X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from imr-mb01.mx.aol.com ([64.12.207.164] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3.9) with ESMTP id 4494759 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Tue, 05 Oct 2010 23:57:07 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=64.12.207.164; envelope-from=Lehanover@aol.com Received: from imo-da04.mx.aol.com (imo-da04.mx.aol.com [205.188.169.202]) by imr-mb01.mx.aol.com (8.14.1/8.14.1) with ESMTP id o963uPuv017996 for ; Tue, 5 Oct 2010 23:56:25 -0400 Received: from Lehanover@aol.com by imo-da04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v42.9.) id q.da3.c16aa89 (37666) for ; Tue, 5 Oct 2010 23:56:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from magic-m19.mail.aol.com (magic-m19.mail.aol.com [172.21.136.208]) by cia-mb07.mx.aol.com (v129.4) with ESMTP id MAILCIAMB078-93224cabf362108; Tue, 05 Oct 2010 23:56:19 -0400 From: Lehanover@aol.com Message-ID: <72e3b.73db54c7.39dd4d62@aol.com> Date: Tue, 5 Oct 2010 23:56:18 EDT Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Permanent Magnet Alternators To: flyrotary@lancaironline.net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_72e3b.73db54c7.39dd4d62_boundary" X-Mailer: 9.0 Security Edition for Windows sub 5381 X-AOL-IP: 173.88.9.178 X-Spam-Flag:NO X-AOL-SENDER: Lehanover@aol.com --part1_72e3b.73db54c7.39dd4d62_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 10/5/2010 11:29:28 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, eanderson@carolina.rr.com writes: Kelly, this is nothing more than a SWAG, but one of the larger motor had these specs Monster Power 160 (63M57) It could handle 2700 watts. At 16 Volts it would take 2700/16 = 168 amps input to generate 2700 watts. So even if you assume it was only 50 % as effective as an alternator and after the voltage drop you would get across the diode array, it would appear that 60 Amps at 13 volts would not be too wild a guess. These motor wind at high rpms but then so doe our alternators. My main concern would be whether these motor using for relative short duration flights - would provide the mechanical reliability at hours, days, weeks, months, years of high continous rpm. I don't think the electronics would be a problem, but not as comfortable about 1. Mechanical reliability under the stress (hot engine compartments, hours of high rpm running) 2. Cooling mechanism - I don't see any cooling fans like an auto alternator But must admit 22 oz and 2.5 inches in diameter would sure make them attractive for aircraft use if my concerns are invalid Ed There are smaller truck motors that are water cooled. Most are around 80% efficient as motors. Brushed motors the same output are 50% efficient. Years ago you used to see big DC wind generators mounted between the landing gear legs of Champs and Cubs. How about the RAT installation. Or, a spring loaded motor with a friction tire that runs against the flywheel or water pump pulley, or the back side of any belt, with a last chance "T" handle to pull a pin to release the motor. Or a slack 1/4" wide "V" belt that tensions when the pin is pulled. I saw a WWII Cushman scooter with an alnico magnet generator that just ran a headlight and charged a battery with no regulation. The scooter had welded rings on it so it could be air dropped. Cadillac used outrunners for several years for blower motors. The speed controller was in the main computer so it could not be discarded or repaired. Lynn E. Hanover --part1_72e3b.73db54c7.39dd4d62_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

In a message dated 10/5/2010 11:29:28 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,=20 eanderson@carolina.rr.com writes:

Kelly, this is nothing more than a SWAG, but one= of the=20 larger motor had these specs

Monster Power 160 (63M57)

It could handle 2700 watts.

At 16 Volts it would take 2700/16 =3D 168= amps input=20 to generate 2700 watts.

So even if you assume it was only 50 % as effect= ive as=20 an alternator and after the voltage drop you would get across the diode= array,=20 it would appear

that 60 Amps at 13 volts would not be too wild= a=20 guess. These motor wind at high rpms but then so doe our=20 alternators.

My main concern would be whether these motor usi= ng for=20 relative short duration flights - would provide the mechanical reliabili= ty at=20 hours, days, weeks, months, years of high continous rpm. I= don't=20 think the electronics would be a problem, but not as comfortable=20 about

1. Mechanical reliability under the stress= (hot=20 engine compartments, hours of high rpm running)

2. Cooling mechanism - I don't see any coo= ling=20 fans like an auto alternator

But must admit 22 oz and 2.5 inches in diameter= would=20 sure make them attractive for aircraft use if my concerns are=20 invalid

Ed

There are smaller truck motors that are water cooled. Most are around= 80%=20 efficient as motors. Brushed motors the same output are 50% efficient.

Years ago you used to see big DC wind generators mounted between the= =20 landing gear legs of Champs and Cubs.

How about the RAT installation. Or, a spring loaded motor with a fric= tion=20 tire that runs against the flywheel or water pump pulley, or the back side= of=20 any belt, with a last chance "T" handle to pull a pin to release the motor= . Or a=20 slack 1/4" wide "V" belt that tensions when the pin is pulled.

I saw a WWII Cushman scooter with an alnico magnet generator that jus= t ran=20 a headlight and charged a battery with no regulation. The scooter had weld= ed=20 rings on it so it could be air dropped. Cadillac used outrunners for sever= al=20 years for blower motors. The speed controller was in the main computer so= it=20 could not be discarded or repaired.

Lynn E. Hanover

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