X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com X-SpamCatcher-Score: 50 [XX] Return-Path: Received: from ms-smtp-02.southeast.rr.com ([24.25.9.101] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.1.8) with ESMTP id 2048146 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 16 May 2007 15:34:46 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=24.25.9.101; envelope-from=eanderson@carolina.rr.com Received: from edward2 (cpe-024-074-103-061.carolina.res.rr.com [24.74.103.61]) by ms-smtp-02.southeast.rr.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with SMTP id l4GJXtPx029867 for ; Wed, 16 May 2007 15:33:55 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <009e01c797f1$609616f0$2402a8c0@edward2> From: "Ed Anderson" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Problem found and fixed. Date: Wed, 16 May 2007 15:35:36 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_009B_01C797CF.D92789E0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_009B_01C797CF.D92789E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Right, Bobby, I even have an unused CB position right next to it - that = would fit the role perfectly, I even have an unused pin position in = that plug - so just might not be too much trouble. =20 Ed ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Bobby J. Hughes=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 4:02 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Problem found and fixed. Well since your installing new gold pins anyway! Bobby -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----- From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] = On Behalf Of Ed Anderson Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 12:56 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Problem found and fixed. Hi Bobby, Unfortunately, both of my coils are powered from the same CB. There = is no question in my mind now (if there was before {:>)) that was not a = good design decision. The smart thing is to power each ignition module = through its own CB and power line. I have the fuel pumps that way, = don't know why I didn't think to do the ignition the same way. Ed ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Bobby J. Hughes=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 3:06 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Problem found and fixed. Ed, Are you using one power lead for all coils or powering L /T = separately? Bobby -------------------------------------------------------------------------= --- From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] = On Behalf Of Ed Anderson Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 11:11 AM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Problem found and fixed. After my uneventful 1600 mile detour through Louisiana after Sun & = Fun, I went out several days later and could not start the engine. = Didn't have time to trouble shoot it then, but I did today. The simulation modes were a great help. If put the EC2 in mode 1 = (fuel pumps off) and pushed the store button - the injectors clicked = like mad. I detached one sparkplug wire , placed a screw driver in it = and laid it on the motor mount. I put the EC2 in mode 8 (ignition) and = pressed the store button - nothing, nada, not a spark. So I started from the circuit breaker, confirmed I had voltage on = each side. Next was a Molex circular plug which connects the instrument = panel wiring to the airframe, I have 6 of them. I pulled the one = which had the power line to the ignition coils and noticed that the = power pin did not look bright and shiny as did the others. I sprayed = some Corrosion X on it and stuck it back on - the engine fired right up. However, during the running it died at low rpm, so I pulled the = plug back off an got out my near vision glasses and noticed that not = only did it not look shiny but it looked slightly pitted and corroded. = So I got out some fine sand paper and clean the pin and took a small = fine tooth file and gentle "reamed" the socket. Put it back together = and that apparently did the job. I wiggled the plug quite a bit while = the engine was running and no further disruption of the ignition. Lesson Learned? Well, way back when I was doing my wiring (hard to = believe over a decade ago), I was faced with a choice of pins - tin or = gold plated. Well, need I say which one I went with - the tin ones, = they were cheaper naturally. Later on I decided to use gold plated = pins/sockets for the critical circuits (of which this is one), but never = went back and changed this one (after all I did want to fly in my life = time). =20 Perhaps Bob White can chime in here, my recommendation would be to = go with the gold plated pins vice the tin plated on for critical systems = especially where they might be exposed to weather (like the tip up = canopy can do). =20 Anyhow, back in running shape - I did pull all the remaining plugs = and squirted some Xrossions on the pins. None of the others had the = dark/pitted look to them. Those simulations modes are really an asset in trouble shooting. = Thought I would pass this on. Ed Ed Anderson Rv-6A N494BW Rotary Powered Matthews, NC eanderson@carolina.rr.com http://members.cox.net/rogersda/rotary/configs.htm#N494BW http://www.dmack.net/mazda/index.html ------=_NextPart_000_009B_01C797CF.D92789E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Right, Bobby,  I even have an unused CB = position=20 right next to it - that would fit the role perfectly,  I even have = an=20 unused pin position in that plug - so just might not be too much = trouble. =20
 
Ed
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Bobby J. = Hughes=20
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 = 4:02=20 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: = Problem found=20 and fixed.

