X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from mail-fx0-f52.google.com ([209.85.161.52] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.4c3j) with ESMTPS id 4946166 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 09:57:35 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.161.52; envelope-from=msteitle@gmail.com Received: by fxm6 with SMTP id 6so1179127fxm.25 for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 06:56:57 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=a5/S2YUNPZ4pqZXv/VU90sTq/AWPTnYbkSGiBe8Cov0=; b=oULGcOq2hV1yncxaxrA90B76NRVdeHebFHqXuk+lm5NsM/qXnuck8zVSmj9ZmakEwX jZep/9lqOCVlTT6PIumupNk3xkHzQCDSNrfRqBug8gilpoWDWWuiLTJ3nQ8/Nc48KlLO iIO1I+RkQsNzBgwPuMmIKRNPFN/ggD/WRpsls= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; b=aPRhBpyXdaFozx/qwl+hguvsLcLqwEwuXU0gjJ/Rx/srLDkYbK7fo0xSb68Wvt+wlu bO6Qu/7ag4AUdHB306XZVopk6TfOaRzWuz8RMrUrZzkHj5ddwGJSJ9rlRN9xNioIQ0wJ lWpygzN999mbJUu6dvJaJu5O8gi7YGn5Nl7tE= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.223.97.142 with SMTP id l14mr836100fan.111.1302789411137; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 06:56:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.223.102.141 with HTTP; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 06:56:51 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2011 08:56:51 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Glider skills was : [FlyRotary] Re: Cooling of the BIG IRON From: Mark Steitle To: Rotary motors in aircraft Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=0015174be8a8116d5704a0e14c39 --0015174be8a8116d5704a0e14c39 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Ed, Yes, you've lived an interesting life (someone's obviously looking out for you). I too had a total engine failure shortly before my checkride. Lucky for me that my instructor was in the right seat. We landed against the traffic at Robert Mueller Airportn (Austin's main airport), shutting down the airport until we rolled off the runway with oil pouring from the engine. Firetrucks arrived shortly thereafter, but no fire. Gotta love those Lycomings (...not). Mark On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 8:47 AM, Ed Anderson wrote: > Actually, Mark, I think the few minutes I spent getting my Gliders > Endorsement back in 1964 helped a bit - even though a long time ago. At > least that convinced no engine didn't mean you immediately fell out of the > sky {:>). But, even back then long before my rotary and experimental > aircraft days, I was - lets say being flight challenged. > > The last day of my glider training, I was running late getting to the air > field and they were due to haul the glider back to its distant homebase. I > arrived just as they were preparing to disassembly it for trailering back. > The instructor was not happy at all about having to delay the process (I > guess after a week in Cordell OK, he wanted to get back to Mama). > > In any case, he told me not to bother pre-flighting the glider and to hop > in and we would hook up the tow plane and launch. Well, we did - got up to > a bit above pattern altitude and cut loose. Well, the instructor in the > back seat berated me all around the pattern about using too much rudder. So > I knew he was not going to endorse my glider rating. So sweating and a bit > disappointed, I managed to "rudder" the glider onto final approach. As we > rolled out several people were running toward us. > > It turns out the aileron locks had been installed (and not doing a > preflight we obiviously missed them) and so I had flown the glider without > ailerons and that was why I had to use so much rudder to get some bank. I > was later told that had I let the wings get sufficiently low, there was no > way the rudder could have pulled the wings back level!! > > The somewhat shaken instructor decided that if I could fly a glider without > ailerons - then I merited my glider endorsement. > > Did I ever tell you about the engine-out landing I experience one > flight before my scheduled solo - or about the tailwheel falling off as I > taxied out for my 1st solo flight - remind me to tell you sometime {:>) > > Ed > > *From:* Mark Steitle > *Sent:* Thursday, April 14, 2011 9:17 AM > *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft > *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Re: Cooling of the BIG IRON > > Ed, > > Oh, so that's where you learned your excellent engine-out glide skills. > > Mark > > On Wed, Apr 13, 2011 at 10:38 PM, Ed Anderson wrote: > >> Ah, Yes, >> >> Many a take off in the B-52 fortress ( and one in the KC-135 tanker) on a >> Hot Oklahoma day took a lot of water being injected into the engines to give >> sufficient thrust to get airborne. In fact, failure of the water injection >> system on certain hot days required aborting the take off. >> >> Ed >> >> *From:* Lehanover@aol.com >> *Sent:* Wednesday, April 13, 2011 9:07 PM >> *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft >> *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Re: Cooling of the BIG IRON >> >> Well done Mr. Anderson. >> >> That 50/50 mixture was also ingested by big radials in military power for >> cooling and anti detonation. >> >> Same for early pure jets where it was added to add mass to the exhaust >> flow on take off. >> >> Lynn E. Hanover >> >> In a message dated 4/13/2011 10:23:40 A.M. Atlantic Daylight Time, >> eanderson@carolina.rr.com writes: >> >> I came across a study looking at ways to cool aircraft racing engines (for >> the BIG iron), makes some interesting reading as they look at EVERY way to >> cool a race engine including sacrificial boiling off (phase change) of an >> expendable liquid as well as spray bar cooling, etc. >> >> >> > --0015174be8a8116d5704a0e14c39 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Ed,=A0

