X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from imr-ma03.mx.aol.com ([64.12.206.41] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.4.0) with ESMTP id 5055010 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Mon, 18 Jul 2011 01:23:51 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=64.12.206.41; envelope-from=shipchief@aol.com Received: from mtaomg-mb05.r1000.mx.aol.com (mtaomg-mb05.r1000.mx.aol.com [172.29.41.76]) by imr-ma03.mx.aol.com (8.14.1/8.14.1) with ESMTP id p6I5NAuV015687 for ; Mon, 18 Jul 2011 01:23:10 -0400 Received: from core-dde003b.r1000.mail.aol.com (core-dde003.r1000.mail.aol.com [172.29.53.9]) by mtaomg-mb05.r1000.mx.aol.com (OMAG/Core Interface) with ESMTP id 8AF98E000081 for ; Mon, 18 Jul 2011 01:23:10 -0400 (EDT) References: To: flyrotary@lancaironline.net Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Ok Here are the important flywheel measurements X-AOL-IP: 76.22.118.247 In-Reply-To: X-MB-Message-Source: WebUI MIME-Version: 1.0 From: shipchief@aol.com X-MB-Message-Type: User Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="--------MB_8CE1321EAFC88D7_2390_2A845_webmail-m142.sysops.aol.com" X-Mailer: AOL Webmail 33953-STANDARD Received: from 76.22.118.247 by webmail-m142.sysops.aol.com (149.174.9.10) with HTTP (WebMailUI); Mon, 18 Jul 2011 01:23:10 -0400 Message-Id: <8CE1321EAE4BB0D-2390-10E19@webmail-m142.sysops.aol.com> X-Originating-IP: [76.22.118.247] Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2011 01:23:10 -0400 (EDT) x-aol-global-disposition: G X-AOL-SCOLL-SCORE: 0:2:399301152:93952408 X-AOL-SCOLL-URL_COUNT: 0 x-aol-sid: 3039ac1d294c4e23c33e3a0d This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ----------MB_8CE1321EAFC88D7_2390_2A845_webmail-m142.sysops.aol.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Speaking of rivets; I was noticing in the discussion on flex plate doublers that welding and bo= lting were mentioned, but not riveting. Rivets are very light, strong and r= eliable. If the material science of the parts - to - be - joined are not en= tirely known, then riveting seems better than welding. There won't be any h= eat effected areas, and warping can be avoided. As for bolting, riveting seems better because rivets are small, and many m= ore can be used in the same area compared to bolts, for a stronger join....= unless dissassembly is required.=20 ''In service inspections'' favor rivets as well, they show a potential fail= ure as a 'smoked rivet'.=20 Possibly the original 13b flexplate could be beefed up with a doubler plate= riveted in? I'm not willing to invest in a heavy overblown repair. I'm looking forward = to a good reason for the known failures, and the lightest repair that does = the job. Until then, I would continue with the 13b flex plate, and increase= the inspection interval, it's not hard to look in there. Once cracks are observed, but not fully developed, a cause may be determine= d. Then a better cure can be developed. Scott PS: Dave; You are really pushing the envalope on this. I admire your drive. I'm certa= in you will arrive at a flywheel that works, but I'm concerned you will use= 'Overkill' doing it. I do it all the time, and I've started trying to cont= rol the tendancy. My oldest step son, who I hang out with a lot, has starte= d calling me on it. You may need a similar mentor. -----Original Message----- From: David Leonard To: Rotary motors in aircraft Sent: Sun, Jul 17, 2011 9:21 pm Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Ok Here are the important flywheel measurements That is not a bad idea while I have it all apart, as I have not changed the= m out yet. Inspection does not show anything that looks like a smoking riv= et. =20 --=20 David Leonard Turbo Rotary RV-6 N4VY http://N4VY.RotaryRoster.net http://RotaryRoster.net On Sun, Jul 17, 2011 at 2:17 PM, Tracy wrote: a kelly wrote: .Did you replace the aluminum rivets in your RD1X damper plate with steel bolts ?..............I= seem to remember that you did after several dampers (and yours) experienced alum streaking around= the rivets........... Just FYI to the group, the change I settled on for the damper rivets was t= o use -AD rivets instead of -A. The tensile strength is about 3 times hig= her on the -AD. Tracy Sent from my iPad On Jul 17, 2011, at 4:45 PM, Kelly Troyer wrote: .Did you replace the=20 aluminum rivets in your RD1X damper plate with steel bolts ?..............I= seem to remember that=20 you did after several dampers (and yours) experienced alum streaking around= the rivets........... ----------MB_8CE1321EAFC88D7_2390_2A845_webmail-m142.sysops.aol.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"
Speaking of rivets;
I was noticing in the discussion on flex plate doublers that welding a= nd bolting were mentioned, but not riveting. Rivets are very light, strong&= nbsp;and reliable. If the material science of the parts - to - be - joined = are not entirely known, then riveting seems better than welding. There won'= t be any heat effected areas, and warping can be avoided.
 As for bolting, riveting seems better because rivets are small, = and many more can be used in the same area compared to bolts, for a st= ronger join....unless dissassembly is required.
''In service inspections'' favor rivets as well, they show a potential= failure as a 'smoked rivet'.
Possibly the original 13b flexplate could be beefed up with a doubler = plate riveted in?
I'm not willing to invest in a heavy overblown repair. I'm looking for= ward to a good reason for the known failures, and the lightest repair = that does the job. Until then, I would continue with the 13b flex plate, an= d increase the inspection interval, it's not hard to look in there.
Once cracks are observed, but not fully developed, a cause may be dete= rmined. Then a better cure can be developed.
Scott
PS:
Dave;
You are really pushing the envalope on this. I admire your drive. I'm = certain you will arrive at a flywheel that works, but I'm concerned you wil= l use 'Overkill' doing it. I do it all the time, and I've started trying to= control the tendancy. My oldest step son, who I hang out with a lot, has s= tarted calling me on it. You may need a similar mentor.



= -----Original Message-----
From: David Leonard <wdleonard@gmail.com>
To: Rotary motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Sent: Sun, Jul 17, 2011 9:21 pm
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Ok Here are the important flywheel measurements
That is not a bad idea while I have it all apart, as I have not change= d them out yet.  Inspection does not show anything that looks like a s= moking rivet.
 
--
David Leonard

Turbo Rotary RV-6 N4VY
http://N4VY.Rotar= yRoster.net
http://RotaryRoster.ne= t


On Sun, Jul 17, 2011 at 2:17 PM, Tracy <rwstracy@gmail.com>= wrote:
a kelly wrote:

.Did you replace the
aluminum rivets in your RD1X damper plate with steel bolts ?....= ..........I seem to remember that
you did after several dampers (and yours) = ;experienced alum streaking around the rivets...........


Just FYI to the group,  the change I settled on for the dam= per rivets was to use -AD rivets instead of -A.   The tensile strength= is about 3 times higher on the -AD.

Tracy

Sent from my iPad

On Jul 17, 2011, at 4:45 PM, Kelly Troyer <keltro@att.net> wrote:

.Did you replace the
aluminum rivets in your RD1X damper plate with steel bolts ?....= ..........I seem to remember that
you did after several dampers (and yours) expe= rienced alum streaking around the rivets...........



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