X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from nm19-vm0.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com ([98.139.44.172] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.4c3j) with SMTP id 4953257 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Thu, 21 Apr 2011 10:51:12 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=98.139.44.172; envelope-from=keltro@att.net Received: from [98.139.44.103] by nm19.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Apr 2011 14:50:36 -0000 Received: from [98.139.44.82] by tm8.access.bullet.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Apr 2011 14:50:35 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1019.access.mail.sp2.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 21 Apr 2011 14:50:35 -0000 X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 X-Yahoo-Newman-Id: 970362.59531.bm@omp1019.access.mail.sp2.yahoo.com Received: (qmail 18057 invoked by uid 60001); 21 Apr 2011 14:50:35 -0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=att.net; s=s1024; t=1303397435; bh=6nZK8zT86XH+lFq2KYyhdec/lmE7/Ui3zQIu+no8clA=; h=Message-ID:X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:References:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=QAa3VXYi/G3c/l7Zq62r59HvY/GYfullEJv6MNgzuCwKtHxY7ueJmfsbImWfB1yUpsWbjwJFsJ53+qcrAwZrhL6CYGTjg+iSsFUdD6W16CGC4BIT3CaqdAmEGhsuj34GGDRzY/n69SBq8KkASAY58D60hd/AM6+ybP+czIwWHTo= DomainKey-Signature:a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=att.net; h=Message-ID:X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:References:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=qEiZmRZn7vuKc1yiQ3uJep2wjJtATieh78OuKX+MDFXddsNkn9jXvzHzJmKI6s49X1h9db6okLLpwiQDkdHC7HcxyETogLjHdn1C9Adoj6WvmsmzEqfa8dkAiY4datjzSaO+HDBYxmJJejEtJn8CDO6VDEr4tacBwWyDk84ASGQ=; Message-ID: <600491.80275.qm@web83909.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> X-YMail-OSG: PB9VUBAVM1kFafT.OoGfEAMcY8NoUmOKhBEKhmR9se05JFI dFMtBNkwpt7NOa6s1UZJ67Si3bAuOiJrbwM.1IXxtfGgL0ONTPVdQxdQcu38 8rXSC.touyNLIacxLlWDLBDHPK1zwacRV3jdZvrRTfK940hTDz0DpOCLk80o tCtPT0VnT8tcdgxgzoInxmIYH5QCq0ppoV02KVE4oxYkPl6jFyJ_bxt4h06B noCG5TCZ0KXjB7dREtE1C2zga9jIsIopZ7JoQutUhN56fDBys0dOSIb4Es6Y 41S7dhkdo49V.yQXw9qay9luXnCXGh6LybwV6jEb9AlwvQ4VOMu8cx1qCnMK AySmT6rqPUPVOm.DX Received: from [208.114.32.130] by web83909.mail.sp1.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 21 Apr 2011 07:50:35 PDT X-Mailer: YahooMailRC/559 YahooMailWebService/0.8.109.295617 References: Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2011 07:50:35 -0700 (PDT) From: Kelly Troyer Subject: Mistral 'Like' Intake To: Rotary motors in aircraft In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0-1409638522-1303397435=:80275" --0-1409638522-1303397435=:80275 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Jarrett,=0A=0A=A0=A0=A0=A0 I have been following these=A0posts with interes= t.............I agree with =0Ayou and others that =0A=0Athe most urgent nee= d for the Rotary crowd is a efficient and compact intake =0Amanifold with= =0Aa rear accessory housing with Lycoming mount ears a close second........= ...=0A=0A=A0=A0=A0=A0I am the proud owner of one of the few "Mistral" rear = housing/mount plates =0Awhich I paid =0A=0Adearly for and waited over 2 yea= rs for "Mistral" to have a production run of =0Aparts..........=0A=0A=A0=A0= The "Mistral" backplate is overly complicated and has provisions for a =0A= accessory drive=0A(vacuum or hydraulic pump) that our electrical homebuilt = a/c do not need plus =0Aa=A0expensive=0A(now unobtainable ) water-pump.....= .......It also has provision for an oil =0Ainjection pump that=0Amost=A0fly= ing Rotarys do not use since they premix with the fuel...........