E2=80=99ve got another FWF renesis under slow development in the = garage. > Getting close to finishing up the plugs up oil pan and block off plate. T= he > exhaust headers and turbo are next and then the intake manifold. On the > fence about the p-port but I=E2=80=99m encouraged by all the effort and s= eemingly > positive results from your efforts and they guy down under. I=E2=80=99m = running > 7000 rpm / 38=E2=80=9D MP for takeoff with the super charger and cruise a= t 4800 =E2=80=93 > 5200 rpm / 28-32=E2=80=9D MP. P-Porting would probably allow for lower MP= for > takeoff and still normalize for cruise. > > > > Bobby > > RV10 \ Super Charged Renesis > > About 400 hobbs / 310 flight hours > > bhughes@qnsi.net > > > > > > *From:* Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net > ] > *Sent:* Monday, October 17, 2016 5:59 PM > *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft > *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Re: Just a bit of a update > > > > Charlie, > > Pardon my haste in the original reply. The butterflies are very similar t= o > the original, with the exception that we have devised a new way to make > them that doesn't require drilling through the housings. Can't say more > right now other than we do NOT use epoxy in the housings and NO sealing > problems. Don't expect any. Also we DO NOT weld to the liner as sometimes > pushed by others. I do not believe you can weld to the liner without > catastrophic failure later. I believe you will either fail your apex seal= s > or crack the weld due to crystallization of the steel. The muffler is a > MAJOR win. It is quieter than a unmuffled Lyc, and successfully kills the > annoying hi frequencies. It is more restrictive than some but only costs = us > a few HP. It also fits in an RV-3! I am experimenting with a larger versi= on > in hopes of repeating the success with a bit less restriction on cowls th= at > aren't as tight as the RV-3 > > Bill > > > > On Mon, Oct 17, 2016 at 3:15 PM, Charlie England < > flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote: > > Hi Bill, > > > > Thanks for the link. I've been following it on the Homebuilt Airplanes > forum; are you 'billsrv4' over there? > > > > I've been trying to find a throttle mechanism in the video, but don't see > one. Are they using the custom 'in the housing' butterflies, like the > original Powersport engine? > > > > Have you heard it run in person? If so, does the muffler work as well as > it seems to in the video? (Hard to know how much the audio is clipped in > level on a recording.) > > > > Thanks, > > > > Charlie > > > > On Mon, Oct 17, 2016 at 4:52 PM, William Jepson < > flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote: > > Since it has been so quiet thought I would make some noise. > > Try this package on for size. > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DEfreUJt-Fsk. > > Think you will find it interesting. > > Bill > > > > > --001a1142947a9bcce1053f4fc61e Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I'm replying to a couple posts here so if I'm a bit = disjointed bear with me. First, for Charlie. I have been working with Steve= , at the location of the dyno frequently. Yes I obviously have heard the mu= ffler first hand. It works great. I am glad there isn't a huge HP penal= ty! For Bobby, Mark's work was super he spoke to Steve and I on several= occasions. His passing is very sad. With regard to the welded p-port. You = can do it if you want but I won't fly behind it. Just too risky without= post-weld heat treatment. A crack with any water pressure behind it will p= ut water directly into the combustion chamber.

Bill Jepson


On Oct 20, 2016 8= :37 AM, "Bobby J. Hughes" <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

I intended to say the =E2=80=9Cguy=E2= =80=99s=E2=80=9D down under referring to Neil and Christian.=C2=A0 I=E2=80= =99m really happy to see the renewed development efforts for PSRU options a= nd P-Port housings. Also enjoying the increased flyrotary list activity.

=C2=A0

Bobby

=C2=A0

From: Rotary motors in aircraft [ma= ilto:flyro= tary@lancaironline.net]
Sent: Thursday, October 20, 201= 6 9:05 AM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRo= tary] Re: [Flyrotary] Re: Just a bit of a update

=C2=A0

Bill,

If no sealant is used then I=E2=80=99m= assuming the coolant passages are not totally blocked.=C2=A0 Mark Steitle= =E2=80=99s P-Port has about 150 hours with the inserts welded to the liner.= Mark was an excellent welding and I=E2=80=99m sure he back purged =C2=A0to= minimize crystallization. But who knows how long they will last and the fa= ilure mode. Small coolant leak, large coolant leak or apex seal failure. At= least with the 20B an apex seal failure is not likely to stress the gearbo= x and should allow for a safe landing with a reasonable smooth engine. Not = so with 2 rotors. =C2=A0

=C2=A0

Any chance you guys will offer the p-port hou= sing service to folks on this list? I=E2=80=99ve got another FWF renesis un= der slow development in the garage. Getting close to finishing up the plugs= up oil pan and block off plate. The exhaust headers and =C2=A0turbo are ne= xt and then the intake manifold. On the fence about the p-port but I=E2=80= =99m encouraged by all the effort and seemingly positive results from your = efforts and they guy down under.=C2=A0 I=E2=80=99m running 7000 rpm / 38=E2= =80=9D MP for takeoff with the super charger and cruise at 4800 =E2=80=93 5= 200 rpm / 28-32=E2=80=9D MP. P-Porting would probably allow for lower MP fo= r takeoff and still normalize for cruise.

=C2=A0

Bobby<= /p>

RV10 \ Super Charged R= enesis

About 400 hobbs / 310 flight hours

bhughes@qnsi.net

=C2=A0

=C2=A0=

From: Rota= ry motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]
Sent: = Monday, October 17, 2016 5:59 PM
To: Rotary motors in aircraftSubject: [FlyRotary] Re: Just a bit of a update

=C2=A0

Charlie,

Pardon my haste = in the original reply. The butterflies are very similar to the original, wi= th the exception that we have devised a new way to make them that doesn'= ;t require drilling through the housings. Can't say more right now othe= r than we do NOT use epoxy in the housings and NO sealing problems. Don'= ;t expect any. Also we DO NOT weld to the liner as sometimes pushed by othe= rs. I do not believe you can weld to the liner without catastrophic failure= later. I believe you will either fail your apex seals or crack the weld du= e to crystallization of the steel. The muffler is a MAJOR win. It is quiete= r than a unmuffled Lyc, and successfully kills the annoying hi frequencies.= It is more restrictive than some but only costs us a few HP. It also fits = in an RV-3! I am experimenting with a larger version in hopes of repeating = the success with a bit less restriction on cowls that aren't as tight a= s the RV-3

Bill

=C2=A0

On Mon, Oct 17, 2016 at 3:15 PM, Charlie England = <flyrot= ary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

Hi Bill,

=C2=A0<= u>

Thanks for the link. I've b= een following it on the Homebuilt Airplanes forum; are you 'billsrv4= 9; over there?

= =C2=A0

I've been trying to = find a throttle mechanism in the video, but don't see one. Are they usi= ng the custom 'in the housing' butterflies, like the original Power= sport engine?=C2=A0

<= /u>=C2=A0

Have you heard it run= in person? If so, does the muffler work as well as it seems to in the vide= o? (Hard to know how much the audio is clipped in level on a recording.)=

=C2=A0

Thanks,

=C2=A0

C= harlie

<= u>=C2=A0

On Mon, Oct 17, 2016 at = 4:52 PM, William Jepson <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:<= /p>

Since it has been so quiet thought I would m= ake some noise.

Try this packa= ge on for size.

=C2=A0<= span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-s= erif";color:#417394;background:#fafafa">https://www.youtube.com/w= atch?v=3DEfreUJt-FskThink you will find it interesting.

Bill

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

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