X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from hrndva-omtalb.mail.rr.com ([71.74.56.124] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3.10) with ESMTP id 4552904 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Tue, 02 Nov 2010 19:16:53 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=71.74.56.124; envelope-from=clouduster@austin.rr.com Return-Path: X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.1 cv=6ptpMFIBtxRk0xdOb6IhJTbTLVRlKjWFes7R4SsWCrA= c=1 sm=0 a=La9Be6b0U50A:10 a=04I7FWNrTfP4RHm++yk/MQ==:17 a=Ia-xEzejAAAA:8 a=VRzHdkDMo0t8EaVCy0kA:9 a=nozvnZfMlOnCrekdcCQA:7 a=eNp1Tmw0Hux8trP4dXpnQveXQqUA:4 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=EzXvWhQp4_cA:10 a=8hnUm4ZGWsKq5OuY:21 a=_LRnqQggpiiCOrq6:21 a=SSmOFEACAAAA:8 a=Y2VNeNrzAAAA:8 a=yMhMjlubAAAA:8 a=TW66zc2HAAAA:8 a=HQ31llbKAAAA:8 a=pedpZTtsAAAA:8 a=7hKMGtbd8_DvgTM6H2oA:9 a=mr0sw2EG6cDBT_pdygAA:7 a=09ah5tEuYjAMl-7lQR7szodB_EEA:4 a=eJojReuL3h0A:10 a=0o2oGdKEl1eXCoIAigQA:9 a=NwliPLBrVX2qoRzU8OqIeIfzGzoA:4 a=72KHBNWf6qv-465Q:21 a=79Ur24SzcPiU6vnH:21 a=ayC55rCoAAAA:8 a=6s4EyQBnZ9HPi8_ePQ0A:9 a=N0jRCXgZS173frq-9VkA:7 a=uTbuDPqthWDfgwBs695BqkZtrpUA:4 a=04I7FWNrTfP4RHm++yk/MQ==:117 X-Cloudmark-Score: 0 X-Originating-IP: 70.113.14.52 Received: from [70.113.14.52] ([70.113.14.52:58815] helo=DWHPC) by hrndva-oedge01.mail.rr.com (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.46 r()) with ESMTP id 30/DD-26142-2CB90DC4; Tue, 02 Nov 2010 23:16:19 +0000 Message-ID: From: "Dennis Havarlah" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: In-Reply-To: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: FW: [FlyRotary] Ready to fly again Date: Tue, 2 Nov 2010 18:16:14 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_068B_01CB7ABA.08E237E0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Windows Mail 6.0.6002.18197 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.0.6002.18263 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_068B_01CB7ABA.08E237E0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_068C_01CB7ABA.08E237E0" ------=_NextPart_001_068C_01CB7ABA.08E237E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I need to resize some pictures I'd like to send to the group. I am = using Windows Vista - does anyone know of an easy way for me to do this? Thanks, Dennis H. ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Bill Bradburry=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2010 10:06 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: FW: [FlyRotary] Ready to fly again =20 Dennis, Could you please describe the "hump" a little better? Are you talking = about trying to turn the air in the plenum? Pictures perhaps? =20 Bill B =20 -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----- From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] = On Behalf Of Dennis Havarlah Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2010 10:30 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: FW: [FlyRotary] Ready to fly again =20 Chris & Terria =20 My Catto 76X88 prop for the Renesis has a maximum cord of 6 ". If = yours is wider I believe it is too big for the engine. My static was = 5730 rpm on a 90 deg day. =20 When I first started flying the rotary (three years ago) I had oil and = water cooling problems - I used a home made wind tunnel 2 inches wide = inserted into the cowl and blew air into it with a squirrel cage blower = from a home A/C unit. I used a manometer on the back side of the = radiator to measure air pressure as the air came through the radiator. = I found I needed a good hump in the lower part of the cowl inlet to = deflect incoming air evenly through the oil and water radiators. My = radiators are side-by-side. =20 You might use a GPS to compare with the air speed gages to make sure = they are in the ball park. =20 Dennis H. =20 RV-7A Renesis RD-1C Catto 76X88 =20 =20 ------=_NextPart_001_068C_01CB7ABA.08E237E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I need to resize some pictures I'd like = to send to=20 the group.  I am using Windows Vista - does anyone know of an easy = way for=20 me to do this?
 