=0A=0A=A0 = IMHO this housing can be simplified using the basic dimensions and as Charl= ie =0Asuggested=0Apossibly utilizing an off the shelf water-pump such as th= e =0A"Renesis".............=0A=0A=A0=A0 Now to cut to the=A0chase..........= ...I have both the "Mistral"=A0hsg and a =0A2004-8 "Renesis" hsg=0Aso with = your "Laser Scanning" ability=A0could both hsgs be scanned then=A0"Married"= =0Ato each=0Aother and modified into a workable hsg that would fill our = =0Aneeds=A0??................=0A=0ABest Regards,=A0=0A=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=0A= Kelly Troyer=0A"DYKE DELTA JD2" (Eventually)=0A"13B ROTARY"_ Engine=0A"RWS"= _RD1C/EC2/EM2=0A"MISTRAL"_Backplate/Oil Manifold=0A"TURBONETICS"_TO4E50 Tur= bo=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________=0AFrom: H & J Johnson =0ATo: Rotary motors in aircraft =0ASent: Wed, April 20, 2011 11:38:07 PM=0ASubject: [FlyRotary] Re: = Mistral 'Like' Intake=0A=0A=0AI agree Charlie, a better way to mount the bl= ock is needed, that is product #2 =0Athat would be looked at[after the inta= ke].=A0 Sorta a 'walk first'=0Adeal.=A0=A0 All this ties into my wish to us= e a rotary in the near future. I see it =0Aas stuff that 'I want/need' so i= f I do, then I'm sure there are others=0Athat would be interested also.=0AO= nce I get this deal w/ the two jobs figured out things will start to get ma= pped =0Aout.=0AJarrett Johnson=0Awww.innovention-tech.com =0A=A0=0A----- Or= iginal Message -----From: Charlie England =0ADate= : Wednesday, April 20, 2011 7:27 pm Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Mistral 'Like'= =0AIntake > Hi Jarrett, =0A=0A> =0A> Until a couple of months ago, I would= have been *very* interested =0A> in a =0A> replacement accessory housing w= ith Lyc-style conical or dynafocal =0A> mount =0A> ears on it. I think that= an affordable adapter allowing use of a =0A> 'stock' =0A> motor mount that= comes with would do =0A> more =0A> for rotarie= s than any other single 'piece' of after-market gear. =0A> It =0A> means on= e less thing to fabricate, and the Lyc style mount gets =0A> all the =0A> s= tructure away from the engine, freeing up volume for heat =0A> exchangers, = =0A> intake, exhaust, etc. =0A> =0A> A housing that could use the stock wat= er pump & oil pump would be =0A> ideal =0A> (unlike the Mistral piece), to = minimize cost. My vote would be for =0A> the =0A> Renesis. =0A> =0A> Just a= thought.... =0A> =0A> Charlie =0A> =0A> On 4/20/2011 6:14 PM, H & J Johnso= n wrote: =0A> > =0A> > *Thanks Bryan, when looking at something of this nat= ure, it's =0A> always =0A> > the chicken and egg thing! At some point * =0A= > > =0A> > *I'd love to own a rotary powered a/c so there is some =0A> addi= tional =0A> > motivation over building a product. * =0A> > =0A> > ** =0A> >= =0A> > *The best senario is to get my hands on an existing manifold and = =0A> then =0A> > laser scan it [I've got the equipment to do this, it's the= * =0A> > =0A> > *'getting hands on' part that might be more difficult]. Onc= e =0A> I've done =0A> > that it's a pretty straight forward move* =0A> > = =0A> > *to make a similar product. There are most likely some changes =0A> = that =0A> > would be incurred to improve it as well as change it such* =0A>= > =0A> > *that it's not an 'exact' copy, as well as make it fit our =0A> >= experimental uses directly.=A0 The ability to also integrate to =0A> fit = =0A> > differnt * =0A> > =0A> > *makes and models of short block is also an= advantage **as I see =0A> it as =0A> > a two pc product.