X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from wx-out-0506.google.com ([66.249.82.234] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.2.1) with ESMTP id 2817717 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Tue, 25 Mar 2008 16:25:58 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=66.249.82.234; envelope-from=msteitle@gmail.com Received: by wx-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id i27so3360251wxd.25 for ; Tue, 25 Mar 2008 13:25:21 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; bh=tYxquM9cgojX8BxbmG/yxiGQzqsATThiyHs6CnQs9iQ=; b=ScKuqCwjcxhHOoLm8wWt+9LnwM9nr0vEadeNxTBbphtZQ7aEX6rzotuStUT6H9ommM6vB+OYQj60HdHtdkHlN81Uo8hDFPNJeRPX2HvUfoiWU8wWNzt0fMDRoXmgghVHxc3DxibqPrpRACEtCwDKpr0JLBxwgFjgQtFQbQj0mWY= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=tfC1ukqYHigF+NIApKXHDFhFk0kTKek/oGIyTTztmYUg3DRS6ce9CWzDZ5bSSyO0uGvFGEF9jKYtVi6aB4VAynZ+hprb+zG0EQrrD+FKFsRlEvfrx5cVA59X7TjdKkGd4pYtoWZDlCVVB7IjAX/dg6I+czmnRVEL/PTTplrfWKY= Received: by 10.70.78.1 with SMTP id a1mr11149042wxb.11.1206476720299; Tue, 25 Mar 2008 13:25:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.70.40.14 with HTTP; Tue, 25 Mar 2008 13:25:19 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <5cf132c0803251325r28593978pc63a2a3ff36c8ff1@mail.gmail.com> Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2008 15:25:19 -0500 From: "Mark Steitle" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Using OMP rotor housing only In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_Part_2774_15799891.1206476720264" References: ------=_Part_2774_15799891.1206476720264 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_Part_2775_9899807.1206476720265" ------=_Part_2775_9899807.1206476720265 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_2776_4363625.1206476720266" ------=_Part_2776_4363625.1206476720266 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Al, The housings on my 20B were threaded. I ended up using them as anchor points to help hold my intake manifold in place. My custom (homebuilt) intake didn't allow room for some of the bolts to thread into the side housings. So, I fabricated some special "adapters" which I bolted to the housings providing anchor points for the intake manifold to attach. Proble= m solved. Point is that they're threaded, so I would recommend you plug them with bolts. You never know when you might need to attach something to the engine at that spot. Mark S. On 3/25/08, wrjjrs@aol.com wrote: > > Al, and everybody, > I want to suggest a high quality suggestion to plugging some of those > machined holes. This is an industry standard plug to do the same thing an= d > MOST IMPORTANT, PRESENTS NO RISK TO A RUNNING ENGINE. While JB weld is fi= ne > if you don't have the engine in operation this is a cleaner and equally > permanent solution. Are the oil injection holes on your engine threaded o= r > Bored Al?* *I believe mine are bored for an o-ring seal with a threaded > hole next to them but I don't have the 20B available to check. The attach= ed > file shows .187" plugs but they have a bunch of different sizes both engl= ish > and metric. > Bill Jepson > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Al Gietzen > To: Rotary motors in aircraft > Sent: Tue, 25 Mar 2008 8:40 am > Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Using OMP rotor housing only > > > I've been considering dissing the OMP and going to premix. My engine is > currently off the plane for plumbing changes (oil/water xchanger install) > and rework of wing-root radiator air inlet. This may be a good time. Is = it > as simple as removing the OMP, blanking it off with a plate, and closing = the > ports in the housing nozzles with JB Weld? > > Al > > -----Original Message----- > *From:* Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] > *On Behalf Of *Lehanover@aol.com > *Sent:* Tuesday, March 25, 2008 7:18 AM > *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft > *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Re: Using OMP rotor housing only > > The engine will run for some time with the OMP not doing anything. Some > of my gifted engines have had the hoses broken off. There will be a sligh= t > amount of oil added from the oil scrapers on the rotor sides not being > perfect. The scrapers will also scrape off unburned fuel and mix it with = the > crankcase oil. High oil temps will remove most of that fuel through the > breather. Note that crankcase breather gases are explosive. A good reason= to > smell the dipstick when ever it is out. > > So, as the engine wears out the scrapers it starts needing less top oil. > > The only downside to injecting into the housings is poor distribution. I= t > leaves a boat wake looking stain on the chrome. So, it looks to me like s= ome > of that microscopic amount of oil is discarded without helping anyone. It > seems to me that the best case is the premix. If I were to use the OMP, I > would drop it all in behind the Throttle Body, or into each throat on a > carb. Or if you are a purist, into the float bowl. > > Years ago synthetic crank case oil was specifically not recommended by > Mazda. (because of gumming) > > Lynn E. Hanover > > > > > In a message dated 3/25/2008 10:43:57 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > ALVentures@cox.net writes: > > So it would also seem to me that using the OMP with 2-cycle oil in this > scenario is significantly different than pre-mix. But is it as effective= , > more effective, or worse?? > > > > ------------------------------ > Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL Home > . > ------------------------------ > Planning your summer road trip? Check out AOL Travel Guides > . > > > > *Precision* > *Micro Hydraulics* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *ASK LEE* > > *About LEE* > *Products* > *Contact Us* > *What's New* > *Engineering* > *Search* > *=D8 .187" Aluminum Plugs for 3000 psi systems* > *Pin & Plug* > > > *Installation Boss* > > > *Short Style* > *Long Style* > Lee Part Number > *PLGA1870010A * > *PLGA1871010A * > *D* Max. > .1875 > .1875 > *D* Min. > .1866 > .1866 > *C* Nom. > .160 > .260 > *M* Nom. > .135 > .235 > *E* Nom. > .146 > .146 > *K* Nom. > .154 > .154 > *L* Nom. > .114 > .181 > Weight (gr) > .19 > .31 > Proof Pressure (psi) > Class 1 fit > Class 2 fit > Class 3 fit > > 8,000 > 9,000 > 10,000 > > 10,000 > 13,000 > 15,000 > Ream Diameters > Class 1 fit > Class 2 fit > Class 3 fit > inches > .1875-.1900 > .1875-.1890 > .1875-.1880 > inches > .1875-.1900 > .1875-.1890 > .1875-.1880 > *A* Min. > .152 > .253 > *=D8 N* Ref. > .156 > .156 > *W* Min. > .125 > .125 > *Materials* *Pin & Plug:* 2024-T4 or T351 Aluminum per QQ-A-225/6 * > Finish* *Pin:* Alodine Yellow per MIL-C-5541 & Wax > *Plug:* Anodize Green per MIL-A-8625 Type II > For Installation and Extraction Procedures, Tools and Oversize Spare > Parts, follow this *link* > ------------------------------ > For more information, please send us your application information via our > *ASK LEE* service= . > Or contact our application engineers in the *USA*at 1-800-LEE-PLUG or= our representatives > *around the world* > . > Copyright 09/2002 by The Lee Company, USA > -- Trademarkinformation -- > LEE Homepage > > > > -- > Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ > Archive and UnSub: > http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html > > > ------=_Part_2776_4363625.1206476720266 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline
Al,
 
