X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from mail-bw0-f226.google.com ([209.85.218.226] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3.4) with ESMTP id 4177024 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 24 Mar 2010 08:54:55 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.218.226; envelope-from=msteitle@gmail.com Received: by bwz26 with SMTP id 26so1909449bwz.27 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2010 05:54:19 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=7mAmS97A5ju4VDWa7hJm7pmhNCW4ngWjj1xnnF6EJK4=; b=M90yitOPhIPH+HcNQfg/rlC0J/EBgF5Kz2PwxEerfibnfImNvGhF4MYvVL8tDF6IVW dJE3mk1DyP01Af1zH/Ca9umi8lJJJ1PurJn+Pj7oLeP9NTVVoJFHrCCi+g1xd4WW3Hqe K6n/qKaC5w9J/QO2ynehYvmnQYd/du68DIkt8= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; b=Uz6lKRRU//ALSHqWfYGT8p/0i54jmeqvJalXdQ6xcVpEvrpBaaYx8ciHZ9igFZ5t4G ZGX6ucXiXqGXn+LduntCrhp4uqYnxahpdS19DBkdeQzuQlKypbOQOlh5jobJm/ygiV74 ndLX5wEAUuFv7f54K2Q78O23UN8MBWE4ul5Fk= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.204.33.194 with SMTP id i2mr5313436bkd.140.1269435259091; Wed, 24 Mar 2010 05:54:19 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 07:54:19 -0500 Message-ID: <5cf132c1003240554m33ed0176p2f27a073f6b5295f@mail.gmail.com> Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Turbo Planning From: Mark Steitle To: Rotary motors in aircraft Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=00032555a0caaefff504828b6d43 --00032555a0caaefff504828b6d43 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Don, Lynn H. has stated on more than one occasion that the rotary makes best power when oil temps are in the 160* range. I didn't give this a lot of concern in my early days of flying behind my N/A 20B. My oil temps were normally at or over 200*. However, after replacing a defective ol cooler, my oil temps now run in the 160-165* range and I picked up an extra 7-8 mph on the top end. Pretty easy horsepower gain when you stop and think about it. Mark S. On Tue, Mar 23, 2010 at 11:26 PM, Don Wallker wrote: > So here is where I am at so far. For those of you just tuning in, I am > flying a Renesis powered RV-8, with all of Tracy's stuff and a Catto76/88 > prop. Flys great, and I'm getting comfortable with it. It's just not > getting enough power. About 6080 static and 1450 ft/mn climb at about 2200 > rpm prop at 100 mph and that's at full throttle. Max indicated at 8000ft, > 54 degree day, 2440 on the prop and 205 oil and 200 degree water. So I need > more cooling and more power. I'm going to attack both at once and get it > all done. > I'm roughly basing these changes on what Dave Leonard has done. He's been > through all this and has a fast powerful and dependable turbo set up in a > similar airplane. RV-6. And it runs cool! For more info and pictures, > check out Dave's website n4vy.rotaryroster.net Also a lot of ideas from > John, Scott, Chris, Steve etc. > > Radiator: C&R 3"x22x20, mounted under the oil pan. A 1" inlet and outlet > with short runs to the new water manifold that Ed is making. I'm hoping I > wont' have to build up the cowl, just cut into it, but I doubt it. I will > also have to increase the exit area and am not sure how to do that yet. > > Oil cooler: Dave was using a Setrab, but they kept leaking. Tracy is using > a 30 row C&R cooler on his 3 rotor.PT# oc 238 30 an10, They also make a 25 > row that is about the same size as the setrab and should work and fit nicely > behind the right cheek and provide a nice short oil line run. > > Throttle body: Probably a 75mm Mustang > > Intercooler: Dave is using a stock 91 Rx-7 one and I will probably use the > same. Hey, it fits! There will almost certainly need to be some > modifications to the inlet and outlet. I have a Tig and a neighbor who is a > great welder. We just tack things there, as I don't have enough power in the > hanger for continuous welding. > > Intake: I'm going to try and keep it totally on the left side of the engine > and will use the existing Rx-8 lower aluminum intake manifold. I'll cut it > down, grind it level and have a plate welded on top, with 4 holes going to > the intake tubes and short velocity stacks welded on. On top and around > will be the intake manifold itself. Just an aluminum box with a throttle > body attached. I'm not sure just where yet. It depends on how much room > there is. Combustion air will flow into the cowl, possibly from down by the > radiator, or from a naca scoop on the side, to the turbo compressor, > through it to the inner cooler and through it and back to the throttle body. > Not sure where the injectors will go, but I'll try to use the existing > injector holes. May have to use the Simple Digital injector mounts. Note, > fire sleeve all fuel lines. It solved half my vapor lock problems. > > Turbo: will be mounted on the left side of the engine and a little back > from directly out from the exhaust. May be 3 to 4 inches. This should give > me room for the inner cooler and intake manifold. But I may not have room > for the fuel pumps and filters and they may have to go back inside the > cabin, by my feet. Not a bad idea. I'll use 321 ss and make an equal > length exhaust manifold with a waste gate port that will run to the output > side of the turbine. The exhaust out of the turbine will bend down and out > the back cowl exit to a muffler. I'm going to try the new Burns all SS > muffler that some of the rotary racers are using. They use stainless steel > scruble for the packing. Can't burn that out! and it's 3 lbs and my > existing Hushpower is 9. There will be a oil line going to the turbo with > a normally open solenoid on it and an exit line out. It will be 5/8ths and > run down and around the engine to the other side where it will go through > the side of the engine, like I have the RD-c return line. I don't want to > have to pull the engine out of the mount, but that is the only way. If > someone knows a better place to run it back into, let me know. The turbo > will be supported by more than the exhaust. When the exhaust is finished, > it will be sent for Jet Hot coating. There will be a SS shroud around the > turbo and the same for the exhaust. I still don't know if I should use a > wet or dry turbo housing, but more on that in the next post. > Your thoughts, comments and questions are encouraged. > > Don Walker > N113BR, 28 hours > > > > -- > Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ > Archive and UnSub: > http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html > --00032555a0caaefff504828b6d43 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Don,
=A0
Lynn H. has stated on more than one occasion that the rotary makes bes= t power when oil temps are=A0in the=A0160* range.=A0 I didn't give this= a lot of concern in my early days of flying behind=A0my N/A=A020B.=A0 My o= il temps were normally at or over 200*.=A0 However, after replacing a defec= tive ol cooler, my oil temps now run in the 160-165* range and I=A0picked u= p=A0an extra 7-8 mph on the top end.=A0 Pretty easy horsepower gain when yo= u=A0stop and=A0think about it.=A0 =A0
=A0
Mark S.

