X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com From: "Stephen Izett" Received: from mail-pa0-f54.google.com ([209.85.220.54] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.1.8) with ESMTPS id 8390205 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Mon, 08 Feb 2016 09:08:34 -0500 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.220.54; envelope-from=steveize@gmail.com Received: by mail-pa0-f54.google.com with SMTP id ho8so74234148pac.2 for ; Mon, 08 Feb 2016 06:08:33 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=from:content-type:message-id:mime-version:subject:date:references :to:in-reply-to; bh=3ILpXxBTaC5C6GPUXs/EntNECmorMgSZAYPFfQgeqIM=; b=cxMzXutPCpM3/Ao+z3ndXGgpZTddSj8dMl9yHqQtguhuW9Anhf2a+Y9RxYy/scQXuY ffiKrPsTefPcXZqlvRXKDbVov3begBpetHADikUeN0XLwMAEk14fjyCQxJgU10UcZfnR rdOLI/YFQ+qgOB5g2Qm3ufWLnULWJl9sp/8mVTe3hJQvFsV3Bx//esj1n/f8RJkT0GIm feqJv5hYeInukiutKeUZIBvNS5b71rDBKjxpSsRod+a/XKHGXoP4mt3XVznFb6G7/fWh rGEvdH6zrhJK9D9B4SH8zpXZGaz+JqcvDQm8tpvahvBinNwMZZizEBiY8aS7OTVmKuS4 vy6g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:from:content-type:message-id:mime-version :subject:date:references:to:in-reply-to; bh=3ILpXxBTaC5C6GPUXs/EntNECmorMgSZAYPFfQgeqIM=; b=HwSfIqXMkSDFNnWiSlERtLgrWHcTVkF5eQhhixiFbCr1kNw2IsIP8OCTzA4s1wXbnm wYc6kelZg5ym08P0Mdfg+MOJsmk0wSQQG/NBANizCFZia66AkoOP2i8GYWlVfSZsrYJO Ny7CTKBM1NWpR3G3pw4X/MhL0C5vp1rbU6BcNiTzZTIbFRbO98tzbDBBR6wxbGlNbSvV yawRe5AwZmYePh/ScFZR9ZTh0ugPCrU4rnyecn/b/4S20ofR714yywsQarVfFFQ/Q1/T lxvc4fz0V5Ya0s8hFAuW29vMwTHlHsCjHAEnnDS8tOmJSlhnPk8esUn0jdIDE/xkkOFL FHXQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AG10YORWNGnd+NWav67/g8R5/3gIHeKfu59+5TjFY18yHzdymK8VOceaax9mrAa6Z+ZBNA== X-Received: by 10.66.100.163 with SMTP id ez3mr42634544pab.5.1454940495742; Mon, 08 Feb 2016 06:08:15 -0800 (PST) Return-Path: Received: from [10.1.1.5] (125-209-177-208.dyn.iinet.net.au. [125.209.177.208]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id cf6sm43851571pad.41.2016.02.08.06.08.11 for (version=TLS1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128/128); Mon, 08 Feb 2016 06:08:14 -0800 (PST) X-Google-Original-From: Stephen Izett Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_E23CA94D-3561-4BCB-BCF3-F00147176E5E" Message-Id: <9306B53B-82DC-49E0-8D56-3148A921A27A@icloud.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 9.2 \(3112\)) Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: [Flyrotary] Re: Testing Date: Mon, 8 Feb 2016 22:08:08 +0800 References: To: Rotary motors in aircraft In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3112) --Apple-Mail=_E23CA94D-3561-4BCB-BCF3-F00147176E5E Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Hi Bobby I can easily disconnect the dynon and test, so I=E2=80=99ll try this. I think I used the Dynon low voltage RPM input and I might change it to = the Standard Input. I=E2=80=99m not sure I understand your last sentence. Are you referring = to the EM3 Data Acquisition Modules count of Inj #1 used for Tach and = Fuel Flow calc. Steve > On 8 Feb 2016, at 8:36 PM, Bobby J. Hughes = wrote: >=20 > Steve, > =20 > Have you tried disconnecting the Dynon Tac signal lead from the = injector pulse to see if the EC3 reads correctly? Since both units are = showing the same rpm it=E2=80=99s possible the injector is being held = open by the Dynon. See Bill Schertz post from 2012. > Since the only connection between the EM3 screen and remote is serial = then I would assume the rpm pulse count is correct.=20 > =20 > Bill=E2=80=99s post > =20 > =E2=80=9CThe reason that I asked the question about idle on the = secondary injectors is that when I first started the engine, with a Blue = Mountain EFIS, I found that the engine ran very rich on the primaries, = which were preferred by the EC-2 at idle, but when I switched to the = secondary injectors the engine smoothed out. This led to the = investigation of why, since all my injectors were the same size. I then = found the problem with the BMA tach signal holding an injector open (or = causing it to close slowly) that was fixed with Tracy=E2=80=99s = recommendation of a 2K resistor in the line to limit the current draw = from the BMA. =20 > =20 > =20 > Bobby > =20 > =20 > From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net = ]=20 > Sent: Sunday, February 07, 2016 6:42 PM > To: Rotary motors in aircraft > Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: [Flyrotary] Re: Testing > =20 > Hi Bobby > At this stage the prop is not constant speed, just adjustable. > So I could do I similar thing. Choose an Rpm. > Why was the 2100 RPM at the prop chosen? Did you determine this to = provide=20 > =20 > Our EM3 RPM reading issue appears to be related to inj #1 signal as = the reading goes intermittent and low (from memory ~ 800 RPM) and the = Skyview suffering the same. > =20 > Steve > =20 > =20 > =20 > =20 > On 8 Feb 2016, at 3:14 AM, Bobby J. Hughes = > = wrote: > =20 > Steve, > Does your prop have a constant speed controller or is it strictly = manual operated? One or possibly two folks flying MT electric constant = speed controllers have reported an rpm difference between the selected = prop rpm and the actual engine rpm. Mine is very close. > =20 > Has anyone else had the EM3 read rpm incorrectly at high RPM?- My EM3 = screen sometimes shows the correct rpm and then NOP and alternates every = second or so. Reducing rpm seems to correct the issue. I suspect it=E2=80=99= s noise on the serial circuit. I plan to replace the serial wiring with = shield wire next time I have the panel out. My AFS EM show correct rpm = at all times and it reads the same injector pulse.=20 > =20 > One other thought regarding tuning for 7500 rpm. Initially I had a lot = of trouble tuning with the constant speed electric prop. Tracy recommend = I run up full power, adjust the prop for 2100 rpm, lock it in manual = mode and tune at this condition. This made tuning easier since I = wasn=E2=80=99t chasing the changing prop loads. If your prop controller = is manual only then you may not encounter the same difficulties.=20 > =20 > =20 > Bobby > =20 > From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net = ]=20 > Sent: Sunday, February 07, 2016 9:58 AM > To: Rotary motors in aircraft > Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Testing > =20 > Hi Bobby > It's an Electric 3 blade Aerotek from New Zealand. > Steve > =20 > =20 > =20 > =20 > On 7 Feb 2016, at 10:31 PM, Bobby J. Hughes = > = wrote: > =20 > Steve, > =20 > What prop do you have?=20 > =20 > Bobby > =20 > From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net = ]=20 > Sent: Saturday, February 06, 2016 4:14 AM > To: Rotary motors in aircraft > Subject: [FlyRotary] Testing > =20 > Hi Guys > =20 > In order to extend ground testing and tuning of the engine in 35+C = (95+F) I rigged some water spray onto the water exchanger. > Water temps now stay below 150F even at high load, and to my surprise = Oil temps stayed below 180F (I thought I might have to spray water on = the Oil Exchanger but not required) > =20 > I reduced the pitch of the prop to allow a static rpm of approaching = 7500rpm and without much missing she spun up OK. > I feel like Im starting to get familiar with the EC2 now and between = MODE 2 and 3 and just manual mixture adjustments she runs from idle to = 7+K alright. > =20 > One observation is that at around 6-7K RPM both the Dynon Skyview as = well as the EM3 fail to read the RPM correctly. > Now they are both taking their sensing from Injector 1.=20 > The EC2 of course gets its trigger signal from the Renesis CAS=E2=80=99s= (main and backup) and there is a mod on the back of the EC2 board that = I took was conditioning of the CAS signals. > Has anyone else had the EM3 read rpm incorrectly at high RPM? > =20 > After balancing our prop, I=E2=80=99m hoping to begin playing with the = EC2=E2=80=99s closed loop mode, and then Timing with new BR10EIX plugs. > =20 > Thanks again Tracy for your gearbox and EC. > =20 > Cheers > Steve Izett --Apple-Mail=_E23CA94D-3561-4BCB-BCF3-F00147176E5E Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Hi Bobby
I can easily disconnect the dynon and = test, so I=E2=80=99ll try this.
I think I used the = Dynon low voltage RPM input and I might change it to the Standard = Input.
I=E2=80=99m not sure I understand your last = sentence. Are you referring to the EM3 Data Acquisition Modules count of = Inj #1 used for Tach and Fuel Flow calc.
Steve
On = 8 Feb 2016, at 8:36 PM, Bobby J. Hughes <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

