Return-Path: Received: from imf25aec.mail.bellsouth.net ([205.152.59.73] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.3c1) with ESMTP id 742251 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 20:55:58 -0500 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=205.152.59.73; envelope-from=sqpilot@bellsouth.net Received: from [216.78.114.71] by imf25aec.mail.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.11 201-253-122-130-111-20040605) with ESMTP id <20050217015507.BNDY2148.imf25aec.mail.bellsouth.net@[216.78.114.71]> for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 20:55:07 -0500 Received: from 127.0.0.1 (AVG SMTP 7.0.300 [265.8.8]); Wed, 16 Feb 2005 19:55:01 -0600 Message-ID: <00f401c51493$afef49d0$28724ed8@paul52u7f5qyav> From: "Paul" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: I found the power Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 19:54:59 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="=======AVGMAIL-4213F9757CBE=======" --=======AVGMAIL-4213F9757CBE======= Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00F1_01C51461.65336F20" ------=_NextPart_000_00F1_01C51461.65336F20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thanks, Ed....I think the results of my on-again-off-again cowl = experiments pretty well proved this. Do you think that SCAT or SCEET = tubing (the one with the wire reinforcement, whichever that one is) = would create too much drag on the incoming air? Paul Conner ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Ed Anderson=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Wednesday, February 16, 2005 6:07 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: I found the power Paul, If you are not routing outside air to your engine intake, you are = giving up power. The less dense, hot air underneath the cowling will = take 200-400 rpm away from your rotary. The NACA ducts should work well = for this application. Ed A ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Paul=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Wednesday, February 16, 2005 6:26 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] I found the power Today I finished installing the firesleeve on the remaing fuel = lines, made some stand-offs so that the fuel lines would not be right up = against the engine, and finished hooking up and securing a few other = items. With the top cowling off, I ran the pumps for a minute, then = checked for leaks...none found. Then I started the engine and ran it = for 20 or so seconds and shut it down and reinspected for fuel leaks. = None found. I restarted and taxiied away from the hangar a bit so as to = not be as loud for others in and near the hangar and did a full power = runup. I hit 5600 static rpm's. In the past, the best I could hope for = was 5200, most of the time settling for 5100 rpm's. I taxiied back in = and installed the top cowling....max rpm's 5100. Took the top cowling = back off....max rpm's 5600. One more try....5100 with the cowling back = on. It is beginning to become more clear to me, that one of two things = are affecting rpm's. Option one is that with the top cowling on the = engine is ingesting heated air and just cannot develop the same power as = when it ingests outside unheated air. Option two is the muffler bearing = may be worn. I'm kinda leaning toward option one. I was thinking of installing two small NACA ducts on the bottom = of my cowling with two hoses coming up to feed air to my TWM = throttlebody. The NACA ducts I purchased from Van's RV (made for = cowling ventilation) already have a male outlet already molded in the = assembly, so you just slide a hose over it and secure with a clamp. Very = simple installation.(Works well for my cabin ventillation) If I recall = correctly, they are about the same size as my throttle body bore. I = wonder if I will loose much efficiency as the air goes through the = corregated hose, and if the Van's RV ventillation NACA ducts will = provide a sufficient volume of air. Of course while flying, I would have = the advantage of a little bit of ram effect as well as the ability to = suck in fresh outside air that has not been heated inside the cowling = during taxi/takeoff run. Any opinions/suggestions would of course be = much appreciated. I will discuss the vapor lock issue in the next post, = so as to not complicate responses, etc. Thanks to all who reply. Paul = Conner =20 -------------------------------------------------------------------------= --- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.8.8 - Release Date: 2/14/2005 -------------------------------------------------------------------------= --- >> Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ >> Archive: http://lancaironline.net/lists/flyrotary/List.html -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.8.8 - Release Date: 2/14/2005 ------=_NextPart_000_00F1_01C51461.65336F20 Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thanks, Ed....I think the results of my = on-again-off-again cowl experiments pretty well proved this.  Do = you think=20 that SCAT or SCEET tubing (the one with the wire reinforcement, = whichever that=20 one is) would create too much drag on the incoming air?  Paul=20 Conner
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Ed=20 Anderson
Sent: Wednesday, February 16, = 2005 6:07=20 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: I = found the=20 power

Paul,
 
If you are not routing outside air to = your engine=20 intake, you are giving up power.  The less dense, hot air = underneath the=20 cowling will take 200-400 rpm away from your rotary.  The NACA = ducts=20 should work well for this application.
 
Ed A
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Paul=20
To: Rotary motors in = aircraft=20
Sent: Wednesday, February 16, = 2005 6:26=20 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] I found = the=20 power

Today I finished installing the = firesleeve on=20 the remaing fuel lines, made some stand-offs so that the fuel lines = would=20 not be right up against the engine, and finished hooking up and = securing a=20 few other items. With the top cowling off,  I ran the = pumps for a=20 minute, then checked for leaks...none found.  Then I started = the engine=20 and ran it for 20 or so seconds and shut it down and reinspected for = fuel=20 leaks. None found.  I restarted and taxiied away from the = hangar a bit=20 so as to not be as loud for others in and near the hangar and did a = full=20 power runup.  I hit 5600 static rpm's. In the past, the best I = could=20 hope for was 5200, most of the time settling for 5100 rpm's.  I = taxiied=20 back in and installed the top cowling....max rpm's 5100.  Took = the top=20 cowling back off....max rpm's 5600.  One more try....5100 with = the=20 cowling back on.  It is beginning to become more clear to me, = that one=20 of two things are affecting rpm's.  Option one is that with the = top=20 cowling on the engine is ingesting heated air and just cannot = develop the=20 same power as when it ingests outside unheated air.  Option two = is the=20 muffler bearing may be worn.  I'm kinda leaning toward option=20 one.
     I was = thinking of=20 installing two small NACA ducts on the bottom of my cowling with two = hoses=20 coming up to feed air to my TWM throttlebody.  The NACA ducts I = purchased from Van's RV (made for cowling ventilation) already have = a male=20 outlet already molded in the assembly, so you just slide a hose over = it and=20 secure with a clamp. Very simple installation.(Works well for my = cabin=20 ventillation) If I recall correctly, they are about the same = size as my=20 throttle body bore. I wonder if I will loose much efficiency as the = air goes=20 through the corregated hose, and if the Van's RV ventillation NACA = ducts=20 will provide a sufficient volume of air. Of course while flying, I = would=20 have the advantage of a little bit of ram effect as well as the = ability to=20 suck in fresh outside air that has not been heated inside the = cowling during=20 taxi/takeoff run.  Any opinions/suggestions would of course be = much=20 appreciated.  I will discuss the vapor lock issue in the next = post, so=20 as to not complicate responses, etc.  Thanks to all who = reply. =20 Paul Conner
   

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG=20 Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.8.8 - Release = Date:=20 2/14/2005

>>  Homepage: =20 http://www.flyrotary.com/
>>  Archive:  =20 http://lancaironline.net/lists/flyrotary/List.html

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG=20 Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.8.8 - Release = Date:=20 2/14/2005
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