X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2012 12:54:09 -0400 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from hrndva-omtalb.mail.rr.com ([71.74.56.122] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.0c1) with ESMTP id 5734313 for lml@lancaironline.net; Wed, 29 Aug 2012 10:08:37 -0400 Received-SPF: none receiver=logan.com; client-ip=71.74.56.122; envelope-from=Wolfgang@MiCom.net X-Original-Return-Path: X-Authority-Analysis: v=2.0 cv=cpwZYiEi c=1 sm=0 a=MHZY6FYWMEQOp7S43i2QIw==:17 a=3Zlka_XeuxsA:10 a=xWGEBLQhAQUA:10 a=ttCsPuSJ-FAA:10 a=1n64LrPEzAYA:10 a=rTjvlri0AAAA:8 a=Ia-xEzejAAAA:8 a=3oc9M9_CAAAA:8 a=o1OHuDzbAAAA:8 a=NmebdO3LAAAA:8 a=-swuVHMQAAAA:8 a=biznXsr5AAAA:8 a=o-Tp4Car6bFMNVleAusA:9 a=pILNOxqGKmIA:10 a=cTbNMP9iwpYA:10 a=EzXvWhQp4_cA:10 a=U8Ie8EnqySEA:10 a=ILCZio5HsAgA:10 a=9ZcDoFssUGMght9f:21 a=Ch7W_6NFty2fDEGh:21 a=tYZPWW6eAAAA:8 a=pOeutyXe6lvib7KqTyAA:9 a=_W_S_7VecoQA:10 a=b1KJu6T2Jp8A:10 a=amP8cGQ10gkA:10 a=MHZY6FYWMEQOp7S43i2QIw==:117 X-Cloudmark-Score: 0 X-Originating-IP: 74.218.201.50 Received: from [74.218.201.50] ([74.218.201.50:1204] helo=lobo) by hrndva-oedge04.mail.rr.com (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.46 r()) with ESMTP id E9/8B-22347-1422E305; Wed, 29 Aug 2012 14:08:02 +0000 X-Original-Message-ID: <009401cd85ef$b0331c70$6701a8c0@lobo> From: "Wolfgang" X-Original-To: References: Subject: Re: [LML] Performance Engine TSIO 550 X-Original-Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2012 10:07:56 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0091_01CD85CE.28F42AE0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0091_01CD85CE.28F42AE0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Why has the FAA not shut these guys (Performance Aero Engines Inc.) down = ? ? Wolfgang ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Ronald STEVENS=20 To: lml@lancaironline.net=20 Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2012 5:52 AM Subject: Re: [LML] Performance Engine TSIO 550 In my opinion, SOON, should be NOW, no kidding I had an Performance = Engine on my Velocity and the bolts came of from the cylinders as they = were torqued wrong. I had 2 bolts coming off the engine and going = through the propeller. Thank god they actually damaged the prop so we had to start looking = for the why....well it was ugly. This engine had only 200 hours on it. Oh and I did managed to talk to them 1 time, and they came with some = BS story that the bolt might broke off because of some gas trapped = inside the metal......sure.....and they believe in Santa too lol We had a rocker failure before (at 100 hours) and for me this engine = was a nightmare. Definitely do the overhaul, get the engine back to = specs, and forget about the 400HP they claim....is BS anyway, as you = will never use this, not even on takeoff as you really do not need 400hp = to take off in a IV-p So do yourself and your family a favor...... Just my opinion, Ronald On Aug 28, 2012, at 4:30 PM, John Barrett wrote: OK, Thanks to the many who responded on List and off to my question. = Still haven=92t come to a decision what to ultimately do, but it=92s = almost 100% assured there is an engine tear down in my future =96 and = SOON. Lots of constructive input that I appreciate immensely. It=92s confirmed what we all have known for few years. Almost all = (good) roads lead to Barrett Performance Engines. John Barrett From: Lancair Mailing List [mailto:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf = Of N66mg@aol.com Sent: Monday, August 27, 2012 5:03 AM To: lml@lancaironline.net Subject: [LML] Re: Performance Engine TSIO 550 To all that need a good engine rebuilder, I had my Glasair engine = rebuilt by LyCom in Vasilia, CA...When it was rebuilt and installed, = thats when I was glad they did the rebuild...Ran so smooth and with = increased power, same amount of gallons per hour and increase in = speed...From 183kts to 191 kts...I was very happy, they delivered what = they promised...That's my 2 cents Michael Giardino n7sz L-IV 98%=20 In a message dated 8/26/2012 7:54:24 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, = n5zq@verizon.net writes: John, I have a Performance Engine. With zero time on it, I sent it to = Barrett Precision Engines http://www.bpaengines.com/site.html in Tulsa = for complete teardown and overhaul due to the problems that many others = have had with Performance. Even if no metal was showing up, you=92ll = never have any confidence in your engine. I believe that everyone on the = list who has dealt with Barrett will give them a strong recommendation. = Bite the bullet and send it to Barrett (maybe you=92ll get a family = discount? :-)=20 Bill Harrelson N5ZQ 320 2,050 hrs. N6ZQ IV under construction http://www.mykitlog.com/harrelson/ From: John Barrett Sent: Saturday, August 25, 2012 8:56 AM To: lml@lancaironline.net Subject: [LML] Performance Engine TSIO 550 Hello all, I have a quandary with this engine and am hoping to get some help = in solving it. I have about 60 hours on the engine now and it runs quite well. = Due to the worries related to Fred Moreno=92s problem with his engine = and various others I was highly concerned about the safety of operating = my L-IVP with this power plant. To that end I=92ve been monitoring it = closely and have been doing frequent oil changes to look for developing = problems.=20 All parameters have been good except there was silicone early on = in the oil (first change was at 5 hours then at about 15, then at 35 = hours and another later on.) and a slight elevation in aluminum. Second = oil change still have the silicon and aluminum was much higher. Also = there was a bit of metal flakes in the filter element =96 non magnetic. = Last oil change was even higher aluminum and silicon still elevated. = The oil filter element looked like it had glitter applied to it. = Blackstone has been doing the oil analysis. I sent the last filter = element to Howard Fenton (2nd oilpinion in Oklahoma) and he expressed = concern and advised to quit flying until the problem is figured out.=20 He says the only metal found is aluminum and he=92s never seen or = heard of that. Always in his experience there would be some other metal = showing up in excess as well because there isn=92t a place in the engine = he=92s aware of the aluminum rubs against aluminum. I discovered after the second oil change that the alternate air = door was not closing completely and that probably explains the silicon. I did compression check a couple of days ago and got normal = readings =96 80/75 to 77. I don=92t have a plan about how to trouble shoot the origin of = this metal. I notice that cylinder #5 runs hottest egt=92s during = warmup but other than that I can=92t think of anything out of the = ordinary. Does anyone have a suggestion about how to sleuth out this = problem? Regards, John Barrett, CEO Leading Edge Composites PO Box 428 Port Hadlock, WA 98339 www.carbinge.com ------=_NextPart_000_0091_01CD85CE.28F42AE0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Why has the FAA not shut these guys = (Performance=20 Aero Engines Inc.) down ? ?
 
