X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Tue, 02 Sep 2014 11:36:42 -0400 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from p3plsmtpa08-06.prod.phx3.secureserver.net ([173.201.193.107] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.0.9e) with ESMTP id 7125096 for lml@lancaironline.net; Tue, 02 Sep 2014 11:19:45 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=173.201.193.107; envelope-from=jayph@fastairplane.net Received: from shuriken ([69.92.48.82]) by p3plsmtpa08-06.prod.phx3.secureserver.net with id mFKB1o0091mPo4M01FKBNL; Tue, 02 Sep 2014 08:19:12 -0700 From: "Jay Phillips" X-Original-To: "'Lancair Mailing List'" References: In-Reply-To: Subject: RE: [LML] Engine Oil Temps; May need fuel system setup X-Original-Date: Tue, 2 Sep 2014 08:19:12 -0700 X-Original-Message-ID: <004b01cfc6c1$400b64b0$c0222e10$@fastairplane.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_004C_01CFC686.93AEFDB0" X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 14.0 Thread-Index: AQJVnJYBi+r4ZpJIZ2AOSOK/RcNuopriR7Lg Content-Language: en-us This is a multipart message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_004C_01CFC686.93AEFDB0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable George, =20 You need to do a proper fuel system setup (SID 97-3). Once that is done = you=E2=80=99ll be able to look for other problems. =20 You don=E2=80=99t say what engine you have. If it is a TSIO-550, then = indeed, an expensive piece of test gear is required which references = fuel pressure against upper deck pressure. Although it is inconvenient, = best move is to find a competent shop which has the gear. If you have an = IO-550, then all that is needed is a couple of calibrated gauges of = sufficient resolution, plus hoses and fittings. This is all spelled out = in SID 97-3. =20 SID 97-3 is supposed to be performed every annual, every 100 hours, and = any time the fuel system has been opened.=20 =20 Jay Phillips =20 From: Lancair Mailing List [mailto:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of = George Wehrung Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2014 6:46 AM To: Lancair Mailing List Subject: [LML] Engine Oil Temps; May need fuel system setup =20 All, =20 I am experiencing higher than normal oil temps. It=E2=80=99s not = unusual to see 210=CB=9AF in the climb. And then the oil temps remain = above 200=CB=9A during cruise. =20 In the last annual, there was nothing done to the fuel system. The = magnetos were spot on. We also checked the temp sensor to ensure its = accuracy against three different thermometers and ran it up and down = using a deep fryer with water. We also pulled the Vernatherm out of the = bottom of the oil cooler to ensure it was working. I also called Rosta = mfg to discuss the vernatherm operation. It cracked open at 150=CB=9A = and was full extended by 185=CB=9A per the manufacturer. =20 In flight, I started playing with the fuel flow to see if I could lower = the temps. What I noticed was that If I put the fuel flow about = 250=CB=9A Rich of Peak I could move the oil temp down below 180=CB=9A. = I could then hold it using about 225=CB=9A ROP. I also cooled the motor = by reducing the RPM to 2300.=20 =20 Anytime I ran the motor below 200=CB=9AROP the oil temp would climb = again. This is counterintuitive according to the Oklahoma guys = recommendations on running the EGT temps. =20 As another point of data, I ran the engine LOP and noticed that I could = stabilize the temp at 184=CB=9A by running about 45-50=CB=9A LOP.=20 =20 After talking to the TCM support staff it would appear that I might need = a fuel system setup but I don=E2=80=99t know of anyone that has a fuel = pressure system, which will necessitate me taking the plane to a repair = station. That system that TCM recommends is about $5,500.=20 =20 Here are some numbers from yesterday=E2=80=99s flight: =20 Date Altitude OAT IAS TAS % HP RPM Peak EGT Deg R/LOP GPH Fuel PSI Oil Temp Oil PSI =09 8/31/2014 9500 11 129 153 58 2300 1451 206 ROP 16.7 16 179 51 8/31/2014 9500 12 136 162 60 2400 1451 247 ROP 18.9 19 180 51 8/31/2014 9500 13 128 151 58 2300 1461 45 LOP 10.6 12 184 51 8/31/2014 9500 13 130 154 62 2400 1461 42 LOP 11.3 11 183 51 8/31/2014 9500 13 131 155 62 2500 1461 50 LOP 11.5 11 184 51 8/31/2014 9500 13 131 155 62 2490 1461 36 LOP 11.5 11 184 51 =20 =20 Does anyone have any recommendations?=20 =20 =20 ------=_NextPart_000_004C_01CFC686.93AEFDB0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

George,

 

You need to do a proper fuel system setup (SID 97-3). Once that is = done you=E2=80=99ll be able to look for other = problems.

