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Message-ID: <4D713CB3.1050707@gmail.com>
Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2011 13:25:40 -0600
From: Dave <david.staten@gmail.com>
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To: Rotary motors in aircraft <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Knock sensor and indicator
References: <list-4890593@logan.com>
In-Reply-To: <list-4890593@logan.com>
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On 3/4/2011 8:43 AM, Chris Barber wrote:
>
> Since I have had an issue with detonation, I am contemplating adding a 
> knock sensor.  What do y'all know about this addition.  I do not 
> believe Tracy's EM has a provision for a reading, so, what might be a 
> good route to take.  The brief research I have done shows different 
> frequencies, types etc.   What would be correct for a rotary, both as 
> to a sensor and something to notify me in the cabin?  Thanks.  I am 
> about to replace ALL my apex seals and soft parts and hopefully 
> finally lick this issue....hopefully....did I mention 
> hopefully...determinably...persistent? (heck, I wasn't planning 
> anything else this weekend <g>)
>
> Chris
>
The stock block rotor housings have a fitting in between the plugs to 
have a knock sensor that ties into the stock ECU.

However, the response time required, from what I've read, from the time 
detonation is detectable to action needing to be taken is very very 
small.. fractions of a second.

I suspect that all the time and expense you are contemplating 
undertaking would simply be to install a light to tell you when its time 
to tear down the engine again, because it would be too late to avoid the 
damage.

Our approach must be to avoid detonation, not mitigate its effects. You 
would get more benefit out of measuring your intake temp (as an aux temp 
on the EM) after the turbo intercooler to see where your charged air 
temp is hanging at, and trying to cool that effectively. Running boost 
on the ground with no airflow across the intercooler is liable to result 
in intake temps over 200 degrees due to compressional heating of the 
intake air. If I remember right your fan is on the radiator, and there 
is not a fan on the intercooler.

There was a reason when we started this that I recommended strongly 
about getting the plane flying in a normally aspirated mode first.

Dave.

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    On 3/4/2011 8:43 AM, Chris Barber wrote:
    <blockquote cite="mid:list-4890593@logan.com" type="cite">
      <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html;
        charset=ISO-8859-1">
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        <p>Since I have had an issue with detonation, I am&nbsp;contemplating
          adding a knock sensor.&nbsp; What do y'all know about this
          addition.&nbsp; I do not believe Tracy's&nbsp;EM has a provision for a
          reading, so, what might be a good route to take.&nbsp; The brief
          research I have done shows different frequencies, types etc.&nbsp;&nbsp;
          What would be correct for a rotary, both as to a sensor and
          something to&nbsp;notify me in the cabin?&nbsp; Thanks.&nbsp; I am about to
          replace&nbsp;ALL my apex seals and soft parts and hopefully finally
          lick this issue....hopefully....did I mention
          hopefully...determinably...persistent? (heck, I wasn't
          planning anything else this weekend &lt;g&gt;)</p>
        <p>&nbsp;</p>
        <p>Chris</p>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    The stock block rotor housings have a fitting in between the plugs
    to have a knock sensor that ties into the stock ECU.<br>
    <br>
    However, the response time required, from what I've read, from the
    time detonation is detectable to action needing to be taken is very
    very small.. fractions of a second.<br>
    <br>
    I suspect that all the time and expense you are contemplating
    undertaking would simply be to install a light to tell you when its
    time to tear down the engine again, because it would be too late to
    avoid the damage. <br>
    <br>
    Our approach must be to avoid detonation, not mitigate its effects.
    You would get more benefit out of measuring your intake temp (as an
    aux temp on the EM) after the turbo intercooler to see where your
    charged air temp is hanging at, and trying to cool that effectively.
    Running boost on the ground with no airflow across the intercooler
    is liable to result in intake temps over 200 degrees due to
    compressional heating of the intake air. If I remember right your
    fan is on the radiator, and there is not a fan on the intercooler. <br>
    <br>
    There was a reason when we started this that I recommended strongly
    about getting the plane flying in a normally aspirated mode first. <br>
    <br>
    Dave. <br>
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