Steve,
 
Have you tried = disconnecting the Dynon Tac signal lead from the injector pulse to see = if the EC3 reads correctly? Since both units are showing the same rpm = it=E2=80=99s possible the injector is being held open by the Dynon. See = Bill Schertz post from 2012.
Since the only connection between the EM3 screen and remote = is serial then I would assume the rpm pulse count is correct. 
 
Bill=E2=80=99s post
 
=E2=80=9CThe = reason that I asked the question about idle on the secondary injectors = is that when I first started the engine, with a Blue Mountain EFIS, I = found that the engine ran very rich on the primaries, which were = preferred by the EC-2 at idle, but when I switched to the secondary = injectors the engine smoothed out. This led to the investigation of why, = since all my injectors were the same size. I then found the problem with = the BMA tach signal holding an injector open (or causing it to close = slowly) that was fixed with Tracy=E2=80=99s recommendation of a 2K = resistor in the line to limit the current draw from the BMA.  
 
 
Bobby
 
 
From: Rotary = motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] 
Sent: Sunday, February 07, 2016 = 6:42 PM
To: Rotary motors in = aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: [Flyrotary] = Re: Testing
 
Hi Bobby
At this stage the = prop is not constant speed, just adjustable.
So I could do I similar thing. Choose an Rpm.
Why was the 2100 RPM at the prop chosen? Did you determine = this to provide 
 
Our EM3 RPM reading issue appears to be related to = inj #1 signal as the reading goes intermittent and low (from memory ~ = 800 RPM) and the Skyview suffering the same.
 
Steve
 
 
 
 
On 8 = Feb 2016, at 3:14 AM, Bobby J. Hughes <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:
 
Steve,
Does your prop have a constant speed = controller or is it strictly manual operated? One or possibly two folks = flying MT electric constant speed controllers have reported an rpm = difference between the selected prop rpm and the actual engine rpm. Mine = is very close.
 
Has anyone else had the EM3 read rpm incorrectly at high = RPM?- My EM3 screen sometimes = shows the correct rpm and then NOP and alternates every second or so. = Reducing rpm seems to correct the issue. I suspect it=E2=80=99s noise on = the serial circuit. I plan to replace the serial wiring with shield wire = next time I have the panel out. My AFS EM show correct rpm at all times = and it reads the same injector pulse. 
 
One other thought = regarding tuning for 7500 rpm. Initially I had a lot of trouble tuning = with the constant speed electric prop. Tracy recommend I run up full = power,  adjust the prop for 2100 rpm, lock it in manual mode and = tune at this condition. This made tuning easier since I wasn=E2=80=99t = chasing the changing prop loads. If your prop controller is manual only = then you may not encounter the same difficulties. 
 
 
Bobby
 
From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] 
Sent: Sunday, February 07, 2016 = 9:58 AM
To: Rotary motors in = aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: = Testing
 
Hi Bobby
It's an Electric =  3 blade Aerotek from New Zealand.
Steve
 
 
 
 
On 7 = Feb 2016, at 10:31 PM, Bobby J. Hughes <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:
 
Steve,
 
What prop do you have? 
 
Bobby
 
From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] 
Sent: Saturday, February 06, 2016 = 4:14 AM
To: Rotary motors in = aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] = Testing
 
Hi = Guys
 
In order to extend ground testing and tuning of the engine in = 35+C (95+F) I rigged some water spray onto the water exchanger.
Water = temps now stay below 150F even at high load, and to my surprise Oil = temps stayed below 180F (I thought I might have to spray water on the = Oil Exchanger but not required)
 
I reduced the pitch of the prop to allow a static rpm of = approaching 7500rpm and without much missing she spun up OK.
I = feel like Im starting to get familiar with the EC2 now and between MODE = 2 and 3 and just manual mixture adjustments she runs from idle to 7+K = alright.
 
One observation is that at around 6-7K RPM both the Dynon = Skyview as well as the EM3 fail to read the RPM correctly.
Now = they are both taking their sensing from Injector 1. 
The = EC2 of course gets its trigger signal from the Renesis CAS=E2=80=99s = (main and backup) and there is a mod on the back of the EC2 board that I = took was conditioning of the CAS signals.
Has = anyone else had the EM3 read rpm incorrectly at high RPM?
 
After balancing our prop, I=E2=80=99m hoping to begin playing = with the EC2=E2=80=99s closed loop mode, and then Timing with = new BR10EIX plugs.
 
Thanks again Tracy for your gearbox and EC.
 
Cheers
Steve = Izett
<= /blockquote>

= --Apple-Mail=_E23CA94D-3561-4BCB-BCF3-F00147176E5E--