X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2013 07:36:18 -0400 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: <2thman1@gmail.com> Received: from mail-pa0-f46.google.com ([209.85.220.46] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.0.7) with ESMTPS id 6546702 for lml@lancaironline.net; Sat, 19 Oct 2013 00:59:57 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.220.46; envelope-from=2thman1@gmail.com Received: by mail-pa0-f46.google.com with SMTP id fa1so5548915pad.19 for ; Fri, 18 Oct 2013 21:59:21 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 10.68.172.164 with SMTP id bd4mr6436518pbc.153.1382158761686; Fri, 18 Oct 2013 21:59:21 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-Return-Path: <2thman1@gmail.com> Received: from [192.168.1.121] (c-208-53-115-208.customer.broadstripe.net. [208.53.115.208]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id wr10sm2545431pbc.17.2013.10.18.21.59.20 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Fri, 18 Oct 2013 21:59:20 -0700 (PDT) References: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-DA929E6E-24CC-4999-B1FF-91193190B6E6 X-Original-Message-Id: <571F0333-697C-41DA-98EB-9C6241230ACA@gmail.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: iPad Mail (10B329) From: John Barrett <2thman1@gmail.com> Subject: Re: Hot TITs on X country leg. LIVP X-Original-Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2013 21:59:20 -0700 X-Original-To: Greg Milnar , Lancair Mailing List --Apple-Mail-DA929E6E-24CC-4999-B1FF-91193190B6E6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Time to fess up. The failure mode turned out to be a failed electronic igni= tion system. I run one Plasma III lightspeed and one mag. The lightspeed q= uit and I didn't recognize it. It had to have happened during climb out or a= t level off. The run up prior to take off was entirely normal. =20 The hot TIT's and EGT's were the result of incomplete fuel burn by the mag t= hat was the only ignition still running. Fuel in the exhaust stacks burns i= n the turbines and heats everything up real fast. I don't understand why le= aning made it worse though. Can anyone explain that? Lest anyone jump on Klaus, let me be quick to admit it was not a failure of h= is system but rather an installation defect. As a matter of fact he got o= n the phone with me on a weekend day and helped trouble shoot it. He overni= ghted a loaner to me when I didn't have enough tools or access to do adequat= e system checks and did not laugh at me too badly when the loaner did not fi= x the problem. A check of the ground for the power circuit showed about 2 K= ohms resistance. The fix was to wire in another ground. Best regards, John Barrett N31VP Sent from my iPad On Oct 18, 2013, at 8:50 PM, Greg Milnar wrote: >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > Hello John, >=20 > I am sorry that I missed out on the LOBO fly in discussion of your event.=20= > I have been watching the thread for the answer but I must have missed it i= f the question was answered. Please let me know what you learned. >=20 > I have a question about the new dimension of the rub rail material past it= s retaining bracket on the main gear doors. I put the quire out to LML but d= id not receive any responses. >=20 > Thanks, >=20 > Greg Milnar >=20 > 651 738 3117 >=20 >=20 >=20 > From: John Barrett [mailto:2thman1@gmail.com]=20 > Sent: Tuesday, October 15, 2013 3:11 PM > To: John Barrett > Subject: Hot TITs on X country leg. LIVP >=20 > Hello all, >=20 >=20 > We returned home yesterday from East Coast visits following LOBO mtg in Gr= eenville, SC. >=20 >=20 > On the way to Greenville after an intermediate stop in NE, we experienced a= n engine problem that I brought to the attention of anyone at LOBO who would= listen and give advice including Neil George from TCM with Allen Barrett ho= oked into the discussion by text and cell phone. =20 >=20 > The short story is that when I reached my planned VFR altitude of 15,500 a= nd levelled off I pulled back power but forgot to lean or reset prop for abo= ut ten minutes. Then when I remembered and tried to lean the engine, TITs s= kyrocketed followed by hot EGT readings. See the attached link to the Savvy= analysisgraphing of the engine behavior and see if you can come up with what= went wrong. When you review the graph, you=E2=80=99ll likely notice that I= tried twice more after the initial leaning to see if I could get lean of pe= ak and the engine emphatically let me know it did NOT like what I was doing= . >=20 >=20 > I can tell you the problem has been resolved and we flew the airplane arou= nd the country for another week with no repeats. Now I'm interested to know= what LMLers might think caused this because I was totally surprised when I l= earned what the real problem was. >=20 > Some of you who were supportive at LOBO already know the answer so let=E2=80= =99s see what others come up with. I have many people to thank for amazing= help in finding and correcting the problem so I want to go on record as one= of the most appreciative people there could be for LOBO, our many vendors a= nd for pilots around the airport in Greenville who gave advice, time, materi= als, loaned tools and so on. >=20 >=20 > https://www.savvyanalysis.com/flight/402058/a3f088f6-4add-464e-99c7-38fd29= 2628b1 >=20 > Best regards, > John Barrett >=20 > N31VP=20 >=20 >=20 --Apple-Mail-DA929E6E-24CC-4999-B1FF-91193190B6E6 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Time to fess up.  The failure mod= e turned out to be a failed electronic ignition system.  I run one Plas= ma III lightspeed and one mag.  The lightspeed quit and I didn't recogn= ize it.  It had to have happened during climb out or at level off. &nbs= p;The run up prior to take off was entirely normal.  