* =0A> > =0A> > *A= s far as retail price range I think your spot on, it'd be =0A> great to =0A= > > have it on the market for inside of $500 however, that might be =0A> a = bit =0A> > 'bullish'.* =0A> > =0A> > *It is certainly a target to shoot for= .=A0 If everything goes as =0A> planned =0A> > it will move forward and if = there is a market, it's there for it.* =0A> > =0A> > *My biggest barrier to= getting started here and now is getting =0A> my =0A> > hands on a sample..= ..=A0 :) * =0A> > =0A> > *Jarrett Johnson* =0A> > =0A> > *www.innovention-t= ech.com * =0A> > =0A> > *----- Original M= essage -----* =0A> > =0A> > *From*: Bryan Winberry *Date*: =0A> > Wednesday, April 20, 2011 5:02 pm *Subject*: [FlyRotar= y] Re: =0A> Mistral =0A> > Intake Documentation? > Jarrett, =0A> > > =0A> >= > I'm certainly interested in a manifold.=A0 I recall the mistral one =0A>= > > going for =0A> > > quite a lot.=A0 Obviously the more you can sell, th= e less you have =0A> > > to ask for =0A> > > them. =0A> > > =0A> > > What s= ort of investment is required to produce say ten units?=A0 I'm =0A> > > thi= nking5-700 dollars(sales price), but then again, I like a =0A> > > bargain.= =A0 Also it =0A> > > depends on how much profit you feel you need to make. = =0A> > > =0A> > > I hope I haven't insulted you.=A0 But I have no clue as t= o how much =0A> > > goes into =0A> > > cooking up one of these. =0A> > > = =0A> > > I have a Renesis if you're looking for a test bed. =0A> > > =0A> >= > Bryan =0A> > > =0A> > > =0A> > > =0A> > >=A0 _____ =0A> > > =0A> > > Fro= m: Rotary motors in aircraft [flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On =0A> > > Beha= lf Of H & J Johnson =0A> > > Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2011 6:14 PM =0A> >= > To: Rotary motors in aircraft =0A> > > Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Mistral = Intake Documentation? =0A> > > =0A> > > =0A> > > =0A> > > So it's possible = that I've missed the question [I'm a bit behind =0A> > > on my =0A> > > ema= ils] but is there a market for a Mistral type intake manifold =0A> > > syst= em?I'm in the process of finalizing a casting furnace and =0A> > > foundry = setup and =0A> > > have been looking at various projects in and around rota= ry =0A> > > engines. Intake =0A> > > manifolds have been at the top of the = list. I own the needed CNC =0A> > > equipmentto build the molds and pattern= s for a project of this =0A> > > level, it's always =0A> > > just been a is= sue of time to dedicate to the project. =0A> > > =0A> > > Recently I was gi= ven an opportunity to have more time to do on =0A> > > projects like =0A> >= > this [stop working two jobs and have multiple days off to do stuff =0A> = > > like this =0A> > > with a reasonably flexible schedule] =0A> > > =0A> >= > I'm curious as to the demand for a reasonably priced manifold? =0A> > > = [Also, in the =0A> > > end customers mind, what would be 'reasonably priced= '?] =0A> > > =0A> > > Best Regards =0A> > > =0A> > > Jarrett Johnson =0A> >= > =0A> > > www.innovention-tech.com =0A= > > > =0A> > > =0A> > > -- =0A> > > =0A> > > =0A> > > =0A> > > Homepage:=A0= http://www.flyrotary.com/ =0A> > > =0A> > > =0A> > > =0A> > > Archive and = UnSub: =0A> > > http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html = =0A> > > =0A> > -- =0A> > =0A> > Homepage:=A0 http://www.flyrotary.com/ =0A= > > =0A> > Archive and UnSub:=A0=A0 =0A> http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/l= ists/flyrotary/List.html =0A> =0A-- Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/= Archive and UnSub: =0Ahttp://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotar= y/List.html --0-1409638522-1303397435=:80275 Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
=0A
Jarrett,
=0A
 
