X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Received: from omr-d08.mx.aol.com ([205.188.109.207] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.0.5) with ESMTP id 6298280 for lml@lancaironline.net; Thu, 30 May 2013 11:58:12 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=205.188.109.207; envelope-from=Sky2high@aol.com Received: from mtaomg-da02.r1000.mx.aol.com (mtaomg-da02.r1000.mx.aol.com [172.29.51.138]) by omr-d08.mx.aol.com (Outbound Mail Relay) with ESMTP id 258A57000009F for ; Thu, 30 May 2013 11:57:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from core-mta001c.r1000.mail.aol.com (core-mta001.r1000.mail.aol.com [172.29.234.129]) by mtaomg-da02.r1000.mx.aol.com (OMAG/Core Interface) with ESMTP id 8C7C2E00008F for ; Thu, 30 May 2013 11:57:37 -0400 (EDT) From: Sky2high@aol.com Full-name: Sky2high Message-ID: <5628f.878eda7.3ed8d0f1@aol.com> Date: Thu, 30 May 2013 11:57:37 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [LML] N 471 on the runway To: lml@lancaironline.net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_5628f.878eda7.3ed8d0f1_boundary" X-Mailer: AOL 9.6 sub 168 X-Originating-IP: [67.175.156.123] x-aol-global-disposition: G DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=mx.aol.com; s=20121107; t=1369929458; bh=062xXEhXjLiEFIdnqub5XJFi0vFZEwzaXCGrGFMGp2k=; h=From:To:Subject:Message-ID:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=yZOzy5TZWs/vgpmcWdUjL94yy/+2MX3boYdqczByfCKGM72hwBgwuawggHCZDoqeO qaybSCNELXcmU9tMmH1WyvSw4g43qRHBWIUETJIbtjMTckUE/P5hmWhyqmDbK3Dzk7 UPLx8u4hkI04ZtAC6tEH4CFR/0pzqBqzzmoRCvSI= X-AOL-SCOLL-SCORE: 0:2:480376416:93952408 X-AOL-SCOLL-URL_COUNT: 0 x-aol-sid: 3039ac1d338a51a776f112b1 --part1_5628f.878eda7.3ed8d0f1_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Language: en Paul, =20 I am happy that you and your wife were safe after that experience. Thanks= =20 for the detailed narrative.=20 =20 Please understand that my comments are aimed at other LNC2 pilots that have= =20 not yet had such a problem. =20 If the gear is not tucked away after about 10 seconds, there is a problem.= =20 A problem might be caused by the relays, pressure switches, pump, or, as= =20 in your case, a broken line allowing the fluid to be pumped overboard. As= =20 you noted, drag was present and noise from the air stream in the wheel=20 wells may drown out the sound of the pump running. However, the yellow=20 transition light is on only if power is being supplied to the pump. =20 =20 At this point, it would seem that the best option is to remain below 120 = =20 KIAS and move the gear switch to the down position. =20 =20 If the green locked lights do not come on after abut ten seconds, the =20 emergency gear extension procedure should be followed. If the down and lo= cked=20 lights come on, it is questionable whether either a landing should be made= =20 then for analysis or to try to re-cycle the gear up.=20 =20 If the transition light has remained on, it is time to pull the pump =20 breaker and remove power to the relay coils so that an intermittent relay = is not=20 also destroyed (that is why I recommend that the relays be powered and=20 fused or breakered after the pump breaker, i.e. one pull removes all power= =20 from the gear system). =20 No external observer can tell the pilot whether the gear is down and=20 locked. One must rely on the operationally testable down and locked green= =20 indicator lights.=20 =20 The documented emergency gear extension procedure includes carefully=20 slowing to 87 KIAS, gear switch in the down position (in your case where t= he=20 pump won't shut off - the pump breaker is pulled), skids/slips performed i= f=20 necessary to lock the mains and gentle maneuvers to get the nose locked if= =20 the gas spring is not strong enough to overcome wind resistance and get th= e=20 over-center link locked (including possibly a zero G maneuver carefully do= ne=20 and more easily managed if an AOA indication is available). =20 Of course, this is why Lancair recommended monthly in-flight tests of the = =20 emergency gear extension procedure (the steps should be placarded on the=20 panel) and annual tests of the 100# gas spring. The monthly tests gives o= ne=20 added slow flight confidence and practice for a flight to Air Venture. =20 BTW, some pilots have suggested the practice emergency gear drop tests be= =20 done at slightly higher speeds (95 or 100 KIAS) where a fully charged gas = =20 spring should probably be adequate and if it isn't, it is time to change i= t. =20 Your procedure for landing worked well and was successful. Bummer about= =20 the damage to the plane. =20 Scott Krueger =20 =20 In a message dated 5/30/2013 7:21:49 A.M. Central Daylight Time, =20 marv@lancair.net writes: Posted for PAUL hershorin : =20 May 26, 2013 events of Lancair N471LA Nose gear failure at F45=20 Submitted by Paul A. Hershorin=20 On Sunday morning at about 9:30 a.m. my wife Pat and I, after doing our =20 preflight inspection and engine checks, took off from F45 (North Palm Beach= =20 Air Park) to fly to Florida Keys Marathon (MTH) for lunch. Upon lift off = we=20 had 22 gallons of fuel on board for a 40 minute flight. We climbed to =20 8,500 feet VFR, I set up the plane on a fuel burn of 8.4 gallons per hour a= nd =20 we indicated 240 miles per hour. It was a beautiful flight without any =20 