X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from qw-out-2122.google.com ([74.125.92.26] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.2.12) with ESMTP id 3502283 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 07:38:34 -0500 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=74.125.92.26; envelope-from=msteitle@gmail.com Received: by qw-out-2122.google.com with SMTP id 8so276270qwh.25 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 04:37:59 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=LYFlKbHPE3Tjs9BIWnpJfYreE6bSBb3OiWQe/elRVxI=; b=QGOSmEhJ9b58D4DuPfJ63WBLIXnFoGDAJHwIr+LfMQ/JPFifFEpB0/yp9mnmmxLIZ4 3OlbF93FIBCXmgDaOT1IZF0oVhk71vGoITgdYTqjff41hkXYxJumNp80w3ZsozT67rTO qjljpGgKD7z0x5qgyhoF3bCj0U/7+3aPE1j8U= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; b=PbuLeHi2/WwCUyk/ni1uTy23ja4UpPiEE5I9CmP3f1oSeQo45i6R2DoSW8wIXlIuzE 4HuYHJ6yftNYaxLzCTNxGnSHHgmRRzkpUCpvXBgXEZtuNoCMSjep39AQQOTnQ/LOGsK8 lBR8VVw4vQd9GLyaqf80FEk3GHbQprYgnTgTQ= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.224.14.196 with SMTP id h4mr1337312qaa.8.1235133479278; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 04:37:59 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 06:37:59 -0600 Message-ID: <5cf132c0902200437u6aed48bcpbe9e8d930d82a07c@mail.gmail.com> Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Second flight From: Mark Steitle To: Rotary motors in aircraft Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=0015175cb0ce485aa3046358ecdb --0015175cb0ce485aa3046358ecdb Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I dont think I'd have even noticed this bog if the tower hadnt asked me to extend my downwind. I guarantee that your pax will notice. ;-) Mark S. On Thu, Feb 19, 2009 at 9:28 PM, Mike Wills wrote: > Hey Chuck, Thanks. Good to hear from you - thought you'd dropped off the > face of the earth. > > For the moment I think I'm going to leave my staging point as is, though i > may spend a little more time trying to tune it. I need to fiigure out whats > normal for how i will operate the airplane. I dont think I'd have even > noticed this bog if the tower hadnt asked me to extend my downwind. It > appears that at my pattern speed, setting power to just hold altitude puts > me right at the staging point. I think I just need to remember not to do > that again. > > My -6A used to shimmy also. Lowering tire pressure in it did help somewhat, > but never cured it. In the -4 lower pressures arent really a good option. I > screwed up installing the wheel pants and they sit pretty low on the wheels. > With lower pressures I think they will probably hit the ground on rough > patches. > > Looking forward to seeing you at Copperstate this year! > > Mike Wills > RV-4 N144MW > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* Chuck Dunlap > *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft > *Sent:* Wednesday, February 18, 2009 10:31 PM > *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Re: Second flight > > Hey Mike > > It sure is great to hear you finally got your project off the groundJCongratulations!! Seems like all that time you spent really paid off if you > met your goal on the second flight. I am impressed! Must be nice to have the > latest EC2 and Ed's instrument for tuning. I still have the original EC1, I > always have to remember to richen up the mixture when pulling back on power > through the staging point 13" to avoid a hiccup. 14" is about my minimum MAP > for level flight, so 12 -13 is what I use on approach. > > Try lowering the tire pressure to avoid the shimmys. > > Sorry I am so far behind reading the posts > > > > Chuck Dunlap > > RV6 13B > > > ------------------------------ > > *From:* Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] *On > Behalf Of *Mike Wills > *Sent:* Sunday, February 15, 2009 9:52 PM > *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft > *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Second flight > > > > Spent the last month addressing issues uncovered during my first flight. > Today was the day for flight number 2. OAT was in the low 50s. Temps during > climbout up to 6,000 were good. Leveled out and stayed at full throttle for > a couple of minutes just to see what happens. Saw indicated airspeed in the > mid 150KTS range. RPM was 5500. Both were still creeping up when I throttled > back. Looks like I may be slightly over-propped. Temps still fine. > > > > Throttled back to 5000 RPM and just flew racetracks over the airport for > an hour. My flight test area is very restrictive. I've got a huge piece of > the desert to the east but have to cross a 3500' mountain and 30 - 40 miles > of rugged terrain to get there. Not until I have a few more hours on it in > flight and have 100% confidence. I have the Mexican border 2 miles south, > Class B 2 miles north and the Pacific Ocean 5 miles west. So racetracks over > the airport are going to be the norm for a few hours. > > > > So, 5,000', 5,000 RPM, roughly 20 - 21" MAP, and indicating 140 KTS. Temps > 170 on the coolant and 168 on the oil. I've already met my goal for this > airplane on the second flight - this airplane is a little faster than my old > RV-6A was at equal power settings. The -6A had a 160 HP Lyc in it. > > > > Looks like the revised static system has solved my airspeed indication > problems. Stall speeds are in line with the Vans book numbers and airspeed > correlates pretty well with the GPS groundspeed. Still need more left trim > tab. > > > > The engine ran great. Anyone trying to tune up Tracy's EC2 without either > having an EM2/3 or Ed Anderson's EFISM, you're wasting your time. I spent > the better part of a year tweaking the MAP table and thought I had it pretty > well done. On my first flight I spent a fair amount of time fiddling with > mixtures and had a couple of rough running spots. I installed Ed's EFISM and > spent 2 days tweaking. In the process I got the engine running smoother than > it ever has and now have it idling nicely at 1350 RPM. Thats 300 RPM lower > than I was ever able to get it previously. In my opinion you really HAVE to > have some sort of indication of what is loaded in the MAP table to > effectively tune it. > > > > The only hiccup was when I came in to land. Tower asked for me to extend > my downwind for traffic so I added a little power to hold altitude. And > ended up setting the power right at the injector staging point, which still > seems to run a little lean. Nothing like having the engine cough just as the > runway is receding over your left shoulder. Took me a couple of seconds to > realize what was going on and then added a little power and that cleared it > up. > > > > Then managed to bounce the landing. How many landings can I log on one > approach? Oh well, I guess I'm a little tailwheel rusty. And without the > cowl cheeks the view over the nose is very different so I havent quite got > the pitch attitude figured out yet. > > > > Other impressions. The airplane is loud, but not painfully so. At least > not from the pilot's seat. The handling and control power still seem quite a > bit better than my RV-6A (which was great). Not really clear why but most of > my flying in the -6A I had someone in the right seat so maybe the weight? > Other than the rudder, the airplane flies perfectly straight. > > > > All things considered I'm real happy. This flight was considerably less > stressful than the first and I actually was able to enjoy it. I honestly > dont remember a lot of the first flight. Also, I took my glider data logger > with me on this flight. I havent downloaded it yet, but when I do I'll know > more about speeds, climb rate, etc. > > > > Dont know how you guys feel about these flight reports. Give me some > feedback if you want more as my testing progresses. I know that I like > reading about other's flight experiences as it motivated me to keep going. > After 13 years of building I'll tell you, its worth it. Now I wish I'd > pressed harder to get it done sooner. > > > > Next flight will have to wait until I get gear leg stiffeners added. > Classic RV - pretty bad shimmy on the roll out after landing. 38.5 hours to > go! > > > > Mike Wills > > RV-4 N144MW > > --0015175cb0ce485aa3046358ecdb Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <snip>
I dont=20 think I'd have even noticed this bog if the tower hadnt asked me to ext= end my=20 downwind.

