X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from securemail.ever-tek.com ([64.129.170.194] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3.10) with ESMTP id 4557745 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Sat, 06 Nov 2010 11:12:54 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=64.129.170.194; envelope-from=cbarber@texasattorney.net Received: from fcd-mail06.FCDATA.PRIVATE ([2002:404:40b::404:40b]) by FCD-MAIL06.FCDATA.PRIVATE ([::1]) with mapi; Sat, 6 Nov 2010 10:12:13 -0500 From: Chris Barber To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: RE: [FlyRotary] Ec Modes Thread-Topic: [FlyRotary] Ec Modes Thread-Index: AQHLfcG9kDBB0qRLlEa48IL+g3FDjpNki3eD Date: Sat, 6 Nov 2010 15:12:11 +0000 Message-ID: <2D41F9BF3B5F9842B164AF93214F3D303275A6B5@FCD-MAIL06.FCDATA.PRIVATE> References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_2D41F9BF3B5F9842B164AF93214F3D303275A6B5FCDMAIL06FCDATA_" MIME-Version: 1.0 --_000_2D41F9BF3B5F9842B164AF93214F3D303275A6B5FCDMAIL06FCDATA_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Ed, Funny you should mention this. I have re-read the manuals a couple of time= s from cover to cover over the past few years. Even though I am a pretty de= tailed reader, it seems as if I always find some new little tidbit that I r= ead, but missed before. That is in addition to the piece meal scrutiny I ma= y give a certain section on any given day. Reading in its totality can pro= vide some "ah-ha" moments. This is one of the reasons I rarely call Tracy = as I hate bother him for something he has already addressed in the manuals. Also, since I have now messed with the EM and EC for a while, I have a much= better gasp on what the manuals say and mean. This actually does translat= e into much better understanding. Your input helps too. Of course, this better understanding is not helping me with my current grem= lins. I do know now that I am doing most of the programming etc correctly = and feel my issues are a bit deeper. I hope to be able to reach Tracy late= r today for some direction. Regretfully, I am working, so I will have to r= elay my issues to him from a list and not a list AND hands on. I hope his = eyes do not roll too far back into his head. If I can work out these current gremlins', I will so close to first flight,= it will be scary. ;-) Chris Barber Houston, GSOT ________________________________ From: Rotary motors in aircraft [flyrotary@lancaironline.net] on behalf of = Ed Anderson [eanderson@carolina.rr.com] Sent: Saturday, November 06, 2010 9:47 AM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Ec Modes Ok, admitting to being a bit lazy after flying with the Ec2 for approaching= 8-9 years now, I decided to read the manual (again?). Here is a summary of my understanding of the EC2 Fuel related Modes - subje= ct to clarification by those (he?) who really understand the modes. This b= rief summary IS NOT a substitute for reading the manual in detail. Any err= ors, mistatements, lack in understanding of this summary are mine alone, a= ny suggestions for clarification welcomed! Mode 0 - Normal running mode - pushing the program store button is this mod= e does nothing - setting the program select to this mode prevents inadvert= ent "adjustment" of the EC2 during flight. Mode 1- MAP adjustment mode - permits you to adjust the Fuel correction fac= tors for each bin (manifold pressure points) by using the Left Mixture Prog= ram Knob and then storing the adjustment in the Fuel Map by pressing the Pr= ogram Store Button. This is an absolute adjustment to the current fuel MAP values, in other wor= ds setting the Program Mixture control knob all the way CCW (lean) and pres= sing store would place a minimum value (zero?) in that bin. Setting the Mi= xture control knobe all the way CW (rich) would store a maximum value (255?= ) in that bin. This contrasts to the Mode 9 adjustment of the MAP table wh= ich is apparently incremental from the current setting. Note: Injector Di= agnostic Mode: With engine off pushing Program Store Button in this mode w= ill trigger the injector diagnostic mode - make certain your fuel pumps are= all OFF! Mode 2- Copy MAP mode - used to copy controller A programming to controlle= r B. Mode 3 - Fuel Injector Flow Adjustment - used to compensate in the MAP tabl= e for the use of larger injectors (I.e. When all four injectors have higher= flow rates than approx 460 cc/min) than the stock 13B N/A engine. If you can not adequately lean your engine with the larger injectors, it ap= pears that this mode can be used to "adjust the flow" to an acceptable ran= ge. Note: I once tried going from my stock N/A 460 cc/min injectors to 550 cc/= min injectors - I could never get the engine to idle properly - always too = rich at one end or the other, so I went back to stock. If I had been smart= er and read the manual more closely, I think adjustment in this mode might = have solved the "too rich" idle problem Mode 4 - Front Rotor Mixture Adjustment - Used to compensate for small diff= erences in the mixture between the front and rear rotor - adjust front roto= r to match EGT of rear rotor - Note from the Ec2 Manual: You can accomplish this by monitoring the EGTs of the two rotors and gettin= g them to match as closely as possible. A digital EGT gauge is almost a nec= essity to read small differences. Mode 6 - Secondary Injector Differential Adjustment - Used if secondary inj= ectors have larger flow rates than primary injectors - this may result in a= n overly rich mixture above the staging point. This adjustment is used to compensate for the larger secondary injectors. = Normally, you would observe the Air/Fuel Ratio indication and would need t= o lean the flow below staging point so that it would not be overly rich aft= er staging. At least that is what I think I read Mode 9 - Adjust MAP table entry - Similar to Mode1 in making adjustments = of MAP table, but is used to make even finer adjustments. While Mode 1 settings make absolute value changes to the value in the bin o= f the MAP, Mode 9 is used to make smaller relative adjustments to the MAP = value in the bin being adjusted. The closer the Mixture knob is to 12:00 t= he smaller the change, the further CCW (lean) or CW (rich) the greater the = relative adjustment. Read the instructions for details. Mode 9 is recommended for making any IN-FLIGHT changes to the MAP table as = the effects of this mode's changes are far less dramatic than being in MOD= E 1 and having the knob fully CCW when you push the Program Store Button {:= >). The engine will cough for a moment (as it goes full lean) and then shi= ft to a more satisfactory fuel MAP value bin before continuing to run. I d= on't about most of you - but I'm getting to the age that I don't like the e= ngine to cough for even a moment. Did I mention read the manual for a fuller description and understanding? = There is a lot of stuff in it and most of us will need to read it and attem= pt making the adjustments before it really sticks. One purpose of this summary, is that if my understanding is in error - then= I WANT to know! Ed Edward L. Anderson Anderson Electronic Enterprises LLC 305 Reefton Road Weddington, NC 28104 http://www.andersonee.com http://www.eicommander.com --_000_2D41F9BF3B5F9842B164AF93214F3D303275A6B5FCDMAIL06FCDATA_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Ed,
 
