X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from zproxy.gmail.com ([64.233.162.201] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.0c3) with ESMTP id 747835 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Tue, 04 Oct 2005 19:21:52 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=64.233.162.201; envelope-from=wdleonard@gmail.com Received: by zproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id p8so17438nzb for ; Tue, 04 Oct 2005 16:21:08 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:mime-version:content-type; b=JwrmMyQE3Z5Ja1hL5gKS7j4d5nnJvk8sd65NriDZZB+csjavzlIOJQ8SI2WYjDBmjAJIh/0/Ud20ssBUaTSN7351/sRgPKBNmUUhnxWacABwnC/5K15rMg6eePYC0qOwScVMyzN2WyIgRelLZahHli1YYPfqPsPo5GXBzVz1ifY= Received: by 10.36.18.7 with SMTP id 7mr137886nzr; Tue, 04 Oct 2005 16:21:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.36.222.6 with HTTP; Tue, 4 Oct 2005 16:21:08 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <1c23473f0510041621k1b131727qf1962aaaa18dc445@mail.gmail.com> Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2005 16:21:08 -0700 From: David Leonard Reply-To: David Leonard To: Rotary motors in aircraft , Rotary Engine Subject: Telling rotors apart - Never trust Atkins! MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_4702_24473713.1128468068444" ------=_Part_4702_24473713.1128468068444 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline On 9/28/05, Kelly Troyer wrote: > > Ed Anderson has a measurement to check the depth of the combustion > depression in the > face of the rotor to determine the compression ratio (the deeper one is > turbo)....... > How about it Ed, any info on this? Can it be used to tell the 9.4:1 86-88 rotors from the 9.7:1 rotors? Bottom line check weight first then check the depth of the combustion > depression........I have > another way I use to determine what year my rotors are (all my engines ar= e > NA 86 to 91).....The > combustion depression in the 86 to 88 is as cast in the rotor (slight > grainy surface finish).....The > 89-91 depression is machined and has straight machine marks....... > That is really interesting. My old rotors are supposed to be 1991 T2 rotor= s but they have the cast appearance (However since I got them from Atkins I a= m not really sure they gave me what they sold me). The rotors that Earnest sent also have a cast appearance. But as I recall, the rotors in the engine I rebuilt had the milling marks... hmmm.. if that is true the balance in my current engine is all SNAFU. Are you sure that system is a valid way to do the measuring? So I just got back from weighing my rotors - Sure enough, the ones Atkins sold me weighted in at 10.20 and 10.19 making them the 86-88 variety despit= e the fact that I paid for a '91 engine. Worse, I have no idea what counter-weights he decided to use. If it matched the rotors he sold me then I have been running an unbalanced engine for the last 150 hrs. (that explains part of why the wife won't fly in it) Does anyone know what the correct weights of the counter weights should be for a given year group? Or perhaps some other way of telling them apart? BTW Ernest, the rotors you sent also weigh in at 10.18. Dave Leonard Check with Ed for his method to determine compression ratio as I do not > have it at hand......I > am attaching the rotor weight chart from "Mazdatrix" which will help (not= e > weight does not > include any seals or springs....just the bearing.........Hope this > helps........Any more questions > just ask !! > -- > Kelly Troyer > Dyke Delta/13B/RD1C/EC2 > *Engine* *Year* *Compression* *Weight (Grams)* *Weight (Pounds)* *12A = * > *76-82* *9.4* *4603* *10.15* *12A * *83-85* *9.4* *4353* *9.60* *13B* * > 74-78* *9.2* *5253* *11.58* *13B* *84-85* *9.4* *5253* *11.58* *13B N/T* = * > 86-88* *9.4* *4553* *10.04* *13B Turbo* *86-88* *8.5* *4553* *10.04* *13B > N/T* *89-92* *9.7* *4328* *9.54* *13B Turbo* *89-92* *9.0* *4328* *9.54* = *13B > T/T* *93-95* *9.0* *4328* *9.54* > > *NOTE: Weights are approximate, and include rotor bearing, but do not > include any seals or springs. * > > > -- Dave Leonard Turbo Rotary RV-6 N4VY http://members.aol.com/_ht_a/rotaryroster/index.html http://members.aol.com/_ht_a/vp4skydoc/index.html ------=_Part_4702_24473713.1128468068444 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline
On 9/28/05, = Kelly Troyer <keltro@att.net&g= t; wrote: =20
 
  Ed Anderson has a measurement to check the depth of the combust= ion depression in the
face of the rotor to determine the compression ratio (the deeper one i= s turbo).......
 
How about it Ed, any info on this?  Can it be used to tell the 9.= 4:1 86-88 rotors from the 9.7:1  rotors?

 Bottom line check weight first then check the depth of the combu= stion depression........I have
another way I use to determine what year my rotors are (all my engines= are NA 86 to 91).....The
combustion depression in the 86 to 88 is as cast in the rotor (slight = grainy surface finish).....The
89-91 depression is machined and has straight machine marks.......
 
That is really interesting.  My old rotors are supposed to be 199= 1 T2 rotors but they have the cast appearance (However since I got them fro= m Atkins I am not really sure they gave me what they sold me).  The ro= tors that Earnest sent also have a cast appearance.  But as I recall, = the rotors in the engine I rebuilt had the milling marks...   hmm= m..  if that is true the balance in my current engine is all SNAFU.&nb= sp; Are you sure that system is a valid way to do the measuring?=20
 
So I just got back from weighing my rotors - Sure enough, the ones Atk= ins sold me weighted in at 10.20 and 10.19 making them the 86-88 variety de= spite the fact that I paid for a '91 engine.  Worse, I have no idea wh= at counter-weights he decided to use.  If it matched the rotors he sol= d me then I have been running an unbalanced engine for the last 150 hrs.&nb= sp; (that explains part of why the wife won't fly in it)
 
Does anyone know what the correct weights of the counter weights shoul= d be for a given year group?  Or perhaps some other way of telling the= m apart?
 
BTW Ernest, the rotors you sent also weigh in at 10.18.
 
Dave Leonard

  Check with Ed for his method to determine compression ratio as = I do not have it at hand......I
am attaching the rotor weight chart from "Mazdatrix" which w= ill help (note weight does not
include any seals or springs....just the bearing.........Hope this hel= ps........Any more questions
just ask !! 
 
--
Kelly Troyer
Dyke Delta/13B/RD1C/EC2
 
Engine Year Compression Weight (Grams) Weight (Pounds)
12A 76-82 9.4 4603 10.15
12A 83-85 9.4 4353 9.60
13B 74-78 9.2 5253 11.58
13B 84-85 9.4 5253 11.58
13B N/T 86-88 9.4 4553 10.04
13B Turbo 86-88 8.5 4553 10.04
13B N/T 89-92 9.7 4328 9.54
13B Turbo 89-92 9.0 4328 9.54
13B T/T 93-95 9.0 4328 9.54

NOTE: Weights are approximate, and include rotor bearing, but do= not include any seals or springs.



--
Dave Leonard
Turbo Rotary RV-6 N4VY
http://members.aol.com/_ht_a/rotaryroster/index.html
http://members.aol.com/_ht_a= /vp4skydoc/index.html =20 ------=_Part_4702_24473713.1128468068444--