Yes, you've lived an interesting life (someon= e's obviously looking out for you). =A0I too had a total engine failure= shortly before my checkride. =A0Lucky for me that my instructor was in the= right seat. =A0We landed against the traffic at Robert Mueller Airportn (A= ustin's main airport), shutting down the airport until we rolled off th= e runway with oil pouring from the engine. =A0Firetrucks arrived shortly th= ereafter, but no fire. =A0Gotta love those Lycomings (...not).=A0

Mark=A0

On Thu, Apr 1= 4, 2011 at 8:47 AM, Ed Anderson <eanderson@carolina.rr.com> wrote:
=
Actually, Mark,=A0I think the few minutes I spent= =20 getting my Gliders Endorsement back in 1964 helped a bit - even though a lo= ng=20 time ago.=A0 At least that convinced no engine didn't mean you immediat= ely=20 fell out of the sky {:>).=A0 But, even back then long before my rotary a= nd=20 experimental aircraft days, I was - lets say being=20 flight=A0challenged.
=A0
The last day of my glider training, I was running= late=20 getting to the air field and they were due to haul the glider back to its= =20 distant homebase.=A0 I arrived just as they were preparing to disassembly i= t=20 for trailering back.=A0 The instructor was not happy at all about having to= =20 delay the process (I guess after a week in Cordell OK, he wanted to get bac= k to=20 Mama).
=A0
In any case, he told me not to bother pre-flighti= ng the=20 glider and to hop in and we would hook up the tow plane and launch.=A0 Well= ,=20 we did - got up to a bit above pattern altitude and cut loose.=A0 Well, the= =20 instructor in the back seat berated me all around the pattern about using t= oo=20 much rudder.=A0 So I knew he was not going to endorse my glider rating.=A0= =20 So sweating and a bit disappointed, I managed to "rudder" the gli= der onto final=20 approach.=A0 As we rolled out several people were running toward=20 us.
=A0
It turns out the aileron locks had been installed= (and not=20 doing a preflight we obiviously missed them) and so I had flown the glider= =20 without ailerons and that was why I had to use so much rudder to get some= =20 bank.=A0 I was later told that had I let the wings get sufficiently low,=20 there was no way the rudder could have pulled the wings back level!!=A0=20
=A0
The somewhat shaken instructor decided that if I = could fly=20 a glider without ailerons - then I merited my glider endorsement.
=A0
Did I ever tell you about the=A0engine-out=20 landing=A0I experience one flight=A0before my scheduled solo - or about=20 the =A0tailwheel falling off as I taxied out for my 1st solo flight - remin= d=20 me to tell you=A0sometime {:>)
=A0
Ed

Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2011 9:17 AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Cooling of the BIG IRON

Ed,=A0=20

Oh, so that's where you learned your excellent engine-out glide sk= ills.=20 =A0

Mark

On Wed, Apr 13, 2011 at 10:38 PM, Ed Anderson <eanderson@carolina.rr.com>=20 wrote:
Ah, Yes,
=A0
Many a take off in the B-52 fortress ( and one in t= he KC-135=20 tanker) on a Hot Oklahoma day took a lot of water being injected into the= =20 engines to give sufficient thrust to get airborne.=A0 In fact, failure of= =20 the water injection system on certain hot days required aborting the take= =20 off.
=A0
Ed

Sent: Wednesday, April 13, 2011 9:07 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Cooling of the BIG IRON
<= /div>

Well done Mr. Anderson.
=A0
That 50/50 mixture was also ingested by big radials in military powe= r for=20 cooling and anti detonation.
=A0
Same for early pure jets where it was added to add mass to the exhau= st=20 flow on take off.
=A0
Lynn E. Hanover
=A0
In a message dated 4/13/2011 10:23:40 A.M. Atlantic Daylight Time, <= a href=3D"mailto:eanderson@carolina.rr.com" target=3D"_blank">eanderson@car= olina.rr.com writes:
I came across a study looking at ways to cool= aircraft=20 racing engines (for the BIG iron), makes some interesting reading as th= ey=20 look at EVERY way to cool a race engine including sacrificial boiling o= ff=20 (phase change) of an expendable liquid as well as spray bar cooling,=20 etc.
=A0


--0015174be8a8116d5704a0e14c39--