X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from mail26.syd.optusnet.com.au ([211.29.133.167] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.0.9) with ESMTPS id 1146799 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Thu, 08 Jun 2006 18:36:19 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=211.29.133.167; envelope-from=lendich@optusnet.com.au Received: from george (d58-104-245-63.dsl.nsw.optusnet.com.au [58.104.245.63]) by mail26.syd.optusnet.com.au (8.12.11/8.12.11) with SMTP id k58MZR69020087 for ; Fri, 9 Jun 2006 08:35:30 +1000 Message-ID: <003a01c6a6cc$b9f2e3c0$3ff5683a@george> From: "george lendich" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: OT: Concrete forms Date: Fri, 14 Jul 2006 08:36:03 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0037_01C6A720.8A7FA110" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0037_01C6A720.8A7FA110 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Finn, Use water resistant Form-Ply 3/4" thick, the base must be kept in = position, but every 3" seems overkill, perhaps every 6" to 9 ". If using blocks it doesn't matter if you chop a bit out of the bottoms, = tidy it up as you go. However having steel closer to the surface = doesn't make it stronger, just makes it more accessible to water = penetration and rust (concrete cancer). George ( down under) Thanks Bill (and to all others that reponded)! I've had my eyes on these. Haven't found a place to rent them yet. But I = doubt it'll be cost effective. Looks like I'd need at least 6 per = column: 36. Let's say they rent as cheap as $6/set, that would be $200. = From all the data I've gotten on and off the list so far, the cheapest = way seems to be using the 16x16" concrete column blocks. Either pick up = speed in doing it myself (which may well happen by the time I'm done = with my third corner and ready to start the columns - I *will* learn how = to do it) or hire some "illegals" to do it for me. The only problem is that when I placed the rebar in the slab/foundation = I was leaning towards poured columns and placed the rebar as close to = corners as possible. Some of them won't quite fit in the column blocks = so I'd have to cut the inside of some of the blocks sitting on the slab = (of course I could mix and pour the first 8 inches of those columns). = Ah, choices... Remember, I intend to have a concrete truck and guy with a concrete pump = come out to pump the corner blocks and the columns, and preferably also = the lintels and lintel blocks all in one go. Did anybody check Jarrett's numbers? Would I really have to brace the = forms every 3 inches (near bottom) with 2x4's? Any way of reducing that = to, say, every 2 to 3 feet by pouring the columns and corners in a = round-robin fashion, so that the concrete would start to set and not = exert such big pressure on the forms? How would one calculate and = control this? My knowledge of concrete viscosity, plywood and 2x4" = strength is woefully inadequate. As you can see, I haven't completely given up on forms and still have a = couple of weeks to decide. I was hoping to find someone with real world = experience - how thick plywood, bracing distance, etc. Jarrett seems to = come close, but his experience is not really with columns. Finn Bill Eslick wrote: Finn, Here is an ad that appeared on my gmail border: = http://www.ellisok.com/ellisok/products_column_clamps_scissor.html --=20 Bill Eslick www.weslick.com ------=_NextPart_000_0037_01C6A720.8A7FA110 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Finn,
Use water resistant Form-Ply 3/4" = thick, the base=20 must be kept in position, but every 3" seems overkill, perhaps every 6" = to 9=20 ".
 
If using blocks it doesn't matter if = you chop a bit=20 out of the bottoms, tidy it up as you go.  However having steel = closer to=20 the surface doesn't make it stronger, just makes it more accessible to = water=20 penetration and rust (concrete cancer).
George ( down under)
 
 
Thanks Bill (and to all others that reponded)!

I've had my = eyes on=20 these. Haven't found a place to rent them yet. But I doubt it'll be cost = effective. Looks like I'd need at least 6 per column: 36. Let's say they = rent as=20 cheap as $6/set, that would be $200. From all the data I've gotten on = and off=20 the list so far, the cheapest way seems to be using the 16x16" concrete = column=20 blocks. Either pick up speed in doing it myself (which may well happen = by the=20 time I'm done with my third corner and ready to start the columns - I = *will*=20 learn how to do it) or hire some "illegals" to do it for me.

The = only=20 problem is that when I placed the rebar in the slab/foundation I was = leaning=20 towards poured columns and placed the rebar as close to corners as = possible.=20 Some of them won't quite fit in the column blocks so I'd have to cut the = inside=20 of some of the blocks sitting on the slab (of course I could mix and = pour the=20 first 8 inches of those columns). Ah, choices...

Remember, I = intend to=20 have a concrete truck and guy with a concrete pump come out to pump the = corner=20 blocks and the columns, and preferably also the lintels and lintel = blocks all in=20 one go.

Did anybody check Jarrett's numbers? Would I really have = to brace=20 the forms every 3 inches (near bottom) with 2x4's? Any way of reducing = that to,=20 say, every 2 to 3 feet by pouring the columns and corners in a = round-robin=20 fashion, so that the concrete would start to set and not exert such big = pressure=20 on the forms? How would one calculate and control this? My knowledge of = concrete=20 viscosity, plywood and 2x4" strength is woefully inadequate.

As = you can=20 see, I haven't completely given up on forms and still have a couple of = weeks to=20 decide. I was hoping to find someone with real world experience - how = thick=20 plywood, bracing distance, etc. Jarrett seems to come close, but his = experience=20 is not really with columns.

Finn

Bill Eslick = wrote:
Finn,
 
Here is an ad that appeared on my gmail border:  http://www.ellisok.com/ellisok/products_column_clamps_scissor.html=

--
Bill Eslick
www.weslick.com=20
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