 

You don=E2=80=99t say what engine you have. If it is a TSIO-550, then = indeed, an expensive piece of test gear is required which references = fuel pressure against upper deck pressure. Although it is inconvenient, = best move is to find a competent shop which has the gear. If you have an = IO-550, then all that is needed is a couple of calibrated gauges of = sufficient resolution, plus hoses and fittings. This is all spelled out = in SID 97-3.

 

SID 97-3 is supposed to be performed every annual, every 100 hours, = and any time the fuel system has been opened.

 

Jay Phillips

 

From:= = Lancair Mailing List [mailto:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of = George Wehrung
Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2014 6:46 = AM
To: Lancair Mailing List
Subject: [LML] Engine = Oil Temps; May need fuel system = setup

 

All,

 

I = am experiencing higher than normal oil temps.  It=E2=80=99s not = unusual to see 210=CB=9AF in the climb.  And then the oil temps = remain above 200=CB=9A during cruise.

 

In the last annual, there was nothing done to the fuel = system. The magnetos were spot on.  We also checked the temp sensor = to ensure its accuracy against three different thermometers and ran it = up and down using a deep fryer with water.  We also pulled the = Vernatherm out of the bottom of the oil cooler to ensure it was working. =  I also called Rosta mfg to discuss the vernatherm operation. =  It cracked open at 150=CB=9A and was full extended by 185=CB=9A = per the manufacturer.

 

In flight, I started playing with the fuel flow to see = if I could lower the temps.  What I noticed was that If I put the = fuel flow about 250=CB=9A Rich of Peak I could move the oil temp down = below 180=CB=9A.  I could then hold it using about 225=CB=9A ROP. =  I also cooled the motor by reducing the RPM to = 2300. 

 

Anytime I ran the motor below 200=CB=9AROP the oil = temp would climb again. This is counterintuitive according to the = Oklahoma guys recommendations on running the EGT = temps.

 

As another point of data, I ran the engine LOP and = noticed that I could stabilize the temp at 184=CB=9A by running about = 45-50=CB=9A LOP. 

 

After talking to the TCM support staff it would appear = that I might need a fuel system setup but I don=E2=80=99t know of anyone = that has a fuel pressure system, which will necessitate me taking the = plane to a repair station.  That system that TCM recommends is = about $5,500. 

 

Here are some numbers from yesterday=E2=80=99s = flight:

 

= = = = = =

Date

= Altitude

= OAT

= IAS

= TAS

= % HP

= RPM

= Peak EGT

= Deg R/LOP

= GPH

= Fuel PSI

= Oil Temp

= Oil PSI

8/31/2014

= 9500

= 11

= 129

= 153

= 58

= 2300

= 1451

= 206 ROP

= 16.7

= 16

= 179

= 51

8/31/2014

= 9500

= 12

= 136

= 162

= 60

= 2400

= 1451

= 247 ROP

= 18.9

= 19

= 180

= 51

8/31/2014

= 9500

= 13

= 128

= 151

= 58

= 2300

= 1461

= 45 LOP

= 10.6

= 12

= 184

= 51

8/31/2014

= 9500

= 13

= 130

= 154

= 62

= 2400

= 1461

= 42 LOP

= 11.3

= 11

= 183

= 51

8/31/2014

= 9500

= 13

= 131

= 155

= 62

= 2500

= 1461

= 50 LOP

= 11.5

= 11

= 184

= 51

8/31/2014

= 9500

= 13

= 131

= 155

= 62

= 2490

= 1461

= 36 LOP

= 11.5

= 11

= 184

= 51

 

 

Does anyone have any = recommendations? 

 

 

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