X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from mail-gx0-f180.google.com ([209.85.161.180] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.4.4) with ESMTPS id 5452827 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 16:44:51 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.161.180; envelope-from=keltro@gmail.com Received: by gglu1 with SMTP id u1so3234123ggl.25 for ; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 13:44:15 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=+ZyqkbuSwki3fRq5LYi6CZLTX+DzfzC/zFh6OjjmQ4c=; b=d9uRx/j5SaHtUdGFEbhECf9nmycusB1ltwOPOykV+9KX9qUaY06+ovR+HfB7wxHXts b1lTcHly45cf/Jj4DQt4x6GC9gVtHJbDZB7WBu2gZhZ0I+oNKsBvR2dH6vsmRJa/aatS RJRQuE/OitJuQkFr9X7kHpJx49ru/b6K/7dXyIyhHRDBm9g3SNLJgGp5/Hr4nq5kseZK Xvw9n0a7yKygMLslw+39MB+ON6DpbipJywZmo6iceypUZ2IbhA+8r3m1Z7EjgraB6Zte kZZLidkSUK1EjhkOpIlaIveTvS1RbbO2k8aGma5ofLC2EAnsJzcYYcTMlRUMkb5uAHCY EWQg== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.60.20.3 with SMTP id j3mr4132997oee.43.1332449055312; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 13:44:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.60.165.67 with HTTP; Thu, 22 Mar 2012 13:44:15 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2012 15:44:15 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: #1 rotor cutting out From: Kelly Troyer To: Rotary motors in aircraft Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=e89a8fb207629f8adc04bbdaf8d2 --e89a8fb207629f8adc04bbdaf8d2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 On Thu, Mar 22, 2012 at 9:57 AM, wrote: > Yes, that change certainly did the trick. I've only flown once since due > to weather, but the engine runs great. First thing I did after tuning A was > to copy to B before flying. Now I'm re- doing the cooling air scoop so that > it doesn't look like a hideous wart underneath the fuselage. The cooling > system works great, but it was kludged together while trying to arrive at a > workable configuration. > Brian Trubee > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Tracy > To: Rotary motors in aircraft > Sent: Thu, Mar 22, 2012 6:14 am > Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: #1 rotor cutting out > > Sorry Mark, that came out a bit harsher than I intended! BTW, the current > version of the EC2/3 software (since about two months ago) now programs both A & > B when you tune A. You can still program B differently when running on B if > desired as changes to B do not affect A. > > On your rotor 1 symptoms between 3800 and 5000, I was wondering if you still had > the resistor between CAS and EC2 that you were using to try and make the Renesis > CAS work. If so, you might try eliminating it since you are using the original > CAS. That's one reason I was anxious to hear if B had the same symptom. > > Sounds like the CAS sensor circuit change I installed in (Brian's ?) EC2 13-BREW > fixed the high rpm breakup problem so anyone having similar symptoms on BREW or > Renesis engines using the EC2 should have that change too. > > Tracy > > Sent from my iPad > > On Mar 21, 2012, at 4:56 PM, Mark Steitle wrote: > > > Tracy, > > > > OUCH, that hurts! OK, here's the rest of the story. I've changed my > > intake manifold and changed injector sizes, so I'm back to the tuning > > phase. The B controller won't run right now as I haven't copied A to > > B yet. I'll have to do that before I can try the B controller. > > Thanks for reminding me that I typically do things the hard way. > > > > Mark > > > > On 3/21/12, Tracy wrote: > >> Trying the B controller should always be the FIRST thing to try since it is > >> the easiest. This needs to be ingrained in all EC2/3 users mental (or > >> preferably written) engine failure check list. Everything including the > >> coil & injector drivers are swapped out when selecting B controller. Based > >> on the number of time I have asked if the B controller was tried when called > >> about an engine anomally I have concluded that very few builders are even > >> aware it it there : ). > >> > >> Tracy > >> > >> Sent from my iPad > >> > >> On Mar 21, 2012, at 3:58 PM, Mark Steitle wrote: > >> > >>> I have been chasing a problem with my p-port 3-rotor where the #1 > >>> rotor cuts out at around 3800 rpm, but comes back at around 5000 rpm. > >>> When this happens, I can hear a change in the exhaust, and I see the > >>> EGT on #1 drop way down to around 500*, so that's how I determined > >>> that it was the #1 rotor. The other two rotors continue to run > >>> normally. > >>> > >>> I have tried swapping coils, replacing the #1 rotor's plugs & coil > >>> wires, and swapping injectors. I have not tried the B controller, but > >>> that sounds like what I should try next. My suspicion is there may be > >>> a defective coil driver circuit in the EC-2. I have borrowed another > >>> 20B EC-2 to try, but won't be able to do the swap until this coming > >>> weekend. > >>> > >>> Since things have been so quiet on the list, I thought I would post > >>> this strange problem and see what suggestions others may have. > >>> > >>> Mark S. > > Mark, Cannot quite make out exactly what you have done to your intake but it appears you may have done away with the slide throttle and added traditional throttle bodies with primary injectors after the throttle plates and secondary injectors before the throttle plates ??.............I am sure you will fill us all in if that is not correct (with more detailed photos).................<:) Kelly Troyer Dyke Delta_"Eventually" 13B_RD1C_EC2_EM2 --e89a8fb207629f8adc04bbdaf8d2 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

