X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from wf-out-1314.google.com ([209.85.200.169] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.2.1) with ESMTP id 2827902 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Tue, 01 Apr 2008 15:05:15 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.200.169; envelope-from=msteitle@gmail.com Received: by wf-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id 28so2318510wfa.25 for ; Tue, 01 Apr 2008 12:04:35 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; bh=S6gG7zucFG21FlSEj4Nb0Ygunm0xgR20J2we/fYW+Hg=; b=BhejKFdIx4r3ZiY9sH6nHV8AOOdHPXGXlHnAv59nwKRfcycXofb+GCI7Um3A4iPVSqLKHpVHPyDN0Y1Cd9LF2aAwM+NFzMKsOuLrM7OwruSuG5CcKz4jaSjwssYMYqGtWGoexCjVwwiumKIa28LXPCWfdS70jxuG4kwoBat7jDA= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=H3iSAYZpAzl85rqlNXYkNvx9nwN9i51yfp4lgQTknbwbbBWj7KXaBvmI5WTHgQiRsDuAeh46Jbg/EI+15TGf14PbZ3/X1OjzZTTB9sucJSi2+t/sd58AAa49ftjOhDKYGyiuopSlot8CRVJVOSLjuzcUihMf01s0wrOtxPe6Uvo= Received: by 10.142.171.6 with SMTP id t6mr5200990wfe.173.1207076674684; Tue, 01 Apr 2008 12:04:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.70.41.3 with HTTP; Tue, 1 Apr 2008 12:04:34 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <5cf132c0804011204p62fa8e65s3d9d6615892cefe9@mail.gmail.com> Date: Tue, 1 Apr 2008 14:04:34 -0500 From: "Mark Steitle" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Super-Tech was [FlyRotary] Re: 2-stroke oil In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_17923_21296378.1207076674665" References: ------=_Part_17923_21296378.1207076674665 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Ed, So, that is how Tracy managed to win the SNF 100... he premixed Wal-Mart Super-Tech 2-stroke oil with his fuel. Good thing the tech inspectors didn't catch him doing that. Just goes to show, you learn a new "racer's trick" every day. Does Lynn know about this? LOL Mark On 4/1/08, Ed Anderson wrote: > > Ah, yes, Mark, important point! > > Since it is not mineral based, there is less lowering of Octane rating > of fuel mixture and therefore less likely hood of detonation. This enabl= es > me to run those rare 20:1 compression ratio rotors and produce over 300HP > with my 13B. Couldn't do it without my Super-Tech Wall-Mart Oil. But, > don't tell anyone else my secret {:>) > > Ed > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* Mark Steitle > *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft > *Sent:* Tuesday, April 01, 2008 2:06 PM > *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Re: Super-Tech was [FlyRotary] Re: 2-stroke oil > > > Ed, > > Interesting that it says it is synthetic based. > > Mark > > > On 4/1/08, Ed Anderson wrote: > > > > Al, back some time ago when I was using some very expensive 2 stroke > > oils (like over $4.00/quart) , I decided to do some research. I came t= o the > > conclusion that the Marine 2 stroke oils were probably as good as was n= eeded > > for our Rotary application. Some of the 2 stroke oils designed for air > > cooled engines apparently have different formulations to cope with the > > higher temps associated. In any case, I decided the Wall-Mart Marine 2 > > stroke Super-Tech which meets TC-W3 standards(on the back label) (and m= uch > > less costly) was more than good enough. > > > > I no longer can find the source, but this oil was reportedly produced b= y > > PENNZOIL for Wall-Mart. > > > > http://pennzoil.com/products/marine/index.html > > > > I have been using it for 4 years without any problem. > > > > FWIW > > > > Ed > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > *From:* Al Gietzen > > *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft > > *Sent:* Tuesday, April 01, 2008 12:48 PM > > *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Re: 2-stroke oil > > > > > > > > For the premix oil I use any good BIA cert. TCW-3 2-stroke oil mixed > > 50-50 with MMO both of which come from Walmart. Any of the Redline > > 2-stroke oils would be excellent, including the snomobile stuff. > > > > > > > > The only 2-stroke oil I could find at the local Walmart was called > > Super-Tech, and I couldn't find any certifications on it anywhere. Is = MMO > > proven for this application? My research also indicates that the TCW-3 > > rating only is not recommended for watercraft (water-cooled engines), w= here > > the NMMA rating is required. So do we best get the stuff for air-cooled > > 2-stroke =96 which probably run hotter; the stuff for watercraft =96 wh= ich > > probably run cooler; or something else (other than Redline). Or is the= re no > > data to support a choice and I'm over-analyzing and it doesn't matter > > anyway. > > > > > > > > Let us know if you notice any change when you go to premix. My old 198= 8 > > RX-7 felt spunkier when I started using premix in it but it was an old = 150K > > mile beater. > > > > If you were doing the 50-50 MMO at the time, that could make a > > difference. It contains both toluene and xylene which are very combust= ible. > > Some 2-stroke oils contain other octane enhancers. The Super-Tech is > > 'pre-diluted' ("with what"? you may ask) to make it mix more readily wi= th > > fuel. > > > > > > > > *What Pre-mix ratio??* IIRC, I've heard on this list to use about 1 oz > > per gallon, which is about 130:1. Most 2-stroke applications are somew= here > > in the 20 to 50 : 1. > > > > > > > > Al (Still grounded working on mods) > > > > > ------=_Part_17923_21296378.1207076674665 Content-Type: text/html; charset=WINDOWS-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline
Ed,
 
