X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from smtp0.av-mx.com ([137.118.16.56] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3.8) with ESMTP id 4382112 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Tue, 06 Jul 2010 07:59:27 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=137.118.16.56; envelope-from=res12@fairpoint.net Received: from main (unknown [66.243.228.135]) (Authenticated sender: res12@fairpoint.net) by smtp0.av-mx.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F04A51C04F3 for ; Tue, 6 Jul 2010 07:58:50 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <36140B71A38048229B7858EE10FCC858@main> From: "Richard Sohn" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Flight Report Date: Tue, 6 Jul 2010 06:59:41 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_004D_01CB1CD8.CEBC4630" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5931 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5931 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_004D_01CB1CD8.CEBC4630 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mark, I never got that low, the engine quits at around 1400rpm. This low idle = on your engine sounds like being the result of the short intake runner = between the throttle(slide-) and the port. Would be my guess. Richard Sohn N2071U ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Mark Steitle=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Monday, July 05, 2010 9:45 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Flight Report Richard,=20 I have witnessed a nice idle down to 1200 rpm. There seems to be a = difference in how it idles after a flight vs. just rolling it out of the = hangar and running it briefly. Again, sounds like a tuning issue. Mark On Mon, Jul 5, 2010 at 8:44 PM, Richard Sohn = wrote: Mark, I am seeing the same at below 2500rpm, but it is practically the = same down to about 1600. I am running a carb with a 22" intake runner, = and the carburetor is not fully tuned for idle mixture yet. My gear = ratio is 3.33:1, so even at 2500 the prop speed is not an issue. Richard Sohn N2071U ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Mark Steitle=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Monday, July 05, 2010 6:51 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Flight Report Richard, =20 Yes, it is a p-port. I've got about 5 hours on it now. It runs = good, but I can't say that it runs as smooth at lower speeds (below 2500 = rpm) than the side port engine did. That may be due to some tuning = issues, maybe not. Time will tell on that. Besides, I don't run much = at lower rpm. However, above 3000 rpm, it runs better than the = side-port engine. I suspect the tangential muffler is causing a loss of = power at higher rpm. I'll explore other options later. =20 I reported earlier that at "economy cruise" settings, I picked up = 10-12 knots with the p-port engine vs. the side port engine, but that = came with a higher fuel burn. No free lunch here. This is at 5200 rpm. = I'll report later on speeds in the mid to upper 6k range. =20 Mark =20 On Mon, Jul 5, 2010 at 6:16 PM, Richard Sohn = wrote: Mark, you are flying the PP engine? right? I think this is something = worth mentioning. I believe it is the only PP flying at the time.=20 Judging by the issues you are dealing with, the PP section seems = to be a no brainer. The reason I am addressing this is the fact that = during my work on the PP single rotor, there was never any issue with = the PP during all the testing and modifications, it just keeps running = whenever I want it to, and it is running good. I am working hard on = joining you soon with my PP Rotary. Richard Sohn N2071U ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Mark Steitle=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Monday, July 05, 2010 4:18 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Flight Report Guys, Things have been a little too quiet on the list lately, so I = thought I would post a flight report on the Renesis water pump = conversion I recently completed on my 20B. =20 I recently converted my 20B to accept the Renesis water pump. = I did this after weighing the two and found that it would save 6-7 lbs. = While it was more work that I had estimated, it turned out well worth = the effort. After working through a persistent misfire issue over the = past few weeks which was cured by careful attention to the CAS setup, I = was finally able to take to the air last weekend. OAT was 69-70* @ = 2,500 msl and there was a 3000' ceiling, so I didn't go any higher. =20 Things went very well, climbing out at 6700 rpm water got to = 175*, oil to 185*. Circling at a modest 25.5" MAP, water temps dropped = to 143*, oil settled in at 160* (my oil temp target). Adding power, I = saw the oil temps starting to creap up a bit, bumping 165*. Cowl flap = was left open during the entire flight. Needless to say, I am very = pleased. =20 It should be noted that in conjuction to the Renesis water = pump, I added a Laminova oil/water exchanger. It is connected to the = coolant return line and in series with the oil/air exchanger. I = measured a 10* increase in coolant temp through the exchanger. I = haven't measured the oil temp drop yet. However I estimate the oil temp = drop through the exchanger to be 20-25*. =20 Mark =20 ------=_NextPart_000_004D_01CB1CD8.CEBC4630 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Mark,
 
I never got that low, the engine quits = at around=20 1400rpm. This low idle on your engine sounds like being the result of = the short=20 intake runner between the throttle(slide-) and the port. Would be = my=20 guess.
 
