X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com X-SpamCatcher-Score: 2 [X] Return-Path: Received: from ispmxmta06-srv.windstream.net ([166.102.165.167] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.1.3) with ESMTP id 1670993 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 13 Dec 2006 10:45:17 -0500 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=166.102.165.167; envelope-from=montyr2157@alltel.net Received: from ispmxaamta08-gx.windstream.net ([67.141.76.19]) by ispmxmta06-srv.windstream.net with ESMTP id <20061213154416.QBBN4563.ispmxmta06-srv.windstream.net@ispmxaamta08-gx.windstream.net> for ; Wed, 13 Dec 2006 09:44:16 -0600 Received: from Thorstwin ([67.141.76.19]) by ispmxaamta08-gx.windstream.net with SMTP id <20061213154416.PMLB4808.ispmxaamta08-gx.windstream.net@Thorstwin> for ; Wed, 13 Dec 2006 09:44:16 -0600 Message-ID: <002001c71ecd$92a53ce0$01fea8c0@Thorstwin> From: "Monty Roberts" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: Subject: Duty cyle, was MSD Date: Wed, 13 Dec 2006 09:44:27 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 100% of the power available is 100%. It is almost never the rated or demonstrated power of the engine in some controlled situation, like a dyno room on the ground. That is the point I was trying to make. The engines rated HP would be what you get in a dyno room at SL standard conditions. The duty cycle of the engine from a power output standpoint is what time averaged percentage of max power it sees in a particular application. For example take the 250 hp PPort that makes its power at 9000 rpm. In an aircraft you will never see 250 hp continuous unless you use a CS prop, a turbo and an appropriate gear box. It will always be less, even with the prop stalled. Reducing the throttle setting or leaning the engine does count, it reduces the power output of the engine and thus mechanical and thermal stress experienced by the hardware. Cruising LOP at 12000 feet, even at WOT will produce much less than 250 hp. If the engine produces less power, the hardware is happier regardless of how it happened. Duty cycle must refer to a fixed point somewhere. Available WOT power changes depending on the rpm (determined by the prop), altitude, and mixture. Any change in load on the engine like a driver lifting his foot for a few seconds, going into a corner, makes a huge difference in cooling. It gives the cooling system time to remove heat from the combustion chamber area. It then takes time for that area to heat back up. Then he is into the next corner, and the process repeats. In an aircraft this never happens. It is a continuous heat flux with no chance to cool. Difficulty cooling the rotary needs to be taken with a grain of salt. There are too many installation variables. Assuming a functioning and properly designed cooling system is attached to the engine, I don't think there will be a problem cooling the engine as long as continuous power output is kept below 100 hp/rotor. That may be a bit conservative, but I think people who want to make huge continuous power output are going to have problems cooling the combustion chamber area. Of course the argument that a TC needs to be placed there has been made by PL and is a good point. People who are turbocharging and using a CS prop should do this. The duty cycle argument is always used by people claiming that automotive engines will never work in aircraft. The point is, from a stress on the hardware standpoint, what matters is the duty cycle relative to max output. In a street car it might see 20% or less. In an aircraft it will probably be closer to 50-75% depending on how you cruise, what type of airplane etc. This is higher than what the engine in the car sees, but not the often touted 100%. In a boat it might be 50-100% which automotive engines are used in and work just fine. Monty