Return-Path: Received: from imf24aec.mail.bellsouth.net ([205.152.59.72] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.2.5) with ESMTP id 550505 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Mon, 29 Nov 2004 21:03:22 -0500 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=205.152.59.72; envelope-from=sqpilot@bellsouth.net Received: from Carol ([209.214.44.166]) by imf24aec.mail.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.11 201-253-122-130-111-20040605) with SMTP id <20041130020250.LKZP2421.imf24aec.mail.bellsouth.net@Carol> for ; Mon, 29 Nov 2004 21:02:50 -0500 Message-ID: <00d101c4d680$a6fbe320$a62cd6d1@Carol> From: "paul" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: high oil temps must end Date: Mon, 29 Nov 2004 19:59:20 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00B9_01C4D64D.EA86DFB0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00B9_01C4D64D.EA86DFB0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MessageHold on, now....When it comes to shameless copying, I think I am = still King. Paul Conner ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Steve BRooks=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Monday, November 29, 2004 7:13 AM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: high oil temps must end Dave, What parts are you looking for on the T4 ? I had done some research = on going that route before, and may have some sources, depending on what = you need. Plus, I hope that you go the T4 route, so that I can shamelessly copy = what you do. Steve Brooks -----Original Message----- From: Rotary motors in aircraft = [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]On Behalf Of DaveLeonard Sent: Monday, November 29, 2004 1:11 AM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: high oil temps must end I can't say that I feel really sorry for you Rusty, at least you are = making enough power to overheat :-) All you have to do is lift up on = that lead foot some. Since I took off the turbo and the ambient temps = are cooler I find myself not even looking at the temps anymore. On the = other hand I'm making only about 140h.p. lately. I barely have enough = power to get over the top of my loops... But hey, I get to do loops :-) Still lookig for supplies to install the TO4, but thinking about = trying a bolt-on hybrid. Will also do a test in the near future to see how much the turbine = housing is hurting my power - plan to do a run up with just the manifold = to see what kind of static RPM I can get. Dave Leonard =20 Greetings, Sorry to hear about Johns most recent problems. I'm already = nominating him for the perseverance award. =20 I tried to go visit Paul today, but only made it about half way = before getting tired of fighting my oil temps. It was only 60 degrees = today, and I climbed at 120 mph, but only made it to 4500 feet before = ringing the bell at 210. I reduced power, and continued a slow climb to = 8500 where I wanted to do some cruise testing, but I couldn't get the = oil temp below 210. At least I thought I could get the temps down once = I leveled out... wrong :-( I finally did a spirited 180, and headed = home to fix this once and for all (I hope). Otherwise, the engine ran = OK. =20 Water temps continue to be just awesome, almost too cool, so I = can't see this being a cowl exit problem. I have to conclude that my = current (poorly shaped) 24 cu in oil scoop is not getting the job done. = I haven't made a final decision, but I think I'll probably do the = easiest thing first, which is to simply increase the size of the current = scoop, without doing much for the shape. At present, the scoop is oval, = about 7" wide by 4" tall. The plan will be to increase it to 7" round, = which will be 38 sq in, and should be way overkill. If this doesn't = cool significantly better, I may have to come to a new conclusion :-) =20 The oil temps were just great with the B drive. The water temps = were even lower than now. For reference, here's an excerpt from my = 7-4-04 log. =20 Finally got a cloud free day, so I climbed to 8000 ft to do some = testing. I climbed at 120 mph, and saw a max of 195 degrees on the oil = temp, and a max of 178 degrees on water. It took 7 minutes, according = to the EM-2 flight timer to get to 8000 ft, which is OK for now. =20 The extra power afforded by the C drive must just be pushing my = heat load beyond what the current oil setup can handle. Stay tuned for = more fiberglass fun. Ed, have you noticed any of this temp increase? Also, what was = the size of your oil inlet again? I know you have a much more ideal = duct shape than I do, which is probably helping quite a bit. At the = moment, I'll settle for brute force cooling if it actually works. Rusty (joining John with my "tired of this" attitude) ------=_NextPart_000_00B9_01C4D64D.EA86DFB0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
Hold on, now....When it comes to = shameless copying,=20 I think I am still King.   Paul Conner
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Steve=20 BRooks
Sent: Monday, November 29, 2004 = 7:13=20 AM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: high = oil temps=20 must end