problems. We landed, parked the plane and went into the FBO signed in and= =20 went to Burdines for lunch which was most enjoyable. =20 After lunch, we returned to the FBO, visited the EAA museum and then Pat= =20 rested in the FBO while I moved the plane to the fuel pump. To move the=20 plane to the gas pump I used my tow bar. I did not see any oil or hydraul= ic=20 fluid on the ground by the nose wheel or on the nose strut at this time. = =20 The plane took 26.35 gallons of fuel and then I did my preflight inspectio= n. =20 There were not any preflight problems. We taxied to runway 07, did the = =20 engine checks, announced that we were taking active runway 07 and will be = =20 departing to the north. Upon lift off I raised the gear lever and flap =20 switch and immediately noticed no gear lights showing up or down. I told = my=20 wife there was a problem=E2=80=94no lights and the plane was not accelerati= ng=E2=80=94I could=20 tell that the gear had not retracted. I announced to MTH that we had no= =20 lights indicating the position of the landing gear and that I was going to= =20 circle and do a low pass over runway 07=E2=80=94could someone tell me the p= osition =20 of the gear. First pass I was told that it was =E2=80=9CUP=E2=80=9D, howev= er, with the =20 drag on the plane I said that I would make a second pass=E2=80=94this time = there was a =20 helicopter watching that said the gear was =E2=80=9Cdown=E2=80=9D I tried = to recycle the =20 gear without any luck. I told my wife that we would fly to our home base = =20 F45 along the coast. =20 About 15 or 20 miles out of MTH we had a warning light telling us that the= =20 =E2=80=9Cvolts=E2=80=9D was in the yellow range=E2=80=94my hydraulic pump= light indicator was on=20 so I pulled the 50amp breaker=E2=80=94the =E2=80=9Cvolts=E2=80=9D went fro= m 9 back up to 13-14. =20 It was a slow flight at 143 kts. at 2,000 feet looking out for many planes= =20 and staying out of Miami and then Ft Lauderdale air space. =20 When we reached Boca I called Palm Beach tower and told them the problem= =20 that I was having and asked if I could do a tower fly by and if they coul= d=20 tell if the gear was locked down. On the first pass I was too low for the= =20 tower to be able to tell if the gear was locked in or not so I was asked t= o=20 come around again but higher this time. I came around at about 250 feet= =20 and the tower said that they thought it may be locked in place but they ha= d=20 no way of knowing. I asked to go to my home base at F45 and they vectored= =20 me on course. =20 Here is the problem=E2=80=94to lock in the main gear I did side movers to = catch=20 the wind on the gear doors that are attached to the gear, this locked them= =20 in, however the nose gear free falls from the up position being pushed by = a=20 gas strut=E2=80=94no way of knowing if it was in position or not. I annou= nced a=20 right hand down wind for runway 08R at F45, announced a right base and the= n=20 final 08R full stop=E2=80=94somewhere in the discussion or Palm Beach towe= r announced=20 to F45 I was having gear problems=E2=80=94on final I told Pat to remove he= r=20 glasses in case she might hit the dash, said that on touchdown I was going= to=20 pull the fuel all the way out, turn off the ignition and three master swit= ches=20 which I did=E2=80=94landed on the mains and held it off as long as I could= and=20 then it settled on the props shattering all three blades and the plane cam= e to=20 a stop a 1,000 feet down the runway. Pat and I looked at each other, I= =20 climbed out of the plane and saw people running from the FBO and individua= ls=20 on golf carts coming to our aid, I helped Pat out with bystander help=E2= =80=94the=20 sheriff dept. arrived in two to three minutes and the fire dept arrived in= =20 about 10 to 15 minutes. Neither Pat or I were hurt, in fact it was a very= =20 smooth landing and stop. =20 A fork truck was brought out and I connected a tow rope to two blades of= =20 the propeller, the fork lift lifted the nose of the plane and we pulled th= e=20 nose gear into position and strapped it to the two bottom propeller blades= =20 pulling the gear forward. The FBO sent out their airplane tow and they= =20 towed the plane to my hangar. While, waiting for the plane to be raised th= e=20 sheriff did his report, fire department did their report and I received a= =20 call from the FAA stating that it was =E2=80=9COK=E2=80=9D to move the pla= ne from the=20 runway and I would be contacted this week by the FAA.=20 Upon inspection of the nose gear by an IA, A&P it was found that the nose= =20 gear door hydraulic hose fitting, aluminum, sheared off at the actuator. = =20 This must have happened upon lift off when I moved the gear switch to=20 retract the landing gear and pumped all the hydraulic fluid overboard and= =20 released the load on the nose gear. I tried many maneuvers, but could not= get the=20 nose gear to lock in.=20 Once again, I want to state that neither Pat nor I were injured and want= =20 to thank all the individuals from MTH to F45 for their assistance and hel= p.=20 Submitted by Paul A. Hershorin 5/29/13=20 -- For archives and unsub http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/lml/List.htm= l --part1_5628f.878eda7.3ed8d0f1_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Language: en
Paul,
 
