X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from wf-out-1314.google.com ([209.85.200.170] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.2.14) with ESMTP id 3635291 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Thu, 07 May 2009 14:59:58 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.200.170; envelope-from=rwstracy@gmail.com Received: by wf-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id 28so742352wff.25 for ; Thu, 07 May 2009 11:59:21 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=pvLBjSkAXjcJD2l2DuayUOcksp9X7lYRPrzOQdoNxkU=; b=EtDr6Lu3UZH8s0xG2ELLBm+AScTyLsrRk1PYDM65RHmITSAbfKGARiiu/PUqDim61G 3xBv+qzXbDEGgh+v/RzP0WR64GzAOt+UNRQyA68gdgyAXGIfzaR/JLKugnrrNJ3SVn5q 3mU9jTNTFfiSwMA3Uq9wVhIxKDFY6SDpQ+xx4= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; b=KABR7qz2gQoaKW9cZERF/6qeQo3CfOX1nV2FoPVHkOlUd7+3WfFIJls+UfSEHpZKfH rKKlPNCJdxlN7UWBe6bTl9XodcVbk81t/mMGHfy/ieEVD8JaSMEDiIshYoD1uic/FFeZ eDUd/Lc5hu7RwgEUo1yl5flmFK494ypGa1Ebc= MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: rwstracy@gmail.com Received: by 10.143.43.7 with SMTP id v7mr1101363wfj.194.1241722761029; Thu, 07 May 2009 11:59:21 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Thu, 7 May 2009 14:59:21 -0400 X-Google-Sender-Auth: 7bcd19e1beca34df Message-ID: <1b4b137c0905071159v5461d246g68743b994332571b@mail.gmail.com> Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Snubber was[FlyRotary] Re: Initial Engine Startup From: Tracy Crook To: Rotary motors in aircraft Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001636e0b38614aa450469571cf9 --001636e0b38614aa450469571cf9 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mike, I looked up the program notes and you should be in good shape. Everything updated after 4 - 1 - 07 looks like it has the snubber fix and your instructions indicate that the new Mode 2 is in as well. The name snubber comes from any device that absorbs the energy produced by an inductor (a fuel injector in this case) when the current to it is switched off. Credit to Steve B. for putting the finger on this factor. Tracy On Thu, May 7, 2009 at 11:01 AM, Ed Anderson wro= te: > Hi Mike, > > > > Tracy gets busy as you can imagine, I=92ll try to answer your question ab= out > the =93snubber=94 fix. > > > > Basically, it was discovered by a member of this list that the collapsing > magnetic field of the injector coils were having a more significant effec= t > on injector open time than first realized. In short, the injector on tim= e > was not just that commanded by the EC2/3 but was also affected by this > generated voltage of the collapsing field. Since it was not a fixed thin= g > (depending on several factors), it could make tuning a bit more of a hass= le > to tune =96 no danger of your engine quitting or anything drastic like th= at > because you could compensate (to some extent) by your tuning and manual > mixture control. But, because the effect varied =96 tuning was not > necessarily as easy and precise as could be desired. > > > > In any case, a fix to such excursions in other fields are known as > =93snubber=94 fixes =96 I presume because they =93Snub=94 out the problem= . Tracy will > generally automatically add the =93snubber=92=92 fix the next time you ha= ve reason > to send your EC2/3 in for an upgrade. > > > > I flew for years without the fix, so it is not something you have to do > immediately, but should at some point. You will likely need to retune yo= ur > fuel map afterwards, so I would not spend a LOT of time doing that at th= is > point unless you do have the =93Snubber=94 fix. > > > > My 0.02 worth > > > > Ed > > > > Ed Anderson > > Rv-6A N494BW Rotary Powered > > Matthews, NC > > eanderson@carolina.rr.com > > http://www.andersonee.com > > http://www.dmack.net/mazda/index.html > > http://www.flyrotary.com/ > > http://members.cox.net/rogersda/rotary/configs.htm#N494BW > > http://www.rotaryaviation.com/Rotorhead%20Truth.htm > ------------------------------ > > *From:* Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] *O= n > Behalf Of *Mike Fontenot > *Sent:* Thursday, May 07, 2009 10:16 AM > *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft > *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Re: Initial Engine Startup > > > > Tracy, > > You wrote: > >>What was the date of last update or service? Might be able to tell abo= ut > the snubber update from that.<< > > Here is the update info for my EC2 / EM2 combo, which was in October 2007= : > > Looking at my manuals I see: > > EC2 Manual: Model: EC2 . AD Serial# 634 Date: 19-Oct-07 . On the > first page of the manual, at the top it says: > > RWS EC2-AD Suzuki-4 ENGINE CONTROLLER 10-17-07 > > Page 10 has the section: MODE 2 INJECTION DYNAMIC RANGE ADJUST > > EM2 Manual: Model: EM2 . C3 Serial# 197 Date: 19-Oct-07 > > Am I Snubberfied? Has Snubberfication occurred. Is my system > Snubberlicious? > > I need coffee. > > -- > Mike > > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > Mike Fontenot > Apex Consulting & Services LLC > Lakewood, Colorado > 303 / 731-6645 > mikef AT apexconsultingservices DOT com > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > --001636e0b38614aa450469571cf9 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mike,=A0 I looked up the program notes and you should be in good shape.=A0 = Everything updated after 4 - 1 - 07 looks like it has the snubber fix and y= our instructions indicate that the new Mode 2 is in as well.=A0=A0 The name= snubber comes from any device that absorbs the energy produced by an induc= tor (a fuel injector in this case) when the current to it is switched off.= =A0