The hot TIT's and EGT's were the result of incomplete fuel burn by t= he mag that was the only ignition still running.   Fuel in the exhaust s= tacks burns in the turbines and heats everything up real fast.  I don't= understand why leaning made it worse though.  Can anyone explain that?=

Lest anyone jump on Klaus, let me be quick to admi= t it was not a failure of his system but rather  an installation defect= .   As a matter of fact he  got on the phone with me on a weekend d= ay and helped trouble shoot it.  He overnighted a loaner to me when I d= idn't have enough tools or access to do adequate system checks and did not l= augh at me too badly when the loaner did not fix the problem.  A check o= f the ground for the power circuit showed about 2 Kohms resistance.  Th= e fix was to wire in another ground.

Best regards,<= /div>
John Barrett
N31VP

Sent from my iPad


On Oct 18, 2013, at 8:50 PM, Greg Milnar <greg456pw@gmail.com> wrote:





Hello John,

I am sorry tha= t I missed out on the LOBO fly in discussion of your event. 
I have been watching the thread for the answer but I must have miss= ed it if the question was answered.  Please let me know what you learne= d.

I have a question about the new d= imension of the rub rail material past its retaining bracket on the main gea= r doors.  I put the quire out to LML but did not receive any responses.=

Thanks,

Greg Milnar

651 738 3= 117


From: = John Barrett [mailto:2thman1@gmail.com<= /a>] 
Sent: Tuesday, October 15, 2013 3:11 PM
To:<= /b> John Barrett
Subject: Hot TITs on X country leg. LIV= P

On the way to Greenville after an interm= ediate stop in NE, we experienced an engine problem that I brought to the at= tention of anyone at LOBO who would listen and give advice includi= ng Neil George from TCM with Allen Barrett hooked into the discussion b= y text and cell phone.  

The short story is that when I r= eached my planned VFR altitude of 15,500 and levelled off I pulled back powe= r but forgot to lean or reset prop for about ten minutes.  Then when I r= emembered and tried to lean the engine, TITs skyrocketed followed by hot EGT= readings.  See the attached link to the Savvyanalysisgraphing of t= he engine behavior and see if you can come up with what went wrong. &nb= sp; When you review the graph, you=E2=80=99ll likely notice that I tried twi= ce more after the initial leaning to see if I could get lean of peak and the= engine emphatically let me know it did  NOT like what I was doing.


= --Apple-Mail-DA929E6E-24CC-4999-B1FF-91193190B6E6--