Dave,
What=20 parts are you looking for on the T4 ?  I had done some research = on going=20 that route before, and may have some sources, depending on what you=20 need.
Plus, I hope that you go the T4 route, so that I can = shamelessly copy=20 what you do.
 
Steve Brooks
-----Original Message-----
From: Rotary motors in = aircraft=20 [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]On Behalf Of=20 DaveLeonard
Sent: Monday, November 29, 2004 1:11=20 AM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: = [FlyRotary]=20 Re: high oil temps must end

I=20 can't say that I feel really sorry for you Rusty, at least you are = making=20 enough power to overheat :-)   All you have to do is lift = up on=20 that lead foot some.  Since I took off the turbo and the = ambient temps=20 are cooler I find myself not even looking at the temps = anymore.  On the=20 other hand I'm making only about 140h.p. lately.  I barely have = enough=20 power to get over the top of my loops...  But hey, I get to do = loops=20 :-)
 
Still lookig for supplies to install the = TO4, but=20 thinking about trying a bolt-on hybrid.
 
Will also do a test in the near future to = see how=20 much the turbine housing is hurting my power - plan to do a run up = with just=20 the manifold to see what kind of static RPM I can = get.
 
Dave Leonard

 
Greetings,
 
Sorry to = hear about=20 Johns most recent problems.  I'm already nominating him for = the=20 perseverance award. 
 
I tried = to go visit=20 Paul today, but only made it about half way before getting tired = of=20 fighting my oil temps.  It was only 60 degrees today, and I = climbed=20 at 120 mph, but only made it to 4500 feet before ringing the bell = at=20 210.  I reduced power, and continued a slow climb to 8500 = where I=20 wanted to do some cruise testing, but I couldn't get the oil temp = below=20 210.  At least I thought I could get the temps down once I = leveled=20 out... wrong :-(    I finally did a spirited 180, = and=20 headed home to fix this once and for all (I hope).  = Otherwise, the=20 engine ran OK.  
 
Water = temps continue=20 to be just awesome, almost too cool, so I can't see this being a = cowl exit=20 problem.  I have to conclude that my current (poorly shaped) = 24 cu in=20 oil scoop is not getting the job done.  I haven't made a = final=20 decision, but I think I'll probably do the easiest thing first, = which is=20 to simply increase the size of the current scoop, without doing = much for=20 the shape.  At present, the scoop is oval, about 7" wide by = 4"=20 tall.  The plan will be to increase it to 7" round, = which will=20 be 38 sq in, and should be way overkill.  If this = doesn't=20 cool significantly better, I may have to come to a = new conclusion=20 :-) 
 
The oil = temps were=20 just great with the B drive.  The water temps were even lower = than=20 now.  For reference, here's an excerpt from my 7-4-04=20 log.  
 

Finally got a cloud = free day,=20 so I climbed to 8000 ft to do some testing.  I climbed at 120 mph, = and saw a=20 max of 195 degrees on the oil temp, and a max of 178 degrees on=20 water.  It took 7 = minutes,=20 according to the EM-2 flight timer to get to 8000 ft, which is OK = for=20 now. =20

 

The extra = power=20 afforded by the C drive must just be pushing my heat load beyond = what the=20 current oil setup can handle.  Stay tuned for more fiberglass = fun.
 
Ed, have = you noticed=20 any of this temp increase?  Also, what was the size of your = oil inlet=20 again?  I know you have a much more ideal duct shape than I = do, which=20 is probably helping quite a bit.  At the moment, I'll settle = for=20 brute force cooling if it actually works.
 
Rusty = (joining John=20 with my "tired of this" attitude)
 
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