Thanks,
 
Dennis H.
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Bill=20 Bradburry
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2010 = 10:06=20 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: FW: = [FlyRotary]=20 Ready to fly again

 

Dennis,

Could you = please=20 describe the =93hump=94 a little better?  Are you talking about = trying to=20 turn the air in the plenum?  Pictures=20 perhaps?

 

Bill=20 B

 

From:=20 Rotary motors in aircraft = [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On=20 Behalf Of Dennis Havarlah
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2010 = 10:30=20 PM
To: = Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: FW: = [FlyRotary]=20 Ready to fly again

 

Chris &=20 Terria

 

My Catto 76X88 prop for = the=20 Renesis has a maximum cord of 6 ".  If yours is wider I believe = it is too=20 big for the engine.  My static was 5730 rpm  on a  90 = deg=20 day.

 

When I first started = flying the=20 rotary (three years ago) I had oil and water cooling problems - I = used a=20 home made wind tunnel 2 inches wide inserted into the cowl and blew = air into=20 it with a squirrel cage blower from a home A/C unit.  I used a = manometer=20 on the back side of the radiator to measure air pressure as the air = came=20 through the radiator.  I found I needed a good hump in the lower = part of=20 the cowl inlet to deflect incoming air evenly through the oil and = water=20 radiators.  My radiators are=20 side-by-side.

 

You might use a GPS to = compare=20 with the air speed gages to make sure they are in the ball=20 park.

 

Dennis=20 H.

 

RV-7A

Renesis

RD-1C

Catto=20 76X88

 

 

------=_NextPart_001_068C_01CB7ABA.08E237E0-- ------=_NextPart_000_068B_01CB7ABA.08E237E0 Content-Type: message/rfc822; name="Re_ Intake.eml" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Re_ Intake.eml" From: "Dennis Havarlah" To: "samuelhodges" References: <750508.57015.qm@web180316.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <750508.57015.qm@web180316.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: Intake Date: Fri, 23 Jul 2010 23:16:40 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0033_01CB2ABD.1D3773B0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Unsent: 1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.0.6002.18197 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0033_01CB2ABD.1D3773B0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sam,=20 Things are a bit busy here - 2 funerals, and now out-of-state company = coupled with next week's vacation. =20 I believe Tracy's design works because his bells are within 3/4 inch of = the plenum box wall. I believe he is getting a reflected compression = wave off the wall that reenters the intake pipe it came out of. I have = not done the math but I believe the total intake lenght from rotor face = to wall and back should be the same as the length sound would travel = during the time period starting when the rotor closes the intake port = and ending when the next intake cycle is about 3/4 closed. An example would be as follows: Shaft rpm =3D 6300 rpm Rotor rpm =3D 2100 rpm, 360 deg/rev X 2100 =3D 756000deg/minute.or = 75600/60 =3D 12600 deg/sec. The rotor turnes 1/3 of a rotation going from intake closed to next = intake closed. ( on the same rotor). 1/3 X360 =3D 120 deg of rotation. 120 deg/12600deg/sec =3D 0.0095238sec. But I want the reflected wave to get there about 3/4 thurough the intake = cycle. We need to back up the intake angel 1/4 of the total time the = intake is open. I don't have the intake degrees here but assume it is 60 deg.=20 1/4 X 60 deg =3D 15 deg. =20 120 deg - 15 deg =3D 105 deg of rotation for the wave to leave the rotor = face, go through the tube, bounce off the far wall and return to the = rotor arriving when the intake is 3/4 through the intake cycle. Using 105 deg/12600deg/sec =3D 0.00833 sec. Using 1100 fps as the speed of sound - 1100fps X 12 in/ft =3D 13200 = in/sec. The total intake length would be 13200 X .00833 / 2 =3D 55 inches. If you use the 3 rd. bounce of the compression wave off the plenum wall = the intake would need to be 1/3 X 54 or 13.74 inches long.(most of the = car engines that used tuned intakes used the 3 rd. bounce from what I've = read) If the speed of sound is 1100 f/sec. ----- Original Message -----=20 From: samuelhodges=20 To: Dennis Haverlah=20 Sent: Tuesday, July 20, 2010 11:03 AM Subject: Intake I have been up in Michigan for awhile on vacation and the sad = thing is I had to drive. Last weekend I spent hours staring at the plane = and taking measurements trying to figure out how to duplicate Tracy's = Intake design and how to fit it in our cowling. Tracy mentioned that he = has a total runner length of 11.25 including what's in the block. Block = length is close to 3", am I reading this correctly? What is driving this = design is the lack of space in the forward most intake port. To reach = the length of 11.25 we're looking at 8.25" of tubing from the block. I = have tried various radius tubing only to find out that it will hit the = cowling somewhere in the design. If I end up with a straight tube design = I can fit a 7.5" tube and leave enough room for a .75 distance between = the bell mouth and plenum box. This will leave a total of .75" to 1" = short of 11.25", what effect it will have? I don't know. Had you had a = chance to verify Tracy's design yet? I plan on machining the intake = plate this weekend and fitting the tubing. I appreciate you trying to = reach me but it seems we can never get in touch with one another, I'll = try to call you later to see what you have come up with, take care. Sam=20 ------=_NextPart_000_0033_01CB2ABD.1D3773B0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Sam,
 