I am happy that you and your wife were safe after that experience.&nbs= p;=20 Thanks for the detailed narrative.
 
Please understand that my comments are aimed at other LNC2 pilots that= have=20 not yet had such a problem.
 
If the gear is not tucked away after about 10 seconds, there is a=20 problem.  A problem might be caused by the relays, pressure switches, = pump,=20 or, as in your case, a broken line allowing the fluid to be pumped=20 overboard.  As you noted, drag was present and noise from the air= =20 stream in the wheel wells may drown out the sound of the pump=20 running.  However, the yellow transition light is on only if= =20 power is being supplied to the pump. 
 
At this point, it would seem that the best option is to remain below 1= 20=20 KIAS and move the gear switch to the down position. 
 
If the green locked lights do not come on after abut ten seconds, the= =20 emergency gear extension procedure should be followed.  If the down an= d=20 locked lights come on, it is questionable whether either a landing sho= uld=20 be made then for analysis or to try to re-cycle the gear up. 
 
If the transition light has remained on, it is time to pull the pump= =20 breaker and remove power to the relay coils so that an intermittent re= lay=20 is not also destroyed (that is why I recommend that the relays be powe= red=20 and fused or breakered after the pump breaker, i.e. one pull removes= all=20 power from the gear system).
 
No external observer can tell the pilot whether the gear is down= =20 and locked.  One must rely on the=20 operationally testable down and locked green indicator=20 lights. 
 
The documented emergency gear extension procedure includes=20 carefully slowing to 87 KIAS, gear switch in the down position (in you= r=20 case where the pump won't shut off - the pump breaker is pulled),= =20 skids/slips performed if necessary to lock the mains and gentle maneuv= ers=20 to get the nose locked if the gas spring is not strong enough to overc= ome=20 wind resistance and get the over-center link locked (includi= ng=20 possibly a zero G maneuver carefully done and more easily managed if a= n AOA=20 indication is available).
 
Of course, this is why Lancair recommended monthly in-flight tests of = the=20 emergency gear extension procedure (the steps should be placarded on the pa= nel)=20 and annual tests of the 100# gas spring.  The monthly tests gives one = added=20 slow flight confidence and practice for a flight to Air Venture.
 
BTW, some pilots have suggested the practice emergency gear drop = tests=20 be done at slightly higher speeds (95 or 100 KIAS) where a fully charged ga= s=20 spring should probably be adequate and if it isn't, it is time to chan= ge=20 it.
 
Your procedure for landing worked well and was successful.  Bumme= r=20 about the damage to the plane.
 
Scott Krueger
 
In a message dated 5/30/2013 7:21:49 A.M. Central Daylight Time,=20 marv@lancair.net writes:
=


Posted for PAUL= =20 hershorin <paulhershorin@att.net>:=20

 =20            May 26, 2013 events of Lancair N= 471LA=20 Nose gear failure at F45

Submitted=20 by Paul A. Hershorin

    =20 On Sunday morning at about 9:30 a.m. my wife Pat and I, after doing our= =20 preflight inspection and engine checks, took off from F45 (North Palm Bea= ch=20 Air Park) to fly to Florida Keys Marathon (MTH) for lunch.  Upon lif= t off=20 we had 22 gallons of fuel on board for a 40 minute flight.  We climb= ed to=20 8,500 feet VFR, I set up the plane on a fuel burn of 8.4 gallons per hour= and=20 we indicated 240 miles per hour.  It was a beautiful flight without = any=20 problems.  We landed, parked the plane and went into the FBO signed = in=20 and went to Burdines for lunch which was most enjoyable.=20

