Mailing List flyrotary@lancaironline.net Message #40800
From: <Lehanover@aol.com>
Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Degrees overlap
Date: Thu, 20 Dec 2007 13:27:40 EST
To: <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>
In a message dated 12/20/2007 11:31:39 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, echristley@nc.rr.com writes:
So rather than making a fuel/air mixture elsewhere and dragging it past the 
> plugs at 100 MPH and complaining about HC problems, let us inject our  burning
> mixture into the hottest possible compressed air we can make, and do it 
> between the current plug locations. You cannot detonate it when all of the fuel 
> is in one location. And if it cannot detonate how much boost could it  stand? 
> High boost with no inter-cooler?
>
>  
Lynn, I think you are so far above my head that I'm only getting the
10,000ft view of what's going on.  I've read your post twice, and still
don't know that I have it.  But tell me if this sound right.

The Carnot cycle, in its simplest form, we have a chamber that ingest
some air, compresses it, heats it, then extracts energy from the
resulting expansion.  The heating has traditionally been done by mixing
some fuel in with the ingested air, and burning it after it is compressed.

You're suggesting that we replace the fuel/air mixture with a sort of
blowtorch?  The mixture comes in burning, and if there are any surplus
HCs left over there is plenty of oxygen floating around in the chamber
to take care of them while their energy is still useful.  Efficiency
goes up.  Exhaust temps and noise both drop.
Right. If the engine were 100% efficient the intake and exhaust temps would be the same as ambient.
As noise is a form of energy, there would be no pressure left when the exhaust port opens and the closing volume would push out the exhaust gasses with little or no noise involved.


What would it take, somewhere between 150 and 200 psi on the mixture
injectors to handle 8:1 or 9:1 compression ratio rotors?
Correct..............

 
Ok, I just ran the Carnot cycle past the ghost of Mr Wizard, and he isn't buying it either.
 
 
Gas changing temperature is not a "state". Gas is a "state" liquid is a "state" and so on. I sold a Carnot cycle at a yard sale last spring. The chain kept coming off.
 
I deny any knowledge in this area. I had never heard of that, and had to look it up.
 
However, the HC problem is a result of the frightened fuel molecules, clinging to each other and seeing what is going to happen, flee to the nooks and crannies, on the colder surfaces of the chamber in an attempt to save them selves. Like a school of bait fish under attack a surprising number survive, and run out the exhaust port, and are lost to us as power.  
 
It is our mission to prevent this in any way possible, so that: "To the extent possible" (government talk) every BTU available in that fuel is converted to work. And cheating in this attempt is no vice.
 
One way to keep the molecules from clinging to each other is apply additional energy in the form of heat, because we have lots of heat available to work with, for example the exhaust system flow. (about 70% of all energy we come up with). We can mechanically disrupt the fuel with ultrasound using piezo crystals. We can cause the mixture to spin violently as it is injected. We can assault the fuel with radio frequency energy.
We can light the fuel with whopping big amounts of electrical energy, and repeatedly. We can heat the fuel in the injector, or before the injector. Because the hot air is moving past the injector, it might even be possible to extend the injection over time, or have two injectors, so as to limit the combustion temperatures so as to limit the production of NOX. Caused by high combustion temps. A ceramic coated rotor face would have a very high surface temperature, that, and a heated intake air might be enough to do the trick with no additional help.
 
This is one reason the rotary responds well to a CD ignition system.
 
Injecting later and at high pressure would eliminate a lot of the cold wall problem, and no doubt had something to do with the injector location in the 16X. 
 
Here we are inventing the wheel again. This was all known to engineers doing the Mobile Gas economy run in the 50s.  
 
High pressure electrical injectors are now in service on a wide range of diesel engines.So injecting into 200 PSI is no problem.
 
Lynn E. Hanover   



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