Funny you should mention this.  I have re-read the manuals a coup= le of times from cover to cover over the past few years. Even though I= am a pretty detailed reader, it seems as if I always find some new little = tidbit that I read, but missed before. That is in addition to the piece meal scrutiny I may give a certain= section on any given day.  Reading in its totality can provide some &= quot;ah-ha" moments.  This is one of the reasons I rarely call Tr= acy as I hate bother him for something he has already addressed in the manuals.
 
Also, since I have now messed with the EM and EC fo= r a while, I have a much better gasp on what the manuals say and mean. = ; This actually does translate into much better und= erstanding.  Your input helps too.
 
Of course, this better understanding is not helping me with my current=  gremlins.  I do know now that I am doing most of the = ;programming etc correctly and feel my issues are a bit = deeper.  I hope to be able to reach Tracy later today for some direction.  Regretfully, I am working, so I will have= to relay my issues to him from a list and not a list AND hands on.  I= hope his eyes do not roll too far back into his head.
 
If I can work out these current gremlins', I will so close to f= irst flight, it will be scary. ;-)
 
Chris Barber
Houston, GSOT
From: Rotary motors in aircraft [flyrotary= @lancaironline.net] on behalf of Ed Anderson [eanderson@carolina.rr.com] Sent: Saturday, November 06, 2010 9:47 AM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Ec Modes

Ok, admitting to being a bit lazy after flyi= ng with the Ec2 for approaching 8-9 years now, I decided to read the manual= (again?).
 
