X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from [207.46.163.239] (HELO na01-by2-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.0.7) with ESMTPS id 6652109 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Tue, 24 Dec 2013 14:25:51 -0500 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=207.46.163.239; envelope-from=SBoese@uwyo.edu Received: from BLUPR05MB200.namprd05.prod.outlook.com (10.255.191.14) by BLUPR05MB198.namprd05.prod.outlook.com (10.255.191.12) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.842.7; Tue, 24 Dec 2013 19:25:16 +0000 Received: from BLUPR05MB200.namprd05.prod.outlook.com ([169.254.12.135]) by BLUPR05MB200.namprd05.prod.outlook.com ([169.254.12.128]) with mapi id 15.00.0842.003; Tue, 24 Dec 2013 19:25:16 +0000 From: "Steven W. Boese" To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: RE: [FlyRotary] Re: Renesis with 76 X 88 prop Thread-Topic: [FlyRotary] Re: Renesis with 76 X 88 prop Thread-Index: AQHPALjuMossPMoQM0mTMeg58s1Yl5pjr9Xd Date: Tue, 24 Dec 2013 19:25:15 +0000 Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [70.196.198.52] x-forefront-prvs: 0070A8666B x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM;SFS:(10009001)(199002)(189002)(377454003)(479174003)(377424004)(24454002)(81542001)(85306002)(15202345003)(63696002)(76796001)(76786001)(76576001)(59766001)(77982001)(74502001)(47446002)(74366001)(83072002)(85852003)(76482001)(87266001)(81342001)(53806001)(54356001)(77096001)(87936001)(51856001)(74316001)(46102001)(69226001)(2656002)(79102001)(75432001)(50986001)(16236675002)(49866001)(47736001)(54316002)(56776001)(81816001)(66066001)(81686001)(47976001)(4396001)(83322001)(19580405001)(19580395003)(74876001)(56816005)(74662001)(80976001)(33646001)(74706001)(15975445006)(31966008)(65816001)(90146001)(80022001)(24736002)(80792004);DIR:OUT;SFP:1101;SCL:1;SRVR:BLUPR05MB198;H:BLUPR05MB200.namprd05.prod.outlook.com;CLIP:70.196.198.52;FPR:;RD:InfoNoRecords;A:1;MX:1;LANG:en; Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_a17c5fc079274374940074d6a32cb771BLUPR05MB200namprd05pro_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: uwyo.edu --_000_a17c5fc079274374940074d6a32cb771BLUPR05MB200namprd05pro_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Here is some data from my Renesis test stand: The same exhaust manifold was used for both the NA and turbo tests with the= EGT probes located about 1" from the flange for the exhaust port at the f= ront or rear of the engine block. Normally aspirated: about 23" MAP is the most I can get at my location at 7200 ft elevation. N= o wideband O2 sensor was installed. Peak EGT was obtained by adjusting the= manual mixture control. Default ignition timing was used. MAP: 22.5" Hg, Throttle body air temp: 65 deg F, RPM: 5140, Fuel flow: 10.6= gal/hr, EGT1 peak: 1478 deg F, EGT2 peak: 1510 deg F. Turbocharger installed: Wideband O2 sensor was installed. Default ignition timing was used. MAP: 23.6" Hg, Throttle body air temp: 73 deg F, RPM: 5020, AFR: 13.8, Fuel= flow: 9.0 gal/hr, EGT1: 1610 deg F, EGT2: 1580 deg F; Turbine out temp: 13= 90 deg F, Turbine RPM: 80100. MAP: 30.0" Hg, Throttle body air temp: 84deg F, RPM: 5550, AFR: 13.0, Fuel = flow: 13.8 gal/hr, EGT1: 1645 deg F, EGT2: 1605 deg F, Turbine out temp: 14= 30 deg F , Turbine RPM: 90600. Steve Boese RV6A, 1986 13B NA, RD1A, EC2 ________________________________ From: Rotary motors in aircraft on behalf of = Bobby J. Hughes Sent: Tuesday, December 24, 2013 7:59 AM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Renesis with 76 X 88 prop I'm beginning to think my EM3 default EGT setting is off by 100F? However m= y EGT is very close to Star Mazda's published numbers and F/A targets. They= are running a little rich of best power at 13.23 F/A. My engine makes best= power between 13.5-13.7 if my wideband is accurate. I target 12-12.5 for= take off with 38" MP. I get a slight rich knock in the 11's and a very bad= engine stumble in the 10's. I would be interested to see what data Steve B has collect on his test stan= d. http://www.starmazda.com/competitors/2012/resources/2Aug2012RenesisTutorial Bobby Sent from my iPad On Dec 23, 2013, at 11:21 PM, "Neil Unger" > wrote: Charlie, Take off seems to be best at 12. Have not tried leaning at = full power. Still early days, but pulling power back is the only way so fa= r to lower the EGT. Cooked the first EGT probe, second is not well, so hav= e ordered a third set. At $60 each I am not really learning much except tha= t freight from the states is very dear. If this keeps up may try and go st= ock ,Mazda to see it they survive better. Waiting for a replacement chip f= rom Tracy to fix computer A, so cannot fly until that arrives Neil. From: Charlie England Sent: Tuesday, December 24, 2013 12:10 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Renesis with 76 X 88 prop How rich are you running? If it's really rich, you may have fuel burning in= the exhaust even if timing is correct. Can you lean at near full power & g= et a drop in egt without a significant loss of power? Also, even conventional a/c engines see egt's all over the map from engine = to engine, due to timing, mixture, and even position of the probes (distanc= e from port, exposure to exhaust stream, etc) and variation in the probes t= hemselves. Of course, with the P-port engine, you might just be making more power. :-) Charlie On 12/23/2013 5:39 PM, Neil Unger wrote: Dennis, I have a P ported renesis and am seeing EGT up to 1850. Havi= ng talked with various people with far more knowledge than myself, who sugg= est it may be that the spark should be advanced up to around 30 BTDC. to re= duce the EGT. Rather than destroy the motor finding out, I am looking at ge= tting the engine onto a dyno to clarify the timing and EGT=92s. Should be = very interesting to say the least. No one works here until the first half = of Jan has passed in this banana republic of OZ. From: Dennis Havarlah Sent: Tuesday, December 24, 2013 8:07 AM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Renesis with 76 X 88 prop I've had server issues this week and could not send this until today. Bill I actually have the RD1-C PSRU. (My Bad.) Tracy started selling these about= 6-7 years ago for use with the Renesis. The prop turns clockwise from the pilot's seat view. I normally see EGT's in the high 1750 F. during full power takeoff and earl= y climb. It will go above 1800 F. if the mixture is real close to best powe= r. I have my EM-2 set to warn me if the EGTs go above 1800. Dennis H. --_000_a17c5fc079274374940074d6a32cb771BLUPR05MB200namprd05pro_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Here is some data from my Renesis test stand:

The same exhaust manifold was used for both the NA and turbo tests with = the EGT probes located about 1" from the  flange for the exhaust = port at the front or rear of the engine block.

 

Normally aspirated: 

about 23" MAP is the most I can get at my location at 7200 ft eleva= tion.  No wideband O2 sensor was installed.  Peak EGT was obtaine= d by adjusting the manual mixture control.  Default ignition timi= ng was used.

MAP: 22.5" Hg, Throttle body air temp: 65 deg F, RPM: 5140, Fu= el flow: 10.6 gal/hr, EGT1 peak: 1478 deg F, EGT2 peak: 1510 deg F.

 

Turbocharger installed:

Wideband O2 sensor was installed.  Default ignition timing was used= .

MAP: 23.6" Hg, Throttle body air temp: 73 deg F, RPM: 5020, AF= R: 13.8, Fuel flow: 9.0 gal/hr, EGT1: 1610 deg F, EGT2: 1580 deg = F; Turbine out temp: 1390 deg F, Turbine RPM: 80100.

MAP: 30.0" Hg, Throttle body air temp: 84deg F, RPM: 5550, AFR: 13.= 0, Fuel flow: 13.8 gal/hr, EGT1: 1645 deg F, EGT2: 1605 deg F, Turbine= out temp: 1430 deg F , Turbine RPM: 90600.

Steve Boese
RV6A, 1986 13B NA, RD1A, EC2
From: Rotary motors in ai= rcraft <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> on behalf of Bobby J. Hughes <= ;bhughes@qnsi.net>
Sent: Tuesday, December 24, 2013 7:59 AM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Renesis with 76 X 88 prop
 
I'm beginning to think my EM3 default EGT setting is off by 100F? Howe= ver my EGT is very close to Star Mazda's published numbers and F/A targets.= They are running a little rich of best power at 13.23 F/A. My engine makes= best power between 13.5-13.7 if my wideband is accurate.   I target 12-12.5 for take off with 38"= ; MP. I get a slight rich knock in the 11's and a very bad engine stumble i= n the 10's.  

I would be interested to see what data Steve B has collect on his test= stand.  


Bobby 



Sent from my iPad

On Dec 23, 2013, at 11:21 PM, "Neil Unger" <neil.unger@bigpond.com> wrote:

Charlie,
           &nbs= p;   Take off seems to be best at 12.  Have not tried leanin= g at full power.  Still early days, but pulling power back is the only= way so far to lower the EGT.  Cooked the first EGT probe, second is n= ot well, so have ordered a third set. At $60 each I am not really learning much except that freight from the states is = very dear.  If this keeps up may try and go stock ,Mazda to see it the= y survive better.  Waiting for a replacement chip from Tracy to fix co= mputer A, so cannot fly until that arrives Neil.
 
Sent: Tuesday, December 24, 2013 12:10 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Renesis with 76 X 88 prop
 
How rich are you running? If it's really ric= h, you may have fuel burning in the exhaust even if timing is correct. Can = you lean at near full power & get a drop in egt without a significant l= oss of power?

Also, even conventional a/c engines see egt's all over the map from engine = to engine, due to timing, mixture, and even position of the probes (distanc= e from port, exposure to exhaust stream, etc) and variation in the probes t= hemselves.

Of course, with the P-port engine, you might just be making more power. :-)=

Charlie

On 12/23/2013 5:39 PM, Neil Unger wrote:
Dennis,
           &nbs= p;  I have a P ported renesis and am seeing EGT up to 1850.  Havi= ng talked with various people with far more knowledge than myself, who sugg= est it may be that the spark should be advanced up to around 30 BTDC. to re= duce the EGT. Rather than destroy the motor finding out, I am looking at getting the engine onto a dyno to c= larify the timing and EGT=92s.  Should be very interesting to say the = least.  No one works here until the first half of Jan has passed in th= is banana republic of OZ.
 
Sent: Tuesday, December 24, 2013 8:07 AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Renesis with 76 X 88 prop
 
 
 
I've had server issues this week and could not send this until today.<= /div>
 
Bill
 
I actually have the RD1-C PSRU. (My Ba= d.) Tracy started selling these about 6-7 years ago for use with the Renesi= s.
The prop turns clockwise from the pilo= t's seat view.
I normally see EGT's in the high 1750 = F. during full power takeoff and early climb. It will go above 1800 F. if t= he mixture is real close to best power. I have my EM-2 set to warn me if th= e EGTs go above 1800.
 
Dennis H.
 

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