=0A
 &nb= sp;   I have been following these posts with interest.......= ......I agree with you and others that
=0A
the most urgent need f= or the Rotary crowd is a efficient and compact intake manifold with
= =0A
a rear accessory housing with Lycoming mount ears a close second...= ........
=0A
 
=0A
    I am the = proud owner of one of the few "Mistral" rear housing/mount plates which I p= aid
=0A
dearly for and waited over 2 years for "Mistral" to have = a production run of parts..........
=0A
 
=0A
 =   The "Mistral" backplate is overly complicated and has provisions for= a accessory drive
=0A
(vacuum or hydraulic pump) that our electri= cal homebuilt a/c do not need plus a expensive
=0A
(now unobt= ainable ) water-pump............It also has provision for an oil injection = pump that
=0A
most flying Rotarys do not use since they premi= x with the fuel...........
=0A
 
=0A
  IMHO thi= s housing can be simplified using the basic dimensions and as Charlie sugge= sted
=0A
possibly utilizing an off the shelf water-pump such as th= e "Renesis".............
=0A
 
=0A
   Now = to cut to the chase.............I have both the "Mistral" hsg and= a 2004-8 "Renesis" hsg
=0A
so with your "Laser Scanning" ability&= nbsp;could both hsgs be scanned then "Married" to each
=0A
ot= her and modified into a workable hsg that would fill our needs ??.....= ...........
=0A
 
=0A
Best Regards, 
=0A      
=0A

Kelly Troyer
= "DYKE DELTA JD2" (Eventually)

=0A

"13B ROTARY"_ Engine
"RWS"_RD1C/EC2/EM2
"MISTRAL"_Ba= ckplate/Oil Manifold

=0A

"TURBONETICS"_TO4E50 Turbo

=0A

=0A

=0A
=0A
=0AFrom: H & J Johnson <hjjo= hnson@sasktel.net>
To: Rotary motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Sent: Wed, April 20, 2011 11:38:07 = PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] = Re: Mistral 'Like' Intake

=0A

=0A

I agree Charlie,= a better way to mount the block is needed, that is product #2 that would b= e looked at[after the intake].  Sorta a 'walk first'

=0A

deal.   All this ties into my wish to use a rotary in the nea= r future. I see it as stuff that 'I want/need' so if I do, then I'm sure th= ere are others

=0A

that would be interested also.

=0A

Once I get this deal w/ the two jobs figured out thi= ngs will start to get mapped out.

