Return-Path: Received: from imf22aec.mail.bellsouth.net ([205.152.59.70] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.3c2) with ESMTP id 756631 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 18:17:18 -0500 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=205.152.59.70; envelope-from=sqpilot@bellsouth.net Received: from [209.214.45.56] by imf22aec.mail.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.11 201-253-122-130-111-20040605) with ESMTP id <20050223231632.TVUO2068.imf22aec.mail.bellsouth.net@[209.214.45.56]> for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 18:16:32 -0500 Received: from 127.0.0.1 (AVG SMTP 7.0.300 [266.4.0]); Wed, 23 Feb 2005 17:16:26 -0600 Message-ID: <00c001c519fd$b1bb9c90$382dd6d1@paul52u7f5qyav> From: "Paul" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Vapor Lock Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 17:16:24 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="=======AVGMAIL-421D0ECA6276=======" --=======AVGMAIL-421D0ECA6276======= Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00BD_01C519CB.66FB06F0" ------=_NextPart_000_00BD_01C519CB.66FB06F0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Vapor LockThanks for the info, Tracy. My only = concern is this....if the Facet pump was not involved, might it be = better to have it back in the system so that if I have a future problem, = I could turn the Facet pump on to pressurize the sump tank with fresh = fuel? Ed seems to be comfortable with this, and has had to use it. Of course, on the other hand, if the Facet even partially = contributed to the vapor lock issue, I don't want it in my system. I = need to talk to Herb Sanders one more time, as he was concerned that = because the Facet will not allow back flow, it might be a major = contributor to the vapor lock issue. I'm feeling like my system is = fairly simple as it now stands. Gravity feed, only the two required EFI = pumps, a vented sump tank, and a simple Andair fuel selector valve. I = do not need to transfer fuel from one tank to another, or anything like = that. I can also select "both" on the fuel selector, and balance fuel = consumption automatically, or just switch to left or right tank if = needed. Paul Conner ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Tracy Crook=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2005 1:12 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Vapor Lock Paul, one last thought on the vapor lock thing. Very glad you have = found that it was the problem. There is nothing worse than not knowing. = It is quite possible that changing EITHER of the two variables = (in-line Facet or vent on the header/sump tank) will make the system = work. Just because you remove one and it works does not mean you have = found the root cause. Earlier I used the "strikes" analogy, and we = don't know how many of these it takes to make an "out". From your background I'm sure you know that it is frequently a = combination of things that can cause a failure. Removing one of them = may 'fix' the problem now but add in other variables like fuel vapor = pressure, altitude, etc, and the problem could come back. The goal is = to make the system as tolerant of all factors as possible. Happily, = this frequently means making it simple too! One other thought on simplicity. I have never landed without power = (in my rotary powered plane) but I have come close several times in the = early days. The only thing that prevented it was having a fairly simple = system and knowing it very well. This helped diagnose the problem and = fix or compensate for it before running out of altitude and ideas. Tracy -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.4.0 - Release Date: 2/22/2005 ------=_NextPart_000_00BD_01C519CB.66FB06F0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Vapor Lock
Thanks for the info, Tracy.  My only = concern is=20 this....if the Facet pump was not involved, might it be better to have = it=20 back in the system so that if I have a future problem, I could = turn=20 the Facet pump on to pressurize the sump tank with fresh fuel?  Ed = seems to=20 be comfortable with this, and has had to use it.
       Of course, on = the other=20 hand, if the Facet even partially contributed to  the vapor = lock=20 issue, I don't want it in my system.  I need to talk to Herb = Sanders one=20 more time, as he was concerned that because the Facet will not allow = back flow,=20 it might be a major contributor to the vapor lock issue. I'm feeling = like my=20 system is fairly simple as it now stands. Gravity feed, only the two = required=20 EFI pumps, a vented sump tank, and a simple Andair fuel selector = valve.  I=20 do not need to transfer fuel from one tank = to another,=20 or anything like that. I can also select "both" on the fuel selector, = and=20 balance fuel consumption automatically, or just switch to left or right = tank if=20 needed. Paul Conner
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Tracy = Crook
Sent: Wednesday, February 23, = 2005 1:12=20 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Vapor = Lock

Paul, one last thought on the vapor lock thing.  Very = glad you=20 have found that it was the problem.  There is nothing worse than = not=20 knowing. 
 
It is quite possible that changing EITHER of the two variables = (in-line=20 Facet or vent on the header/sump tank) will make the system = work.  Just=20 because you remove one and it works does not mean you have = found the=20 root cause.  Earlier I used the "strikes" analogy, and we don't = know how=20 many of these it takes to make an "out".
 
  From your background I'm sure you know that it is = frequently a=20 combination of things that can cause a failure.  Removing one of = them may=20 'fix' the problem now but add in other variables like fuel vapor = pressure,=20 altitude, etc, and the problem could come = back.  The goal=20 is to make the system as tolerant of all factors as = possible. =20 Happily, this frequently means making it simple too!
 
One other thought on simplicity.  I have never landed = without power=20 (in my rotary powered plane) but I have come close several times in = the early=20 days.  The only thing that prevented it was having a fairly = simple system=20 and knowing it very well.  This helped diagnose the problem and = fix or=20 compensate for it before running out of altitude and ideas.
 
Tracy

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG=20 Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.4.0 - Release = Date:=20 2/22/2005
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