<snip>

I guarantee that your pax will noti= ce.  ;-)

Mark S.


On Thu, = Feb 19, 2009 at 9:28 PM, Mike Wills <rv-4mike@cox.net> wrote:
Hey Chuck, Thanks. Good to hear from y= ou - thought=20 you'd dropped off the face of the earth.
 
For the moment I think I'm going t= o leave my=20 staging point as is, though i may spend a little more time trying to tune i= t. I=20 need to fiigure out whats normal for how i will operate the airplane. I don= t=20 think I'd have even noticed this bog if the tower hadnt asked me to ext= end my=20 downwind. It appears that at my pattern speed, setting power to just hold= =20 altitude puts me right at the staging point. I think I just need to remembe= r not=20 to do that again.
 
My -6A used to shimmy also. Lowering t= ire pressure=20 in it did help somewhat, but never cured it. In the -4 lower pressures aren= t=20 really a good option. I screwed up installing the wheel pants and they sit= =20 pretty low on the wheels. With lower pressures I think they will probably h= it=20 the ground on rough patches.
 
Looking forward to seeing you at Coppe= rstate this=20 year!
 
Mike Wills
RV-4 N144MW
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Chuck Dunlap=20
Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2009= 10:31=20 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Second=20 flight

Hey=20 Mike

It sure is great to=20 hear you finally got your project off the groundJ Congratulations!!=20 Seems like all that time you spent really paid off if you met your goal o= n the=20 second flight. I am impressed! Must be nice to have the latest EC2 and Ed= 's=20 instrument for tuning. I still have the original EC1, I always have to=20 remember to richen up the mixture when pulling back on power through the= =20 staging point 13" to avoid a hiccup. 14" is about my minimum MAP for leve= l=20 flight, so 12 -13 is what I use on approach.