The housings on my 20B were threaded.  I ended up using them as a= nchor points to help hold my intake manifold in place.  My custom (hom= ebuilt) intake didn't allow room for some of the bolts to thread into t= he side housings.  So, I fabricated some special "adapters" = which I bolted to the housings providing anchor points for the intake manif= old to attach.  Problem solved.  Point is that they're thread= ed, so I would recommend you plug them with bolts.  You never know whe= n you might need to attach something to the engine at that spot.
 
Mark S.

 
On 3/25/08, = wrjjrs@aol.com <wrjjrs@aol.com> wrote:=20
Al, and everybody,
I want to suggest a high quality suggestion to plugging some of those = machined holes. This is an industry standard plug to do the same thing and = MOST IMPORTANT, PRESENTS NO RISK TO A RUNNING ENGINE. While JB weld is fine= if you don't have the engine in operation this is a cleaner and equall= y permanent solution. Are the oil injection holes on your engine threaded o= r Bored Al? I believe mine are bored for an o-ring seal with = a threaded hole next to them but I don't have the 20B available to chec= k. The attached file shows .187" plugs but they have a bunch of differ= ent sizes both english and metric.
Bill Jepson


-----Original Message-----
From: Al Gietzen <<= a onclick=3D"return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href=3D"mailto:A= LVentures@cox.net" target=3D"_blank">ALVentures@cox.net>
To: Rota= ry motors in aircraft <fl= yrotary@lancaironline.net>
Sent: Tue, 25 Mar 2008 8:40 am
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Using OMP rotor = housing only

 
I've been considering dissing= the OMP and going to premix. My engine is currently off the plane for plum= bing changes (oil/water xchanger install) and rework of wing-root radiator = air inlet. This may be a good time.  Is it as simple as removing the O= MP, blanking it off with a plate, and closing the ports in the housing nozz= les with JB Weld?
 