On Thu, Mar 22, 2012 at 9:57 AM, <bktrub@aol.com> wrot= e:
Yes, that change certainly did the trick. I've only flown once sin= ce due to weather, but the engine runs great. First thing I did after tunin= g A was to copy to B before flying. Now I'm re- doing the cooling air s= coop so that it doesn't look like a hideous wart underneath the fuselag= e. The cooling system works great, but it was kludged together while trying= to arrive at a workable configuration.
Brian Trubee


-----Original Mes= sage-----
From: Tracy <rwstracy@gmail.com>
To: Rotary motors in aircraft <= ;flyrotary= @lancaironline.net>
Sent: Thu, Mar 22, 2012 6:14 am
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: #1 rotor cuttin= g out

Sorry Mark, that came out a bit =
harsher than I intended!   BTW,   the current=20
version of the EC2/3 software (since about two months ago) now programs bot=
h A &=20
B when you tune A.   You can still program B differently when running on B =
if=20
desired as changes to B do not affect A.  =20

On your rotor 1 symptoms between 3800 and 5000, I was wondering if you stil=
l had=20
the resistor between CAS and EC2 that you were using to try and make the Re=
nesis=20
CAS work.  If so, you might try eliminating it since you are using the orig=
inal=20
CAS.   That's one reason I was anxious to hear if B had the same sympto=
m.

Sounds like the CAS sensor circuit change I installed in (Brian's ?) EC=
2 13-BREW =20
fixed the high rpm breakup problem so anyone having similar symptoms on BRE=
W or=20
Renesis engines using the EC2 should have that change too.

Tracy

Sent from my iPad

On Mar 21, 2012, at 4:56 PM, Mark Steitle <msteitle@gmail.com> wrote:

> Tracy,
>=20
> OUCH, that hurts!  OK, here's the rest of the story.  I've cha=
nged my
> intake manifold and changed injector sizes, so I'm back to the tun=
ing
> phase.  The B controller won't run right now as I haven't copi=
ed A to
> B yet.  I'll have to do that before I can try the B controller.
> Thanks for reminding me that I typically do things the hard way.
>=20
> Mark
>=20
> On 3/21/12, Tracy <rwstracy@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Trying the B controller should always be the FIRST thing to try si=
nce it is
>> the easiest.   This needs to be ingrained in all EC2/3 users menta=
l (or
>> preferably written) engine failure check list.   Everything includ=
ing the
>> coil & injector drivers are swapped out when selecting B contr=
oller.   Based
>> on the number of time I have asked if the B controller was tried w=
hen called
>> about an engine anomally I have concluded that very few builders a=
re even
>> aware it it there : ).
>>=20
>> Tracy
>>=20
>> Sent from my iPad
>>=20
>> On Mar 21, 2012, at 3:58 PM, Mark Steitle <msteitle@gmail.com> wrote:
>>=20
>>> I have been chasing a problem with my p-port 3-rotor where the=
 #1
>>> rotor cuts out at around 3800 rpm, but comes back at around 50=
00 rpm.
>>> When this happens, I can hear a change in the exhaust, and I s=
ee the
>>> EGT on #1 drop way down to around 500*, so that's how I de=
termined
>>> that it was the #1 rotor.  The other two rotors continue to ru=
n
>>> normally.
>>>=20
>>> I have tried swapping coils, replacing the #1 rotor's plug=
s & coil
>>> wires, and swapping injectors.  I have not tried the B control=
ler, but
>>> that sounds like what I should try next.  My suspicion is ther=
e may be
>>> a defective coil driver circuit in the EC-2.  I have borrowed =
another
>>> 20B EC-2 to try, but won't be able to do the swap until th=
is coming
>>> weekend.
>>>=20
>>> Since things have been so quiet on the list, I thought I would=
 post
>>> this strange problem and see what suggestions others may have.
>>>=20
>>> Mark S.
=A0
=A0
Mark,
=A0 Cannot quite make out exactly what you have done to your intake bu= t it appears you may have
done away with the slide throttle and added traditional throttle bodie= s with primary injectors
after the throttle plates and secondary injectors before the throttle = plates ??.............I am sure
you will fill us all in if that is not correct (with more detailed pho= tos).................<:)
=A0
=A0
Kelly Troyer
Dyke Delta_"Eventually"
13B_RD1C_E= C2_EM2
--e89a8fb207629f8adc04bbdaf8d2--