Try lowering the tire=20 pressure to avoid the shimmys.

Sorry I am so far=20 behind reading the posts

 

Chuck=20 Dunlap

RV6=20 13B

 


From: = Rotary=20 motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Mike Wills
Sent: Sunday, February 15, 2009 9:52=20 PM
To: Rotary motors = in=20 aircraft
Subject: [Fl= yRotary]=20 Second flight

 

Spent the last month addressing=20 issues uncovered during my first flight. Today was the day for flight num= ber=20 2. OAT was in the low 50s. Temps during climbout up to 6,000 were good.= =20 Leveled out and stayed at full throttle for a couple of minutes just to s= ee=20 what happens. Saw indicated airspeed in the mid 150KTS range. RPM was 550= 0.=20 Both were still creeping up when I throttled back. Looks like I may be=20 slightly over-propped. Temps still fine.

 

 Throttled back to 5000 RPM=20 and just flew racetracks over the airport for an hour. My flight test are= a is=20 very restrictive. I've got a huge piece of the desert to the east but= have to=20 cross a 3500' mountain and 30 - 40 miles of rugged terrain to get the= re. Not=20 until I have a few more hours on it in flight and have 100% confidence. I= have=20 the Mexican border 2 miles south, Class B 2 miles north and the Pacific O= cean 5 miles west. So racetracks over the=20 airport are going to be the norm for a few=20 hours.

 

 So, 5,000', 5,000 RPM,=20 roughly 20 - 21" MAP, and indicating 140 KTS. Temps 170 on the coola= nt and 168=20 on the oil. I've already met my goal for this airplane on the se= cond=20 flight - this airplane is a little faster than my old RV-6A was at equal = power=20 settings. The -6A had a 160 HP Lyc in it.

 

 Looks like the revised=20 static system has solved my airspeed indication problems. Stall speeds ar= e in=20 line with the Vans book numbers and airspeed correlates pretty well with = the=20 GPS groundspeed. Still need more left trim=20 tab.

 

 The engine ran great. Anyone=20 trying to tune up Tracy's EC2 without either having an EM2/3 or=20 Ed Anderson's EFISM, you're wasting your time. I spent the better= part of a=20 year tweaking the MAP table and thought I had it pretty well done. On my = first=20 flight I spent a fair amount of time fiddling with mixtures and had a cou= ple=20 of rough running spots. I installed Ed's EFISM and spent 2 days tweak= ing. In=20 the process I got the engine running smoother than it ever has and now ha= ve it=20 idling nicely at 1350 RPM. Thats 300 RPM lower than I was ever able to ge= t it=20 previously. In my opinion you really HAVE to have some sort of indic= ation=20 of what is loaded in the MAP table to effectively tune=20 it.

 

 The only hiccup was when I=20 came in to land. Tower asked for me to extend my downwind for traffic so = I=20 added a little power to hold altitude. And ended up setting the power rig= ht at=20 the injector staging point, which still seems to run a little lean. Nothi= ng=20 like having the engine cough just as the runway is receding over your lef= t=20 shoulder. Took me a couple of seconds to realize what was going on and th= en=20 added a little power and that cleared it=20 up.

 

 Then managed to bounce the=20 landing. How many landings can I log on one approach? Oh well, I guess I&= #39;m a=20 little tailwheel rusty. And without the cowl cheeks the view over the nos= e is=20 very different so I havent quite got the pitch attitude figured out=20 yet.

 

 Other impressions. The=20 airplane is loud, but not painfully so. At least not from the pilot's= seat.=20 The handling and control power still seem quite a bit better than my RV-6= A=20 (which was great). Not really clear why but most of my flying in the -6A = I had=20 someone in the right seat so maybe the weight? Other than the rudder, the= =20 airplane flies perfectly straight.

 

 All things considered I'm=20 real happy. This flight was considerably less stressful than the first an= d I=20 actually was able to enjoy it. I honestly dont remember a lot of the firs= t=20 flight. Also, I took my glider data logger with me on this flight. I have= nt=20 downloaded it yet, but when I do I'll know more about speeds, climb r= ate,=20 etc.

 

 Dont know how you guys feel=20 about these flight reports. Give me some feedback if you want more as my= =20 testing progresses. I know that I like reading about other's flight= =20 experiences as it motivated me to keep going. After 13 years of building = I'll=20 tell you, its worth it. Now I wish I'd pressed harder to get it done= =20 sooner.

 

 Next flight will have to=20 wait until I get gear leg stiffeners added. Classic RV - pretty bad shimm= y on=20 the roll out after landing. 38.5 hours to=20 go!

 

Mike=20 Wills

RV-4=20 N144MW


--0015175cb0ce485aa3046358ecdb--