Here is a summary of my understanding of the EC2 Fuel related Modes - subject to clarification by thos= e (he?) who really understand the modes.  This brief summary IS NOT a substitute for reading the manual in detail. = ; Any errors, mistatements, lack in understanding of this summary &nbs= p;are mine alone, any suggestions for clarification welcomed!
 
Mode 0 - Normal running = mode - pushing the program store button is this mode does not= hing - setting the program select to  this mode prevents inadvert= ent "adjustment" of the EC2 during flight.
 
Mode 1- MAP adjustment mode - pe= rmits you to adjust the Fuel correction factors for each bin (manifold pres= sure points) by using the Left Mixture Program Knob and then storing t= he adjustment in the Fuel Map by pressing the Program Store Button. 
 
This is an absolute adjustment to the current fue= l MAP values, in other words setting the Program Mixture control knob all t= he way CCW (lean) and pressing store would place a minimum value (zero?) in= that bin.  Setting the Mixture control knobe all the way CW (rich) would store a maximum value (255?) in that bin= .  This contrasts to the Mode 9 adjustment of the MAP table which is a= pparently incremental from the current setting.   Note: Injector Diagnostic Mode:  With engine off pushing Pr= ogram Store Button in this mode will trigger the injector diagnostic mode -= make certain your fuel pumps are all OFF!
 
Mode 2- Copy MAP mode - used to = copy controller A programming  to controller B.=
 
Mode 3 - Fuel Injector Flow Adjustment - used to compensate in the MAP table for the use of lar= ger injectors (I.e. When all four injectors have higher fl= ow rates than approx 460 cc/min) than the stock 13B N/A engine.&n= bsp;
 
If you can not adequately lean your engine with t= he larger injectors, it appears that  this mode can be used to "a= djust the flow" to an acceptable range.
 
Note:  I once tried going from my stock N/A = 460 cc/min injectors to 550 cc/min injectors - I could never get the engine= to idle properly - always too rich at one end or the other, so I went back= to stock.  If I had been smarter and read the manual more closely, I think adjustment in this mode might have solved= the "too rich" idle problem
 
Mode 4 - Front Rotor Mixture Adjustment - Used to compensate for small differences in the mixture betw= een the front and rear rotor - adjust front rotor to match EGT of rear roto= r  - Note from the Ec2 Manual:=

You can accomplish this by monitoring the EGTs of the two= rotors and getting them to match as closely as possible. A digital EGT gau= ge is almost a necessity to read small differences.

 
Mode 6 - Secondary Injector Differential = Adjustment - Used if secondary injectors have larger flow rates than primary inje= ctors - this may result in an overly rich mixture a= bove the staging point. 
 
This adjustment is used to compensate for the lar= ger secondary injectors.  Normally,  you would observe the Air/Fu= el Ratio indication and would need to lean the flow below staging point so = that it would not be overly rich after staging. At least that is what I think I read
 
 
Mode 9 - Adjust MAP table entry &nbs= p; - Similar to Mode1 in making adjustments of MAP table, but= is used to make even finer adjustments. 
 
While Mode 1 settings make absolute value changes= to the value in the bin of  the MAP, Mode 9 is used to make smal= ler relative adjustments to the MAP value in the bin being adjusted.  = The closer the Mixture knob is to 12:00 the smaller the change, the further CCW (lean) or CW (rich) the greater the relative a= djustment.  Read the instructions for details.
 
Mode 9 is recommended for making any IN-F= LIGHT changes to the MAP table as the effects of this mode's =  changes are far less dramatic than being in MODE 1 and having the kno= b fully CCW when you push the Program Store Button {:>).  The engine will cough for a moment (as it goes full = lean) and then shift to a more satisfactory fuel MAP value bin before = continuing to run.  I don't about most of you - but I'm getting t= o the age that I don't like the engine to cough for even a moment.
 
Did I mention read the manual for a fuller descri= ption and understanding?  There is a lot of stuff in it and most of us= will need to read it and attempt making the adjustments before it really s= ticks.
 
 
One purpose of this summary, is that if my unders= tanding is in error - then I WANT to know! 
 
 
Ed
 
Edward L. Anderson
Anderson Electronic Enterprises LLC
305 Reefton Road
Weddington, NC 28104
http://www.andersonee.com
http://www.eicommander.com
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