So, that is how Tracy managed to win the SNF 100... he premixed Wal-Ma= rt Super-Tech 2-stroke oil with his fuel.  Good thing the tech inspect= ors didn't catch him doing that.  Just goes to show, you learn a n= ew "racer's trick" every day.  Does Lynn know about this= ?  LOL
 
Mark
 
On 4/1/08, E= d Anderson <eanderson@c= arolina.rr.com> wrote:
Ah, yes, Mark, important point!
 
  Since it is not mineral based, ther= e is less lowering of Octane rating of fuel mixture and therefore less like= ly hood of detonation.  This enables me to run those rare 20:1 compres= sion ratio rotors and produce over 300HP with my 13B.  Couldn't do= it without my Super-Tech Wall-Mart Oil.  But, don't tell anyone e= lse my secret {:>)
 
Ed
----- Original Message -----
From: Mark Steitle=
Sent: Tuesday, April 01, 2008 2:06 P= M
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Super-Tech = was [FlyRotary] Re: 2-stroke oil

 
Ed,
 
Interesting that it says it is synthetic based. 
 
Mark

 
On 4/1/08, E= d Anderson <eanderson@c= arolina.rr.com> wrote:=20
Al, back some time ago when I was using so= me very expensive 2 stroke oils (like over $4.00/quart) , I decided to do s= ome research.  I came to the conclusion that the Marine 2 stroke oils = were probably as good as was needed for our Rotary application.  = Some of the 2 stroke oils designed for air cooled engines apparently have d= ifferent formulations to cope with the higher temps associated.  In an= y case, I decided the Wall-Mart Marine 2 stroke Super-Tech which meets TC-W= 3 standards(on the back label) (and much less costly) was more than go= od enough.
 
I no longer can find the source, but this = oil was reportedly produced by PENNZOIL for Wall-Mart.
 
http://pennzoil.com/products/marine/index.html<= /div>
 
I have been using it for 4 years without a= ny problem.
 
FWIW
 
Ed
----- Original Message -----
From: Al Gietzen <= /div>
Sent: Tuesday, April 01, 2008 12:48 = PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: 2-stroke oi= l

 

<= span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">For the premix oil I use any good BIA cert. = TCW-3 2-stroke oil mixed 50-50 with MMO  both of which come from Walma= rt.  Any of the Redline 2-stroke oils would be excellent, including th= e snomobile stuff.

 

The only 2-stroke oil I could f= ind at the local Walmart was called Super-Tech, and I couldn't find any= certifications on it anywhere.  Is MMO proven for this application?&n= bsp; My research also indicates that the TCW-3 rating only is not recommend= ed for watercraft (water-cooled engines), where the NMMA rating is required= . So do we best get the stuff for air-cooled 2-stroke =96 which probably ru= n hotter; the stuff for watercraft =96 which probably run cooler; or someth= ing else (other than Redline).  Or is there no data to support a choic= e and I'm over-analyzing and it doesn't matter anyway.

<= span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt"> 

<= span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Let us know if you notice any change when yo= u go to premix.  My old 1988 RX-7 felt spunkier when I started using p= remix in it but it was an old 150K mile beater.

If you were doing the 50-50 MMO= at the time, that could make a difference.  It contains both toluene = and xylene which are very combustible. Some 2-stroke oils contain other oct= ane enhancers.  The Super-Tech is 'pre-diluted' ("with wh= at"? you may ask) to make it mix more readily with fuel.  =

 

What Pre-mix ratio??<= /font>  IIRC, I've he= ard on this list to use about 1 oz per gallon, which is about 130:1.  = Most 2-stroke applications are somewhere in the 20 to 50 : 1.=

 

Al (Still grounded working on m= ods)


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