Return-Path: Received: from smtp015.mail.yahoo.com ([216.136.173.59] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.2.5) with SMTP id 561665 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Thu, 09 Dec 2004 17:22:34 -0500 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=216.136.173.59; envelope-from=prvt_pilot@yahoo.com Received: from unknown (HELO stevehome) (prvt?pilot@24.136.229.34 with login) by smtp015.mail.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Dec 2004 22:22:02 -0000 Reply-To: From: "Steve Brooks" To: "'Rotary motors in aircraft'" Subject: RE: [FlyRotary] Re: Fuel Leaks Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 17:20:50 -0500 Message-ID: <00cf01c4de3d$57725ae0$6b01a8c0@workgroup.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00D0_01C4DE13.6E9C52E0" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook CWS, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 In-Reply-To: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00D0_01C4DE13.6E9C52E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit If someone wants to split a set, I would be interested in buying 4 new injectors. Steve Brooks -----Original Message----- From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]On Behalf Of kenpowell@comcast.net Sent: Thursday, December 09, 2004 4:38 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Fuel Leaks OK, we have had this conversation before and I'm really not sure what I'm going to do but...... I picked up my latest 5.0 Mustang magazine and started looking for NEW injectors. Let's see, 42 lb set of 8 for $289 from www.buyfordracing.com (good company, I've bought from them several times); Ford Motorsports 42lb set for $359 from www.houstonperformance.com; Steeda 42 lb(probably Bosch) for $309 from www.gtrhipo.com. I usually see 38 lb injectors but not with the quick look that I just completed. The Mustang aftermarket is a great source of injectors, fuel pumps, fuel regulators, etc. After reading of all the problems with the old Mazda injectors I'm again wondering if we wouldn't just be better off to buy new ones. Go to the RC Engineering website to determine the best size for your HP output (looks like 38 lb will do nicely for my projected 220 HP; the smaller injector should make tuning the EC2 easier). Ken Powell ------------ Original message -------------- I understand. That is a lot of the problems we all face with these electro mechanical monsters of late design. You can spend more than car is worth keeping minor engine details working properly. Of course, it is still much better than the certificted aircraft world. Remember, this is a word of art marketing world we are talking about here; rebuilt normally means disassmbled by hand, inspected by a technician, reassemled by hand using new parts to replace worn / faulty parts; reconditioned normally means simply cleaned and inspected, meeting original specs and refurbished means cleaned, tested, repaired, if necessary, and re-packaged, usually to as nearly as new a state as possible. ----- Original Message ----- From: Ed Anderson To: Rotary motors in aircraft Sent: Thursday, December 09, 2004 3:26 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Fuel Leaks No disparagement of remanufacture parts implied, Jesse, I have used many remanufactured parts and still do. However, I have had at least 3 injectors which have stuck open or leaked in the 250 hours of flying. These were cleaned and "refurbished" (not certain exactly what that means). Would new parts have done any better - don't really know but would have hoped so. However, infant mortality rate of new parts is certainly a factor as well. Used injectors are probably better than new injectors - however, after a certain point I am certain that the reliability curve starts down again. A number of folks on the list have had injector problems at one time or the other. I just think that 10-15 year old injectors are getting a bit long in the tooth considering the environment they operate in. Here we do have a choice in that new injectors are available - just rather expensive. Four new injectors and I have the $$ I spent to rebuild the engine in the first place. Ed Anderson ----- Original Message ----- From: jesse farr To: Rotary motors in aircraft Sent: Thursday, December 09, 2004 3:10 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Fuel Leaks Since I, at one time, owned a parts rebuilding business, I gather you are suggesting that on certain type parts of certain age that washed parts are probably not worth the risk of going with less than new ? That's really all you can do with somethings. Of course, with others, you can not only re-build and/or replace worn parts but you can even improve on them. On others, cleaning and checking them is about all can be done. jofarr, soddy tn ----- Original Message ----- From: Ed Anderson These are refurbished injectors supposedly cleaned and flow tested - but, unless you buy new Mazda injectors at $235, you are getting remanufactured injectors which are getting to be almost 15 years old in some cases. ------=_NextPart_000_00D0_01C4DE13.6E9C52E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
If=20 someone wants to split a set, I would be interested in buying 4 new=20 injectors.
 