Al
 
-----Original Message-----
= From: Rotary motors in airc= raft [mailto:flyrotary@lanc= aironline.net] On Behalf Of Lehanover@aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 20= 08 7:18 AM
To: Rotary mo= tors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Using OMP rotor housing only
 
Th= e engine will run for some time with the OMP not doing anything. Some of&nb= sp;my gifted engines have had the hoses broken off. There will be a slight = amount of oil added from the oil scrapers on the rotor sides not being perf= ect. The scrapers will also scrape off unburned fuel and mix it with t= he crankcase oil. High oil temps will remove most of that fuel through the = breather. Note that crankcase breather gases are explosive. A good reason t= o smell the dipstick when ever it is out.
&n= bsp;
So= , as the engine wears out the scrapers it starts needing less top oil.
&n= bsp;
Th= e only downside to injecting into the housings is poor distribution. It lea= ves a boat wake looking stain on the chrome. So, it looks to me like some o= f that microscopic amount of oil is discarded without helping anyone. It se= ems to me that the best case is the premix. If I were to use the OMP, I wou= ld drop it all in behind the Throttle Body, or into each throat on a carb. = Or if you are a purist, into the float bowl.  
&n= bsp;
Ye= ars ago synthetic crank case oil was specifically not recommended by M= azda. (because of gumming)
&n= bsp;
Ly= nn E. Hanover
&n= bsp;
&n= bsp;
&n= bsp;
&n= bsp;
In= a message dated 3/25/2008 10:43:57 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, ALVentures@cox.net writes:
= So it would also seem to me that using the OMP with 2-cycle oil in this sce= nario is significantly different than pre-mix.  But is it as effective= , more effective, or worse??
<= font face=3D"Arial" color=3D"black" size=3D"2">

Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. <= a title=3D"http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=3D15= ?ncid=3Daolhom00030000000001" onclick=3D"return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,e= vent,this)" href=3D"http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?v= ideo=3D15?ncid=3Daolhom00030000000001" target=3D"_blank">Watch the video on= AOL Home.
Planning your summer road trip? Check out AOL Tra= vel Guides.


--
Homepage:  http://www.flyrotary.com/
Archive and = UnSub:   http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html<= br>


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3D""
 3D""
About LEE<= /div>
=
=D8 = .187" Aluminum Plugs for 3000 psi systems

Pin & Plug
 
Installation Boss
 

3D""
Short Style
Long Style
Lee Part Number
PLGA1870010A
PLGA1871010A
D Max.
.1875
.1875
D Min.
.1866
.1866
C Nom.
.160
.260
M Nom.
.135
.235
E Nom.
.146
.146
K Nom.
.154
.154
L Nom.
.114
.181
Weight (gr)
.19
.31
Proof Pressure (psi)=20
  • Class 1 fit=20
  • Class 2 fit=20
  • Class 3 fit
    		•

    8,000
    9,000
    10,000

    10,000
    13,000
    15,000
    Ream Diameters=20
  • Class 1 fit=20
  • Class 2 fit=20
  • Class 3 fit
    		•
    inches
    .1875-.1900
    .1875-.1890
    .1875-.1880
    inches
    .1875-.1900
    .1875-.1890
    .1875-.1880
    A Min.
    .152
    .253
    =D8 N Ref.
    .156
    .156
    W Min.
    .125
    .125
    Materials Pin & Plug: 2024-T4 or T351 Aluminum per QQ-A-= 225/6
    Finish Pin: Alodine Yellow per MIL-C-5541 & Wax
    Plug: Anodize Green per MIL-A-8625 Type II

    For Installation and Extraction Procedures, Tools and = Oversize Spare Parts, follow this link
    For more information, please send us your application information via our <= a onclick=3D"return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href=3D"http://w= ww.theleeco.com/WebInqui.nsf/Inquiry!OpenForm" target=3D"_blank">ASK LEE service. Or contact our appl= ication engineers in the USA at 1-800-LEE-PLUG or= our representatives around the world.
    Copyright 09/2002 by The Lee Company, USA
    -- Trademark information -- LEE Homepage