Things are a bit busy here - 2 = funerals, and now=20 out-of-state company coupled with next week's vacation.  =
 
I believe Tracy's design works because = his bells=20 are within 3/4 inch of the plenum box wall.  I believe he is = getting a=20 reflected compression wave off the wall = that reenters=20 the intake pipe it came out of.  I have not done the math but I = believe the=20 total intake lenght from rotor face to wall and = back=20 should be the same as the length sound would travel during the time = period=20 starting when the rotor closes the intake port and ending when the next = intake=20 cycle is about 3/4 closed.
 
An example would be  as follows:
 
Shaft rpm =3D 6300 rpm
Rotor rpm =3D 2100 rpm,  360 = deg/rev X 2100 =3D=20 756000deg/minute.or 75600/60 =3D 12600 deg/sec.
The rotor turnes 1/3 of a rotation = going from=20 intake closed to next intake closed. ( on the same rotor).
1/3 X360 =3D 120 deg of = rotation.
 
120 deg/12600deg/sec =3D = 0.0095238sec.
But I want the reflected wave to get = there about=20 3/4 thurough the intake cycle.  We need to back up the intake angel = 1/4 of=20 the total time the intake is open.
I don't have the intake degrees here = but assume it=20 is 60 deg.
 
1/4 X 60 deg =3D 15 deg.  =
120 deg - 15 deg =3D 105 deg of = rotation for the wave=20 to leave the rotor face, go through the tube, bounce off the far wall = and return=20 to the rotor arriving when the intake is 3/4 through the = intake=20 cycle.
 
Using 105 deg/12600deg/sec =3D 0.00833=20 sec.
 
Using 1100 fps as the speed of sound = - =20 1100fps X 12 in/ft =3D 13200 in/sec.
The total intake length would be 13200 = X=20 .00833 / 2 =3D 55 inches.
 
If you use the 3 rd. bounce of the = compression wave=20 off the plenum wall the intake would need to be 1/3 X 54 or 13.74 = inches=20 long.(most of the car engines that used tuned intakes used the 3 rd. = bounce from=20 what I've read)
 
 
If the speed of sound is 1100 = f/sec.
 
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 samuelhodges
Sent: Tuesday, July 20, 2010 = 11:03=20 AM
Subject: Intake

I have been up in Michigan for awhile on vacation and the = sad thing=20 is I had to drive. Last weekend I spent hours staring at the = plane and=20 taking measurements trying to figure out how to = duplicate Tracy's=20 Intake design and how to fit it in our cowling. Tracy mentioned = that he=20 has a total runner length of 11.25 including what's in the = block. Block=20 length is close to 3", am I reading this correctly? What is = driving this=20 design is the lack of space in the forward most intake port. To = reach=20 the length of 11.25 we're looking at 8.25" of tubing from the = block. I=20 have tried various radius tubing only to find out = that it=20 will hit the cowling somewhere in the design. If I end up with a = straight tube design I can fit a 7.5" tube and leave enough room = for a=20 .75 distance between the bell mouth and plenum box. This will = leave a=20 total of .75" to 1" short of 11.25", what effect it will have? I = don't=20 know. Had you had a chance to verify Tracy's design yet? I = plan on=20 machining the intake plate this weekend and fitting the tubing. = I=20 appreciate you trying to reach me but it seems we can never get = in touch=20 with one another, I'll try to call you later to see what you = have come=20 up with, take care.
 
=
Sam
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