Richard Sohn
N2071U
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Mark = Steitle=20
Sent: Monday, July 05, 2010 = 9:45 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Flight = Report

Richard, 

I have witnessed a nice idle down to 1200 rpm.  There seems = to be a=20 difference in how it idles after a flight vs. just rolling it out of = the=20 hangar and running it briefly.  Again, sounds like a tuning = issue.

Mark


On Mon, Jul 5, 2010 at 8:44 PM, Richard Sohn = <res12@fairpoint.net> = wrote:
Mark,
 
I am seeing the same at below = 2500rpm, but it=20 is practically the same down to about 1600. I am running a carb with = a 22"=20 intake runner, and the carburetor is not fully tuned for idle = mixture yet.=20 My gear ratio is 3.33:1, so even at 2500 the prop speed is not an=20 issue.
 
Richard Sohn
N2071U
----- Original Message ----- =
From: = Mark Steitle
To: Rotary = motors in=20 aircraft
Sent: Monday, July 05, 2010 = 6:51=20 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: = Flight=20 Report

Richard, =20

Yes, it is a p-port.  I've got about 5 hours on it now. =  It=20 runs good, but I can't say that it runs as smooth at lower speeds = (below=20 2500 rpm) than the side port engine did.  That may be due to = some=20 tuning issues, maybe not.  Time will tell on that. =  Besides, I=20 don't run much at lower rpm.  However, above 3000 rpm, it = runs better=20 than the side-port engine.  I suspect the tangential muffler = is=20 causing a loss of power at higher rpm.  I'll explore other = options=20 later.    

I reported earlier that at "economy cruise" settings, I = picked up=20 10-12 knots with the p-port engine vs. the side port engine, but = that came=20 with a higher fuel burn.  No free lunch here.  This is = at 5200=20 rpm.  I'll report later on speeds in the mid to upper 6k = range.=20  

Mark    

On Mon, Jul 5, 2010 at 6:16 PM, Richard = Sohn <res12@fairpoint.net> wrote:
Mark,
 
you are flying the PP engine? = right? I=20 think this is something worth mentioning. I believe it is the = only PP=20 flying at the time.
Judging by the issues you are = dealing with,=20 the PP section seems to be a no brainer. The reason I am = addressing this=20 is the fact that during my work on the PP single rotor, there = was never=20 any issue with the PP during all the testing and modifications, = it just=20 keeps running whenever I want it to, and it is running good. I = am=20 working hard on joining you soon with my PP Rotary.
 
Richard = Sohn
N2071U
 
 
----- Original Message ----- =
From: Mark Steitle
To: Rotary motors=20 in aircraft
Sent: Monday, July 05, = 2010 4:18=20 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] = Flight=20 Report

Guys,
 
Things have been a little too quiet on the list lately, = so I=20 thought I would post a flight report on the Renesis water = pump=20 conversion I recently completed on my 20B. 
 
I recently converted my 20B to accept the = Renesis=20 water pump.  I did this after weighing the two and = found=20 that it would save 6-7 lbs.  While it was more work = that I=20 had estimated, it turned out well worth the effort.  = After=20 working through a persistent misfire issue over the past few = weeks=20 which was cured by careful attention to the CAS setup, I was = finally=20 able to take to the air last weekend.  OAT was 69-70* @ = 2,500 msl=20 and there was a 3000' ceiling, so I didn't go any = higher.  =20
 
Things went very well, climbing out at 6700 rpm water got = to=20 175*, oil to 185*.  Circling at a modest 25.5" = MAP, water=20 temps dropped to 143*, oil settled in at 160* (my oil temp=20 target).  Adding power, I saw the oil temps starting = to=20 creap up a bit, bumping 165*.  Cowl flap was left open = during the=20 entire flight.  Needless to say, I am very=20 pleased.  
 
It should be noted that in conjuction to the = Renesis=20 water pump, I added a Laminova oil/water exchanger.  It = is=20 connected to the coolant return line and in series with = the=20 oil/air exchanger.  I measured a 10* increase in coolant = temp=20 through the exchanger.  I haven't measured the oil = temp=20 drop yet.  However I estimate the oil temp=20 drop through the exchanger to = be 20-25*.  
 
=
Mark    


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