Wolfgang
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Ronald = STEVENS
Sent: Wednesday, August 29, = 2012 5:52=20 AM
Subject: Re: [LML] Performance = Engine=20 TSIO 550

In my opinion, SOON, should be NOW, no kidding I had an = Performance Engine on my Velocity and the bolts came of from the = cylinders as=20 they were torqued wrong. I had 2 bolts coming off the engine and going = through=20 the propeller.

Thank god they actually damaged the prop so we had to start = looking for=20 the why....well it was ugly. This engine had only 200 hours on = it.
Oh and I did managed to talk to them 1 time, and they came with = some BS=20 story that the bolt might broke off because of some gas trapped inside = the=20 metal......sure.....and they believe in Santa too lol

We had a rocker failure before (at 100 hours) and for me this = engine was=20 a nightmare. Definitely do the overhaul, get the engine back to specs, = and=20 forget about the 400HP they claim....is BS anyway, as you will never = use this,=20 not even on takeoff as you really do not need 400hp to take off in a=20 IV-p

So do yourself and your family a favor......

Just my opinion, Ronald


On Aug 28, 2012, at 4:30 PM, John Barrett wrote:
OK,
Thanks=20 to the many who responded on List and off to my question.  = Still=20 haven=92t come to a decision what to ultimately do, but it=92s = almost 100%=20 assured there is an engine tear down in my future =96 and=20 SOON.
Lots=20 of constructive input that I appreciate = immensely. It=92s=20 confirmed what we all have known for few years.  Almost all = (good)=20 roads lead to Barrett Performance Engines. John=20 Barrett
From: Lancair Mailing List=20 [mailto:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of N66mg@aol.com
Sent: Monday, August 27, 2012 = 5:03=20 AM
To: lml@lancaironline.net
Sub= ject: [LML] Re: Performance = Engine TSIO=20 550
To=20 all that need a good engine rebuilder,  I had my Glasair engine = rebuilt=20 by LyCom in Vasilia, CA...When it was rebuilt and installed, = thats when=20 I was glad they did the rebuild...Ran so smooth and with increased = power,=20 same amount of gallons per hour and increase in speed...From = 183kts to=20 191 kts...I was very happy, they delivered what they = promised...That's=20 my 2 cents
Michael Giardino
n7sz =20 L-IV  98% 
In a=20 message dated 8/26/2012 7:54:24 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, n5zq@verizon.net writes:
John,
I = have a=20 Performance Engine. With zero time on it, I sent it to Barrett = Precision=20 Engines http://www.bpaengines.com/si= te.html in Tulsa for complete = teardown=20 and overhaul due to the problems that many others have had with=20 Performance. Even if no metal was showing up, you=92ll never have = any=20 confidence in your engine. I believe that everyone on the list who = has=20 dealt with Barrett will give them a strong recommendation. Bite = the bullet=20 and send it to Barrett (maybe you=92ll get a family discount?=20 :-) 
Bill=20 Harrelson
N5ZQ 320=20 2,050 hrs.
N6ZQ =20 IV under construction
From: John=20 Barrett
Sent: Saturday, August 25, = 2012 8:56=20 AM
To: lml@lancaironline.net
Subject: [LML] Performance = Engine TSIO=20 550
Hello all,
I have a quandary with this engine and am = hoping to=20 get some help in solving it. I have about 60 hours on the engine now and = it runs=20 quite well.  Due to the worries related to Fred Moreno=92s = problem with=20 his engine and various others I was highly concerned about the = safety of=20 operating my L-IVP with this power plant.  To that end I=92ve = been=20 monitoring it closely and have been doing frequent oil changes to = look for=20 developing problems.  All parameters have been good except there = was=20 silicone early on in the oil (first change was at 5 hours then at = about=20 15, then at 35 hours and another later on.) and a slight elevation = in=20 aluminum.  Second oil change still have the silicon and = aluminum was=20 much higher.  Also there was a bit of metal flakes in the = filter=20 element =96 non magnetic.  Last oil change was even higher = aluminum and=20 silicon still elevated.  The oil filter element looked like = it had=20 glitter applied to it.  Blackstone has been doing the oil=20 analysis.  I sent the last filter element to Howard Fenton=20 (2nd oilpinion in=20 Oklahoma) and he expressed concern and advised to quit flying = until the=20 problem is figured out.  He says the only metal found is aluminum = and he=92s=20 never seen or heard of that.  Always in his experience there = would be=20 some other metal showing up in excess as well because there = isn=92t a place=20 in the engine he=92s aware of the aluminum rubs against=20 aluminum. I discovered after the second oil change = that the=20 alternate air door was not closing completely and that probably = explains=20 the silicon. I did compression check a couple of days = ago and got=20 normal readings =96 80/75 to 77. I don=92t have a plan about how to trouble = shoot the=20 origin of this metal.  I notice that cylinder #5 runs hottest = egt=92s=20 during warmup but other than that I can=92t think of anything out = of the=20 ordinary. Does anyone have a suggestion about how = to =20 sleuth out this problem? Regards, John Barrett, CEO Leading Edge = Composites PO Box 428 Port Hadlock, WA = 98339 www.carbinge.com  

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