X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com X-SpamCatcher-Score: 1 [X] Return-Path: Received: from sccrmhc14.comcast.net ([204.127.200.84] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.1.3) with ESMTP id 1631380 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Sat, 02 Dec 2006 00:39:51 -0500 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=204.127.200.84; envelope-from=n3773@comcast.net Received: from rv8 (c-24-21-141-28.hsd1.or.comcast.net[24.21.141.28]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc14) with SMTP id <20061202053931014006f3g9e>; Sat, 2 Dec 2006 05:39:31 +0000 Message-ID: <008a01c715d4$3b6dcc50$1c8d1518@rv8> Reply-To: "kevin lane" From: "kevin lane" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: gauges Date: Fri, 1 Dec 2006 21:25:48 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_005F_01C7158F.453DC090" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_005F_01C7158F.453DC090 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I find it interesting that in regards to fuel in the cockpit that the = general consensus seems to be the opposite of what all RVs use, i.e.. = low and high pressure lines in the cockpit. I would guess that Van gave = his design a bit of a thought, considering the millions of dollars he = risks in lawsuits, and has his proof with thousands of planes flying = without problems. it is my understanding that john Denver had a = supposedly safe "no fuel in the cockpit" system which ignored the = practical aspect of being easy to use. I do recognize that it would be = difficult in an RV to get fuel from the wings to the engine without = going thru the cockpit, but with, what, 4000+ planes flying, is this a = perceived problem, or a real one? some guys squeezed fuel pumps between = the wing and the fuse, but you still have to get thru the firewall. = what scared me was the T-craft, with that tank up there behind the = panel.. my trainer plane leaked a bit, too. I feel the same way about oil pressure gauges. typically you've got a = line to the sender or the gauge.(I mostly see them mounted on the = firewall, not the engine block) people think "plastic" is no good, but = I don't see mine fatiguing. some guys have "plastic" brake lines, some = use AL, and some only use s/s lines. my only experience so far with = failure has been an electrical failure (alt shut down after hour of peak = demands and battery had dropped to 8 volts) in which case I had no tach = (had switched it to elec after drive shaft probs), fuel gauges, oil = temp, but I did have oil pressure and fuel pressure, altimeter, A/S = etc..... I was also glad that I had listened to Jeff rose and kept one = magneto (I was over crater lake in the cascade mtns. at the time). so = if you decide to go all electric, many do, remember it also needs = electric to run. same with EFIS, no CPU, no display. kevin ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Wendell Voto=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Friday, December 01, 2006 8:31 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: gauges ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Lehanover@aol.com=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Friday, December 01, 2006 9:17 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: gauges In a message dated 12/1/2006 9:33:27 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, = downing.j@sbcglobal.net writes: Some DAR's require that you have a valve and can reach it with = your seat belt on. I assume an electric one, as Ed mentioned would also = do. JohnD The control valve could be outside the cockpit and operated by a = dash mounted pointer with a long aluminum tube shaft through the = firewall to the valve. LYnn E. Hanover Speaking of fuel valves, the original Cozy plans call for a manual = selector valve mounted between the pilot and co-pilot with lines up to = the seat-back and then to the engine. This setup has several connections = in the cockpit that can leak.=20 As far as a fuel shut off valve, I don't plan on using one, just = turn off the fuel pumps. For maintenance I plan on ball valves out of = the tank (ahead of the sump tank) and these could be remotely operated. Thanks to all for the responses on the gauges questions. I found = some sources for the VDO units and will look at the suggested ones also. Any suggestions on water pressure gauge senders? Can't find any yet. Wendell ------=_NextPart_000_005F_01C7158F.453DC090 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I find it interesting that in = regards to=20 fuel in the cockpit that the general consensus seems to be the opposite = of what=20 all RVs use, i.e.. low and high pressure lines in the cockpit.  I = would=20 guess that Van gave his design a bit of a thought, considering the = millions of=20 dollars he risks in lawsuits, and has his proof with thousands of planes = flying=20 without problems.  it is my understanding that john Denver had a = supposedly=20 safe "no fuel in the cockpit" system which ignored the practical aspect = of being=20 easy to use.  I do recognize that it would be difficult in an RV to = get=20 fuel from the wings to the engine without going thru the cockpit, but = with,=20 what, 4000+ planes flying, is this a perceived problem, or a real = one? =20 some guys squeezed fuel pumps between the wing and the fuse, but you = still have=20 to get thru the firewall.  what scared me was the T-craft, with = that tank=20 up there behind the panel.. my trainer plane leaked a bit, = too.
I feel the same way about oil = pressure=20 gauges.  typically you've got a line to the sender or the gauge.(I = mostly=20 see them mounted on the firewall, not the engine block)  people = think=20 "plastic" is no good, but I don't see mine fatiguing.  some guys = have=20 "plastic" brake lines, some use AL, and some only use s/s lines.  = my only=20 experience so far with failure has been an electrical failure (alt shut = down=20 after hour of peak demands and battery had dropped to 8 volts) in which = case I=20 had no tach (had switched it to elec after drive shaft probs), fuel = gauges, oil=20 temp, but I did have oil pressure and fuel pressure, altimeter, A/S=20 etc.....  I was also glad that I had listened to Jeff rose and kept = one=20 magneto (I was over crater lake in the cascade mtns. at the = time).  so=20 if you decide to go all electric, many do, remember it also needs = electric=20 to run.  same with EFIS, no CPU, no display.   =20 kevin
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Wendell = Voto=20
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2006 = 8:31=20 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: = gauges

 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Lehanover@aol.com
To: Rotary motors in = aircraft=20
Sent: Friday, December 01, = 2006 9:17=20 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: = gauges

In a message dated 12/1/2006 9:33:27 P.M. Eastern Standard = Time, downing.j@sbcglobal.net=20 writes:
Some DAR's require that you have a valve = and can=20 reach it with your seat belt on.  I assume an electric one, = as Ed=20 mentioned would also do.  = JohnD
The control valve could be outside the cockpit and operated by = a dash=20 mounted pointer with a long aluminum tube shaft through the firewall = to the=20 valve.
 
LYnn E. Hanover
 
Speaking of fuel valves, the original = Cozy plans=20 call for a manual selector valve mounted  between the = pilot and=20 co-pilot with lines up to the seat-back and then to the engine. This = setup=20 has several connections in the cockpit that can leak.
 
As far as a fuel shut off valve, I don't = plan on=20 using one, just turn off the fuel pumps. For maintenance I plan on = ball=20 valves out of the tank (ahead of the sump tank) and these could be = remotely=20 operated.
 
Thanks to all for the responses on the = gauges=20 questions.  I found some sources for the VDO units and will = look at the=20 suggested ones also.
 
Any suggestions on water pressure gauge = senders?=20 Can't find any yet.
 
Wendell
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