On Tue, Mar 23, 2010 at 11:26 PM, Don Wallker <drwalker@gbis.com<= /a>> wrote:
So here is where I am at so far.= For those of you just tuning in, I am flying a Renesis powered RV-8, with = all of Tracy's stuff and a Catto76/88 prop. =A0Flys great, and I'm = getting =A0comfortable with it. =A0It's just not getting enough power. = =A0About 6080 static and 1450 ft/mn climb at about 2200 rpm prop at 100 mph= and that's at full throttle. =A0Max indicated at 8000ft, 54 degree day= , 2440 on the prop and 205 oil and 200 degree water. =A0So I need more cool= ing and more power. =A0I'm going to attack both at once and get it all = done.
I'm roughly basing these changes on what Dave Leonard has done. =A0He&#= 39;s been through all this and has a fast powerful and dependable turbo set= up in a similar airplane. RV-6. =A0And it runs cool! =A0For more info and = pictures, check out Dave's website n4vy.rotaryroster.net =A0 Also a lot of ideas f= rom John, Scott, Chris, Steve etc.

Radiator: C&R 3"x22x20, mounted under the oil pan. =A0A 1"= ; inlet and outlet with short runs to the new water manifold that Ed is mak= ing. I'm hoping I wont' have to build up =A0the cowl, just cut into= it, but I doubt it. =A0I will also have to increase the exit area and am n= ot sure how to do that yet.

Oil cooler: Dave was using a Setrab, but they kept leaking. =A0Tracy is= using a 30 row C&R cooler on his 3 rotor.PT# oc 238 30 an10, =A0 They = also make a 25 row that is about the same size as the setrab and should wor= k and fit nicely behind the right cheek and provide a nice short oil line r= un.

Throttle body: =A0Probably a 75mm Mustang

Intercooler: =A0Dave i= s using a stock 91 Rx-7 one and I will probably use the same. =A0Hey, it fi= ts! =A0There will almost certainly need to be some modifications to the inl= et and outlet. =A0I have a Tig and a neighbor who is a great welder. We jus= t tack things there, as I don't have enough power in the hanger for con= tinuous welding.

Intake: I'm going to try and keep it totally on the left side of th= e engine and will use the existing Rx-8 lower aluminum intake manifold. =A0= I'll cut it down, grind it level and have a plate welded on top, with 4= holes going to the intake tubes and short velocity stacks welded on. =A0On= top and around will be the intake manifold itself. =A0Just an aluminum box= with a throttle body attached. =A0I'm not sure just where yet. =A0It d= epends on how much room there is. =A0Combustion air will flow into the cowl= , possibly from down by the radiator, or from a naca scoop on the side, =A0= to the turbo compressor, through it to the inner cooler and through it and = back to the throttle body. =A0Not sure where the injectors will go, but I&#= 39;ll try to use the existing injector holes. =A0 May have to use the Simpl= e Digital injector mounts. =A0Note, fire sleeve all fuel lines. =A0It solve= d half my vapor lock problems.

Turbo: will be mounted on the left side of the engine and a little back= from directly out from the exhaust. =A0May be 3 to 4 inches. =A0This shoul= d give me room for the inner cooler and intake manifold. =A0But I may not h= ave room for the fuel pumps and filters and they may have to go back inside= the cabin, by my feet. =A0Not a bad idea. =A0I'll use 321 ss and make = an equal length exhaust manifold with a waste gate port that will run to th= e output side of the turbine. =A0The exhaust out of the turbine will bend d= own and out the back cowl exit to a muffler. =A0I'm going to try the ne= w Burns all SS muffler that some of the rotary racers are using. =A0They us= e stainless steel scruble for the packing. =A0Can't burn that out! and = it's 3 lbs and my existing Hushpower is 9. =A0 =A0There will be a oil l= ine going to the turbo with a normally open solenoid on it and an exit line= out. =A0It will be 5/8ths and run down and around the engine to the other = side where it will go through the side of the engine, like I have the RD-c = return line. =A0I don't want to have to pull the engine out of the moun= t, but that is the only way. =A0If someone knows a better =A0place to run i= t back into, let me know. =A0The turbo will be supported by more than the e= xhaust. =A0When the exhaust is finished, it will be sent for Jet Hot coatin= g. =A0There will be a SS shroud around the turbo and =A0the same for the ex= haust. =A0I still don't know if I should use a wet or dry turbo housing= , but more on that in the next post.
=A0 Your thoughts, comments and questions are encouraged.

Don Walker=
N113BR, 28 hours



--
Homepage:= =A0http://www.flyr= otary.com/
Archive and UnSub: =A0 http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists= /flyrotary/List.html

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