 After=20 lunch, we returned to the FBO, visited the EAA museum and then Pat rested= in=20 the FBO while I moved the plane to the fuel pump. To move the plane to th= e gas=20 pump I used my tow bar.  I did not see any oil or hydraulic fluid on= the=20 ground by the nose wheel or on the nose strut at this time.   T= he=20 plane took 26.35 gallons of fuel and then I did my preflight inspection.&= nbsp;=20 There were not any preflight problems.  We taxied to runway 07, did = the=20 engine checks, announced that we were taking active runway 07 and will be= =20 departing to the north.  Upon lift off I raised the gear lever and f= lap=20 switch and immediately noticed no gear lights showing up or down.  I= told=20 my wife there was a problem=E2=80=94no lights and the plane was not accel= erating=E2=80=94I=20 could tell that the gear had not retracted.  I announced to MTH that= we=20 had no lights indicating the position of the landing gear and that I was = going=20 to circle and do a low pass over runway 07=E2=80=94could someone tell me = the position=20 of the gear.  First pass I was told that it was =E2=80=9CUP=E2=80=9D= , however, with the=20 drag on the plane I said that I would make a second pass=E2=80=94this tim= e there was a=20 helicopter watching that said the gear was =E2=80=9Cdown=E2=80=9D  I= tried to recycle the=20 gear without any luck.  I told my wife that we would fly to our home= base=20 F45 along the coast.

 About=20 15 or 20 miles out of MTH we had a warning light telling us that the=20 =E2=80=9Cvolts=E2=80=9D  was in the yellow range=E2=80=94my hydrauli= c pump light indicator was on=20 so I pulled the 50amp breaker=E2=80=94the =E2=80=9Cvolts=E2=80=9D went fr= om 9 back up to 13-14. =20 It was a slow flight at 143 kts. at 2,000 feet looking out for many plane= s and=20 staying out of Miami and then Ft Lauderdale air space. =20

When=20 we reached Boca I called Palm Beach tower and told them the problem that = I was=20 having and asked if I could do a tower fly by  and if they could tel= l if=20 the gear was locked down.  On the first pass I was too low for the t= ower=20 to be able to tell if the gear was locked in or not so I was asked to com= e=20 around again but higher this time.  I came around at about 250 feet = and=20 the tower said that they thought it may be locked in place but they had n= o way=20 of knowing.  I asked to go to my home base at F45 and they vectored = me on=20 course. 

Here=20 is the problem=E2=80=94to lock in the main gear I did side movers to catc= h the wind on=20 the gear doors that are attached to the gear, this locked them in, howeve= r the=20 nose gear free falls from the up position being pushed by a gas strut=E2= =80=94no way=20 of knowing if it was in position or not.  I announced a right hand d= own=20 wind for runway 08R at F45, announced a right base and then final 08R ful= l=20 stop=E2=80=94somewhere in the discussion or Palm Beach tower announced to= F45 I was=20 having gear problems=E2=80=94on final I told Pat to remove her glasses in= case she=20 might hit the dash, said that on touchdown I was going to pull the fuel a= ll=20 the way out, turn off the ignition and three master switches which I=20 did=E2=80=94landed on the mains and held it off as long as I could and th= en it settled=20 on the props shattering all three blades and the plane came to a stop a 1= ,000=20 feet down the runway.   Pat and I looked at each other, I climb= ed=20 out of the plane and saw people running from the FBO and individuals on g= olf=20 carts coming to our aid, I helped Pat out with bystander help=E2=80=94the= sheriff=20 dept. arrived in two to three minutes and the fire dept arrived in about = 10 to=20 15 minutes.  Neither Pat or I were hurt, in fact it was a very smoot= h=20 landing and stop. 

 A=20 fork truck was brought out and I connected a tow rope to two blades of th= e=20 propeller, the fork lift lifted the nose of the plane and we pulled the n= ose=20 gear into position and strapped it to the two bottom propeller blades pul= ling=20 the gear forward. =20 The=20 FBO sent out their airplane tow and they towed the plane to my hangar. Wh= ile,=20 waiting for the plane to be raised the sheriff did his report, fire depar= tment=20 did their report and I received a call from the FAA stating that it was = =E2=80=9COK=E2=80=9D=20 to move the plane from the runway and I would be contacted this week by t= he=20 FAA.

Upon=20 inspection of the nose gear by an IA, A&P it was found that the nose = gear=20 door hydraulic hose fitting, aluminum, sheared off at the actuator. = This=20 must have happened upon lift off when I moved the gear switch to retract = the=20 landing gear and pumped all the hydraulic fluid overboard and released th= e=20 load on the nose gear.  I tried many maneuvers, but could not get th= e=20 nose gear to lock in.

Once=20 again, I want to state that neither Pat nor I were injured and want to th= ank=20 all the individuals from MTH to F45 for their assistance and=20 help.

Submitted=20 by Paul A. Hershorin   5/29/13

 



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