Well since your installing new gold pins=20 anyway!
Bobby

From: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Ed=20 Anderson
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 12:56 = PM
To: Rotary=20 motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Problem found = and=20 fixed.

Hi Bobby,
 
Unfortunately, both of my coils are powered = from the=20 same CB.  There is no question in my mind now (if there was = before=20 {:>)) that was not a good design decision.  The smart thing is = to=20 power each ignition module through its own CB and power line.  I = have the=20 fuel pumps that way, don't know why I didn't think to do the ignition = the same=20 way.
 
Ed
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Bobby = J. Hughes=20
To: Rotary motors in = aircraft=20
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 = 3:06=20 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: = Problem found=20 and fixed.

Ed,
 
Are you using one power lead for all coils = or powering=20 L /T separately?
 
Bobby

From: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Ed=20 Anderson
Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 11:11 = AM
To:=20 Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Problem = found and=20 fixed.

After my  uneventful 1600 mile detour = through=20 Louisiana after Sun & Fun, I went out several days later and = could not=20 start the engine.  Didn't have time to trouble shoot it then, = but I did=20 today.
 
The simulation modes were a great = help.  If=20 put the EC2 in mode 1 (fuel pumps off) and pushed the store button - = the=20 injectors clicked like mad.  I detached one sparkplug wire , = placed a=20 screw driver in it and laid it on the motor mount.  I put the = EC2 in=20 mode 8 (ignition) and pressed the store button - nothing, nada, not = a=20 spark.
 
So I started from the circuit breaker, = confirmed I had=20 voltage on each side.  Next was a Molex circular plug which = connects=20 the instrument panel wiring to the airframe, I have  6 of=20 them.   I pulled the one which had the power line to the = ignition=20 coils and noticed that the power pin did not look bright and = shiny as=20 did the others.   I sprayed some Corrosion X on it and = stuck it=20 back on - the engine fired right up.
 
However, during the running it died  at = low rpm,=20 so I pulled the plug back off an got out my near vision glasses and = noticed=20 that not only did it not look shiny but it looked slightly pitted = and=20 corroded.  So I got out some fine sand paper and clean the pin = and took=20 a small fine tooth file and gentle "reamed" the socket.  Put it = back=20 together and that apparently did the job.  I wiggled the plug = quite a=20 bit while the engine was running and no further disruption of the=20 ignition.
 
Lesson Learned? Well, way back when I was = doing my=20 wiring (hard to believe over a decade ago), I was faced with a = choice of=20 pins - tin or gold plated.  Well, need I say which one I went = with -=20 the tin ones, they were cheaper naturally.  Later on I decided = to use=20 gold plated pins/sockets for the critical circuits (of which this is = one),=20 but never went back and changed this one (after all I did want to = fly in my=20 life time).  
 
Perhaps Bob White can chime in here, my = recommendation=20 would be to go with the gold plated pins vice the tin plated on for = critical=20 systems especially where they might be exposed to weather (like the = tip up=20 canopy can do).   
 
Anyhow, back in running shape - I did pull = all the=20 remaining plugs and squirted some Xrossions on the pins.  None = of the=20 others had the dark/pitted look to them.
 
Those simulations modes are really an asset = in trouble=20 shooting.  Thought I would pass this on.
 
Ed
Ed Anderson
Rv-6A N494BW Rotary=20 Powered
Matthews, NC
eanderson@carolina.rr.comhttp:/= /members.cox.net/rogersda/rotary/configs.htm#N494BW
http://www.dmack.net/mazda= /index.html
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