Return-Path: Received: from relay2.mail.twtelecom.net ([216.54.204.190] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.3c2) with ESMTP id 756642 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 18:41:12 -0500 Received-SPF: neutral receiver=logan.com; client-ip=216.54.204.190; envelope-from=hsanders@bellsouth.net Received: from herbhehbdwmte2 (66-162-168-98.gen.twtelecom.net [66.162.168.98]) by relay2.mail.twtelecom.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C7CD3C850 for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 17:40:25 -0600 (CST) From: "Herb Sanders" To: "'Rotary motors in aircraft'" Subject: RE: [FlyRotary] Re: Vapor Lock Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 17:40:23 -0600 Message-ID: <001001c51a01$0bbb9760$1900a8c0@herbhehbdwmte2> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0011_01C519CE.C1212760" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4510 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C519CE.C1212760 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Paul,=20 =20 STANDARD PLUMBERS TEST Ques - What makes liquid run downhill? Ans - Gravity =20 MASTER PLUMBERS TEST=20 Ques - What makes liquid run uphill? Ans - A pump =20 Herb :-) =20 -----Original Message----- From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Paul Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2005 5:16 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Vapor Lock =20 Thanks for the info, Tracy. My only concern is this....if the Facet = pump was not involved, might it be better to have it back in the system so = that if I have a future problem, I could turn the Facet pump on to pressurize = the sump tank with fresh fuel? Ed seems to be comfortable with this, and = has had to use it. Of course, on the other hand, if the Facet even partially = contributed to the vapor lock issue, I don't want it in my system. I need to talk = to Herb Sanders one more time, as he was concerned that because the Facet = will not allow back flow, it might be a major contributor to the vapor lock issue. I'm feeling like my system is fairly simple as it now stands. = Gravity feed, only the two required EFI pumps, a vented sump tank, and a simple Andair fuel selector valve. I do not need to transfer fuel from one = tank to another, or anything like that. I can also select "both" on the fuel selector, and balance fuel consumption automatically, or just switch to = left or right tank if needed. Paul Conner =20 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Tracy Crook =20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft =20 Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2005 1:12 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Vapor Lock =20 Paul, one last thought on the vapor lock thing. Very glad you have = found that it was the problem. There is nothing worse than not knowing.=20 =20 It is quite possible that changing EITHER of the two variables (in-line Facet or vent on the header/sump tank) will make the system work. Just because you remove one and it works does not mean you have found the = root cause. Earlier I used the "strikes" analogy, and we don't know how many = of these it takes to make an "out". =20 From your background I'm sure you know that it is frequently a = combination of things that can cause a failure. Removing one of them may 'fix' the problem now but add in other variables like fuel vapor pressure, = altitude, etc, and the problem could come back. The goal is to make the system as tolerant of all factors as possible. Happily, this frequently means = making it simple too! =20 One other thought on simplicity. I have never landed without power (in = my rotary powered plane) but I have come close several times in the early = days. The only thing that prevented it was having a fairly simple system and knowing it very well. This helped diagnose the problem and fix or compensate for it before running out of altitude and ideas. =20 Tracy _____ =20 No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.4.0 - Release Date: 2/22/2005 ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C519CE.C1212760 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Vapor Lock

Paul,

 

STANDARD PLUMBERS = TEST

Ques – What makes liquid run downhill?     Ans – Gravity

 

MASTER PLUMBERS TEST =

Ques – What makes liquid run uphill?         Ans – A = pump

 

Herb  J

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Rotary motors in = aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Paul
Sent: Wednesday, February = 23, 2005 5:16 PM
To: Rotary motors in = aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: = Vapor Lock

 

Thanks for the info, Tracy.  = My only concern is this....if the Facet pump was not involved, might it be = better to have it back in the system so that if I have a future problem, = I could turn the Facet pump on to pressurize the sump tank with fresh = fuel?  Ed seems to be comfortable with this, and has had to use = it.

       Of course, on the other hand, if the Facet even partially contributed = to  the vapor lock issue, I don't want it in my system.  I need = to talk to Herb Sanders one more time, as he was concerned that because the = Facet will not allow back flow, it might be a major contributor to the vapor lock = issue. I'm feeling like my system is fairly simple as it now stands. Gravity = feed, only the two required EFI pumps, a vented sump tank, and a simple Andair = fuel selector valve.  I do not need to transfer fuel from = one tank to another, or anything like that. I can also select "both" on the fuel selector, and balance fuel consumption automatically, or just switch to left or right tank if needed. Paul = Conner

 <= /font>

----- = Original Message -----

From: Tracy Crook =

Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2005 1:12 PM

Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Vapor Lock

 <= /font>

Paul, one last thought on the vapor lock thing.  Very glad you have = found that it was the problem.  There is nothing worse than not = knowing. 

 <= /font>

It is quite = possible that changing EITHER of the two variables (in-line Facet or vent on the header/sump tank) will make the system work.  Just because you = remove one and it works does not mean you have found the root cause.  Earlier I used the "strikes" analogy, and we don't know = how many of these it takes to make an "out".

 <= /font>

  From = your background I'm sure you know that it is frequently a combination of = things that can cause a failure.  Removing one of them may 'fix' the problem = now but add in other variables like fuel vapor pressure, altitude, etc, = and the problem could come back.  The goal is to make the = system as tolerant of all factors as possible.  Happily, this frequently = means making it simple too!

 <= /font>

One other = thought on simplicity.  I have never landed without power (in my rotary = powered plane) but I have come close several times in the early days.  The = only thing that prevented it was having a fairly simple system and knowing it = very well.  This helped diagnose the problem and fix or compensate for = it before running out of altitude and ideas.

 <= /font>

Tracy

No virus = found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.4.0 - Release Date: = 2/22/2005

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