Credit to Steve B. for putting the finger on this factor.

Tracy=

On Thu, May 7, 2009 at 11:01 AM, Ed Ande= rson <eanderson@carolina.rr.com> wrote:

Hi Mike,

=A0

Tracy gets busy as you can imagine, I=92ll try to answer = your question about the =93snubber=94 fix.

=A0

Basically, it was discovered by a = member of this list that the collapsing magnetic field of the injector coils were having a more significant effect on injector open time than first realized.=A0 In short, the injector on time was not just that commanded by the EC2/3 but was also affected by this generated voltage of the collapsing field.=A0 Since it was not a fixed thing (depending on several factors), it could make tuning a bit more of a hassle to tune =96 no danger of your engine quitting or anything drastic like that because you could compensate = (to some extent) by your tuning and manual mixture control.=A0 But, because the effect varied =96 tuning was not necessarily as easy and precise as=A0 could be desired.

=A0

In any case, a fix to such excursi= ons in other fields are known as =93snubber=94 fixes =96 I presume because they =93Snub=94 out the problem.=A0 Tracy will generally automatically add the =93snubber=92=92 fix the next time you have reason to send your EC2/3 in for an upgrade.=A0

=A0

I flew for years without the fix, = so it is not something you have to do immediately, but should at some point.=A0 You will likely need to retune your fuel map afterwards, so I would not spend a=A0 LOT of time doing that at this point unless you do have the =93Snubber= =94 fix.

=A0

My 0.02 worth

=A0

Ed

=A0

From: Ro= tary motors in aircraft [mailto:fl= yrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Mike Fontenot
Sent: Thursday, May 07, 20= 09 10:16 AM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: I= nitial Engine Startup

=A0

Tracy,

You wrote:
>>What was the date of last update or service?=A0 Might be able to tell about the snubber update from that.<<

Here is the update info for my EC2 / EM2 combo, which was in October 2007:<= br>
Looking at my manuals I see:

EC2 Manual: Model: EC2 . AD=A0=A0 Serial# 634=A0=A0=A0 Date: 19-Oct-07=A0=A0 . On the first page of the manual, at the top it says:

RWS EC2-AD Suzuki-4 ENGINE CONTROLLER=A0 10-17-07

Page 10 has the section: MODE 2 INJECTION DYNAMIC RANGE ADJUST

EM2 Manual: Model: EM2 . C3=A0=A0 Serial# 197=A0=A0 Date: 19-Oct-07

Am I Snubberfied? Has Snubberfication occurred. Is my system Snubberlicious= ?

I need coffee.

--
Mike

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
Mike Fontenot
Apex Consulting & Services LLC
Lakewood, Colorado
303 / 731-6645
mikef AT apexconsultingservices DOT com
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D


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