=0A

Jarrett Johnson=

=0A

www.innovention-tech.com

=0A 

=0A

----- Original Message -----

=0A

From: Charlie England <ceengland@bellsouth.net> =0A

Dat= e: Wednesday, April 20, 2011 7:27 pm =0A

Subject: [FlyRota= ry] Re: Mistral 'Like' Intake =0A

=0A

> Hi Jarrett,
>=
> Until a couple of months ago, I would have been *very* interested=
> in a
> replacement accessory housing with Lyc-style conica= l or dynafocal
> mount
> ears on it. I think that an affordab= le adapter allowing use of a
> 'stock'
> motor mount that com= es with <insert a/c of choice here> would do
> more
> f= or rotaries than any other single 'piece' of after-market gear.
> It=
> means one less thing to fabricate, and the Lyc style mount gets <= BR>> all the
> structure away from the engine, freeing up volume = for heat
> exchangers,
> intake, exhaust, etc.
>
&= gt; A housing that could use the stock water pump & oil pump would be <= BR>> ideal
> (unlike the Mistral piece), to minimize cost. My vot= e would be for
> the
> Renesis.
>
> Just a thou= ght....
>
> Charlie
>
> On 4/20/2011 6:14 PM, H & J Johnson wrote:
> = >
> > *Thanks Bryan, when looking at something of this nature,= it's
> always
> > the chicken and egg thing! At some poin= t *
> >
> > *I'd love to own a rotary powered a/c so th= ere is some
> additional
> > motivation over building a pr= oduct. *
> >
> > **
> >
> > *The be= st senario is to get my hands on an existing manifold and
> then > > laser scan it [I've got the equipment to do this, it's the*
= > >
> > *'getting hands on' part that might be more difficu= lt]. Once
> I've done
> > that it's a pretty straight forw= ard move*
> >
> > *to make a similar product. There are= most likely some changes
> that
> > would be incurred to = improve it as well as change it such*
> >
> > *that it's not an 'exact' copy, as well as make it fit our
> > e= xperimental uses directly.  The ability to also integrate to
> = fit
> > differnt *
> >
> > *makes and models = of short block is also an advantage **as I see
> it as
> >= a two pc product.*
> >
> > *As far as retail price ran= ge I think your spot on, it'd be
> great to
> > have it on= the market for inside of $500 however, that might be
> a bit
&g= t; > 'bullish'.*
> >
> > *It is certainly a target t= o shoot for.  If everything goes as
> planned
> > it = will move forward and if there is a market, it's there for it.*
> &g= t;
> > *My biggest barrier to getting started here and now is get= ting
> my
> > hands on a sample....  :) *
> &g= t;
> > *Jarrett Johnson*
> >
> > *www.innovention-tech.com <http://www.innovention-tech.com> *
&g= t; >
> > *----- Original Message -----*
> >
>= > *From*: Bryan Winberry <bryanwinberry@bellsouth.net> *Date*: > > Wednesday, April 20, 2011 5:02 pm *Subject*: [FlyRotary] Re: > Mistral
> > Intake Documentation? > Jarrett,
> &= gt; >
> > > I'm certainly interested in a manifold.  I= recall the mistral one
> > > going for
> > > qui= te a lot.  Obviously the more you can sell, the less you have
>= > > to ask for
> > > them.
> > >
> = > > What sort of investment is required to produce say ten units?&nbs= p; I'm
> > > thinking5-700 dollars(sales price), but then agai= n, I like a
> > > bargain.  Also it
> > > de= pends on how much profit you feel you need to make.
> > >
> > > I hope I haven't insulted you.  But I have no= clue as to how much
> > > goes into
> > > cookin= g up one of these.
> > >
> > > I have a Renesis i= f you're looking for a test bed.
> > >
> > > Brya= n
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > &g= t;  _____
> > >
> > > From: Rotary motors in= aircraft [flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On
> > > Behalf Of H &= amp; J Johnson
> > > Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2011 6:14 PM <= BR>> > > To: Rotary motors in aircraft
> > > Subject:= [FlyRotary] Re: Mistral Intake Documentation?
> > >
> = > >
> > >
> > > So it's possible that I've = missed the question [I'm a bit behind
> > > on my
> >= ; > emails] but is there a market for a Mistral type intake manifold
> > > system?I'm in the process of finalizing a cast= ing furnace and
> > > foundry setup and
> > > hav= e been looking at various projects in and around rotary
> > > = engines. Intake
> > > manifolds have been at the top of the li= st. I own the needed CNC
> > > equipmentto build the molds and= patterns for a project of this
> > > level, it's always
&= gt; > > just been a issue of time to dedicate to the project.
>= ; > >
> > > Recently I was given an opportunity to have = more time to do on
> > > projects like
> > > this= [stop working two jobs and have multiple days off to do stuff
> >= ; > like this
> > > with a reasonably flexible schedule] > > >
> > > I'm curious as to the demand for a reas= onably priced manifold?
> > > [Also, in the
> > > end customers mind, what would be 'reasonably priced'?]
>= > >
> > > Best Regards
> > >
> >= > Jarrett Johnson
> > >
> > > www.innovention= -tech.com <http://www.innovention-tech.com/>
> > >
&= gt; > >
> > > --
> > >
> > > <= BR>> > >
> > > Homepage:  http://www.flyrotary.c= om/
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > = > Archive and UnSub:
> > > http://mail.lancaironline.net:81= /lists/flyrotary/List.html
> > >
> > --
> >= ;
> > Homepage:  http://www.flyrotary.com/
> > > > Archive and UnSub:  
> http://mail.lancaironlin= e.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html
> =0A

--    Homepage:  htt=
p://www.flyrotary.com/    Archive and UnSub:   http://mail.lancaironline.ne=
t:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html
--0-1409638522-1303397435=:80275--