Steve=20 Brooks
-----Original Message-----
From: Rotary motors in = aircraft=20 [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]On Behalf Of=20 kenpowell@comcast.net
Sent: Thursday, December 09, 2004 = 4:38=20 PM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: = [FlyRotary] Re:=20 Fuel Leaks

OK, we have had this conversation before and I'm really not sure = what I'm=20 going to do but......  I picked up my latest 5.0 Mustang magazine = and=20 started looking for NEW injectors.  Let's see, 42 lb set of 8 for = $289=20 from www.buyfordracing.com =20 (good company, I've bought from them several times); Ford Motorsports = 42lb set=20 for $359 from www.houstonperformance.com= ;=20 Steeda 42 lb(probably Bosch) for $309 from www.gtrhipo.com.  I usually = see 38 lb=20 injectors but not with the quick look that I just completed.  The = Mustang=20 aftermarket is a great source of injectors, fuel pumps, fuel = regulators,=20 etc.  After reading of all the problems with the old Mazda = injectors I'm=20 again wondering if we wouldn't just be better off to buy new = ones.  Go to=20 the RC Engineering website to determine the best size for your HP = output=20 (looks like 38 lb will do nicely for my projected 220 HP; the = smaller=20 injector should make tuning the EC2 easier).
Ken Powell
 
 
------------ Original message --------------
I understand.  That is a lot of the = problems we=20 all face with these electro mechanical monsters of late = design. You can=20 spend more than car is worth keeping minor engine details working=20 properly. Of course, it is still much better than the = certificted=20 aircraft world. Remember, this is a word of art marketing world we = are=20 talking about here; rebuilt normally means disassmbled=20 by hand, inspected by a technician, reassemled by hand using new = parts to=20 replace worn / faulty parts; reconditioned normally means = simply=20 cleaned and inspected, meeting original specs and refurbished means = cleaned,=20 tested, repaired, if necessary, and re-packaged, usually to as = nearly=20 as new a state as possible.
----- Original Message ----- =
From:=20 Ed Anderson
To: Rotary motors in = aircraft=20
Sent: Thursday, December = 09, 2004=20 3:26 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: = Fuel=20 Leaks

No disparagement of remanufacture = parts=20 implied, Jesse, I have used many remanufactured parts and still = do. =20 However, I have had at least 3 injectors which have stuck open or = leaked=20 in the 250 hours of flying.  These were cleaned and = "refurbished"=20 (not certain exactly what that means).  Would new parts have = done any=20 better - don't really know but would have hoped so.
 
However, infant mortality rate of = new parts=20 is certainly a factor as well.  Used injectors are probably = better=20 than new injectors - however, after a certain point I am certain = that the=20 reliability curve  starts down again.
 
A number of folks on the = list  have=20 had injector problems at one time or the other.  I just think = that=20 10-15 year old injectors are getting a bit long in the tooth = considering=20 the environment they operate in.
 
Here we do have a choice in that = new=20 injectors are available - just rather expensive.  Four new = injectors=20 and I have the $$ I spent to rebuild the engine in the first = place. =20
 
Ed Anderson
 
 
----- Original Message ----- =
From:=20 jesse=20 farr
To: Rotary motors in = aircraft=20
Sent: Thursday, December = 09, 2004=20 3:10 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: = Fuel=20 Leaks

Since I, at one time, owned a = parts=20 rebuilding business, I gather you are suggesting that on certain = type=20 parts of certain age that washed parts are probably not worth = the risk=20 of going with less than new ? That's really all you can do with=20 somethings.  Of course, with others, you can not only = re-build=20 and/or replace worn parts but you can even improve on = them.  On=20 others, cleaning and checking them is about all can be=20 done.
jofarr, soddy tn
----- Original Message -----=20 From: Ed Anderson =
 
These are refurbished = injectors=20 supposedly cleaned and flow tested - but, unless you buy new = Mazda=20 injectors at $235, you are getting remanufactured injectors = which are=20 getting to be almost 15 years old in some=20 = cases.
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