X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from fed1rmmtao107.cox.net ([68.230.241.39] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3.8) with ESMTP id 4364129 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Sun, 20 Jun 2010 12:14:16 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=68.230.241.39; envelope-from=rv-4mike@cox.net Received: from fed1rmimpo02.cox.net ([70.169.32.72]) by fed1rmmtao107.cox.net (InterMail vM.8.00.01.00 201-2244-105-20090324) with ESMTP id <20100620161339.KAMQ1969.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> for ; Sun, 20 Jun 2010 12:13:39 -0400 Received: from willsPC ([174.66.165.141]) by fed1rmimpo02.cox.net with bizsmtp id YGDf1e00S33Mw6604GDfLr; Sun, 20 Jun 2010 12:13:39 -0400 X-VR-Score: 0.00 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.1 cv=RDGknaWEColYBAosNzHWAUqP/VR6Ab6kioi0WieaKDU= c=1 sm=1 a=8mW0L8mY3JsA:10 a=ADBQPqJMlbwA:10 a=YndN1mfUGc/ekvXaxFpSiw==:17 a=N_7CSwNMzFpiMbrRDXEA:9 a=b0nQfLEvXDTWgIt4HIcA:7 a=IVgOHHdAlfvSES65o27sHhT2zSwA:4 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=4EJV2DOpeKGiBnOV:21 a=lHQA3ukOkz2fN_Q7:21 a=pGLkceISAAAA:8 a=Ia-xEzejAAAA:8 a=GpqF3y64e7yUmvP-o4wA:9 a=7KvFYh-FJF9cAvFf7fsA:7 a=9WLxmMEzTyVvEYm72VwfQz1259wA:4 a=MSl-tDqOz04A:10 a=EzXvWhQp4_cA:10 a=YndN1mfUGc/ekvXaxFpSiw==:117 X-CM-Score: 0.00 Message-ID: From: "Mike Wills" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: In-Reply-To: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: 13B rotary engine. Date: Sun, 20 Jun 2010 09:13:40 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_038D_01CB1058.DF5C5D90" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Importance: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 14.0.8089.726 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V14.0.8089.726 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_038D_01CB1058.DF5C5D90 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Lynn, Please expand a little on your comment, "Converting a Renesis would seem = to deliver the best of both worlds". It would seem that the side exhaust = ports in the Renesis would be potentially a significant breathing = handicap and that the PP exhaust of the 13B would be a better choice. = Maybe the benefits of no overlap outweigh the breathing handicap? Mike Wills From: Lynn Hanover=20 Sent: Sunday, June 20, 2010 8:36 AM To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: 13B rotary engine. The periphery ported engine's advantage, is that the intake port never = closes.=20 In the side ported engine the side of the rotor actually closes off the = intake port as each apex or rotor tip passes over the port. So, intake = tuning has some connection to the tuning of a piston engine.=20 The length of inlet tubing has a somewhat more profound effect on = performance than does the intake of the periphery ported engine.=20 In the Renesis (RX-8) engine, both the intake and exhaust ports are in = the irons so both are called side ports. Tuning of the intake is similar = to early side port engines. Tuning of the exhaust is similar to a low = output piston engine. Its outstanding feature is that there is never a = connection between the intake and exhaust port. So there is zero = overlap, where the intake and exhaust is open at the same time. =20 Converting a Renesis engine to periphery intake port would seem to = deliver the best of these two worlds. With the possible exception of the center iron having exhaust ports for = both front and rear rotor housings Siamesed.=20 In general the one advantage of all is the ease of intake construction. = Just two pipes into a flange to suit your throttle body or carb. Two = tubes extended from the rotor housings, A length of Silicone hose and 4 = hose clamps. A properly assembled rotary that is kept cool in both oil and water is = just about bullet proof. And bullet proof says airplane engine to me.=20 The rotary will not happily ingest anything you left too close the = aircraft. Piston engines do have an advantage in the trash eating = department. Not a factor where an air filter is installed. A side port engine could produce about 160 HP. A periphery ported engine = could produce about 180 HP.=20 The typical cruise RPM would be 5,500 to 6,000 RPM. There is very little = strain on the pieces at this low an RPM. The racing versions are used up = to 10,500 RPM with good reliability.=20 Lynn E. Hanover Racing rotaries since 1980. ------=_NextPart_000_038D_01CB1058.DF5C5D90 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Lynn,
 
Please expand a little on your comment, = "Converting a=20 Renesis would seem to deliver the best of both worlds". It would seem = that the=20 side exhaust ports in the Renesis would be potentially a significant = breathing=20 handicap and that the PP exhaust of the 13B would be a better choice. = Maybe the=20 benefits of no overlap outweigh the breathing handicap?
 
Mike Wills

Sent: Sunday, June 20, 2010 8:36 AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: 13B rotary = engine.

The periphery ported engine's advantage, is that the intake port = never=20 closes.
 
In the side ported engine the side of the rotor actually closes off = the=20 intake port as each apex or rotor tip passes over the port. So, intake = tuning=20 has some connection to the tuning of a piston engine.
 
The length of inlet tubing has a somewhat more profound effect on=20 performance than does the intake of the periphery ported = engine. 
 
In the Renesis (RX-8) engine, both the intake and exhaust ports are = in the=20 irons so both are called side ports. Tuning of the intake is similar to = early=20 side port engines. Tuning of the exhaust is similar to a low output = piston=20 engine. Its outstanding feature is that there is never a connection = between the=20 intake and exhaust port. So there is zero overlap, where the intake and = exhaust=20 is open at the same time.  
 
Converting a Renesis engine to periphery intake port would seem to = deliver=20 the best of these two worlds.
 
With the possible exception of the center iron having exhaust ports = for=20 both front and rear rotor housings Siamesed. 
 
In general the one advantage of all is the ease of intake = construction.=20 Just two pipes into a flange to suit your throttle body or carb. Two = tubes=20 extended from the rotor housings, A length of Silicone hose and 4 hose=20 clamps.
 
A properly assembled rotary that is kept cool in both oil and water = is just=20 about bullet proof. And bullet proof says airplane engine to = me. 
 
The rotary will not happily ingest anything you left too close the=20 aircraft. Piston engines do have an advantage in the trash eating = department.=20 Not a factor where an air filter is installed.
 
A side port engine could produce about 160 HP. A periphery ported = engine=20 could produce about 180 HP. 
 
The typical cruise RPM would be 5,500 to 6,000 RPM. There is very = little=20 strain on the pieces at this low an RPM. The racing versions are used up = to=20 10,500 RPM with good reliability. 
 
Lynn E. Hanover
 
Racing rotaries since 1980.   
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