X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml@lancaironline.net Date: Wed, 01 Jun 2011 07:42:37 -0400 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com ([75.180.132.123] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.4c3j) with ESMTP id 4999333 for lml@lancaironline.net; Tue, 31 May 2011 13:54:35 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=75.180.132.123; envelope-from=super_chipmunk@roadrunner.com X-Original-Return-Path: X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.1 cv=pLPlkKcK38cN4Cv4YkVeTGGRYpmKez/IrX640LVKWnc= c=1 sm=0 a=KjSDNloYwg0A:10 a=zTVDa7HKqxcA:10 a=35Tvjzvas7lBNn8+H1IYgA==:17 a=Ia-xEzejAAAA:8 a=izWEkazA_O33ORMiQB8A:9 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=EzXvWhQp4_cA:10 a=JKiFR-z1_WoPLiUv:21 a=8C2EzE27gW90do0L:21 a=1IlZJK9HAAAA:8 a=ZZXCWR1VsAV0Fc2WDikA:9 a=PRdGaDOyF0I_yNYWzrgA:7 a=Z1BvOZmT1TIA:10 a=ywWIp8bsalPQqVMx:21 a=PvY2q8wVjOO9ZsaN:21 a=35Tvjzvas7lBNn8+H1IYgA==:117 X-Cloudmark-Score: 0 X-Originating-IP: 69.205.15.200 Received: from [69.205.15.200] ([69.205.15.200:52103] helo=WilliamHP) by cdptpa-oedge04.mail.rr.com (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 2.2.3.46 r()) with ESMTP id AB/46-20202-83B25ED4; Tue, 31 May 2011 17:54:01 +0000 X-Original-Message-ID: From: "Bill Wade" X-Original-To: "Lancair Mailing List" References: In-Reply-To: Subject: Re: [LML] Optimum IO-550 oil level - zero oil pressure event X-Original-Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 13:53:56 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0265_01CC1F9A.2F83C050" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Importance: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Windows Live Mail 15.4.3508.1109 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V15.4.3508.1109 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0265_01CC1F9A.2F83C050 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I had a situation enroute where the oil pressure indication = (Electronics International gauge) on my IO-550B started drifting = downwards after two hours. By the time I made a hurried landing it was = reading about 15 when it normally reads 55. The local shop put a = mechanical gauge on and confirmed oil pressure was okay. Taxi and = climbout showed customary pressure but once in cruise the pressure = drifted downward again. The engine ran fine so I continued to my = destination. I replaced all the connectors and changed the oil to single = weight but on the return trip it again started out fine then showed low = after a while. EI checked the sender and couldn=E2=80=99t find anything = wrong. A replacement had the same issue. I finally cut out the spade connectors in the engine compartment and = soldered the leads together. Problem solved. I use 9 quarts, sometimes 10 in hot weather- the engine is about 2090 = SNEW, of which I=E2=80=99ve contributed 350. The belly stays pretty = clean and there are no leaks in the compartment- I usually add 2 quarts = between 25-hour oil changes. The engine is FWF off a Bonanza and it has = their breather tube that rises a few inches above the connection before = turning downward so hopefully oil will condense and drain back instead = of going overboard. How about mounting a mechanical gauge temporarily for comparison? The = data readout would show the senders=E2=80=99 output but that could be = faulty, as I found. -Bill Wade From: Frederick Moreno=20 Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2011 8:16 AM To: lml@lancaironline.net=20 Subject: [LML] Optimum IO-550 oil level - zero oil pressure event We have been over this issue in the past, and I have reviewed the = archives, but with a lot of new Legacies flying, it is time to ask the = question: what is the optimum oil level for the IO-550? The reason I ask is that I had an incident during final when my = MVP 50 engine monitor lit up the red Master Warning light on a two mile = final and I got voice alerts from the Chelton and the engine monitor: = "Check Engine" and "Check oil pressure." A check of the oil pressure on = the engine monitor showed a big red zero. This went on for a few = seconds, then the alarm went off, then it went on and off several times. = Taxiing back on the runway I twice hit the brakes, first while = moving fairly slowly and second while moving faster, but holding engine = RPM constant (about 900 RM according to the data). Both times the oil = pressure sagged momentarily (but not low enough to trigger an alarm). I downloaded the engine monitor data and sure enough the oil = pressure dropped to zero for several seconds, then went up and down to = zero several times, total elapsed time of 37 seconds. I downloaded and = studied the data for the entire flight and found an oil pressure sag = while taxiing out for take off when I braked before the U turn at the = end of the runway, but not low enough for an alarm. I also found an oil = pressure sag (not low enough to trip the alarm) during deceleration = during landing roll out.=20 I had another engineer in the right seat who watched all of this. = We examined the data traces. None of it looked like an electrical = intermittent on the oil pressure sensor which is mounted on the fire = wall. Our conclusion: we had sucked air.=20 We check oil pressure at every stop. During a multi-stop long = cross country in March, we landed with as little as 5 quarts after some = long legs. The engine has about 30 hours on it since overhaul, and is = still breaking in, but we have never seen an oil alarm even with some = severe test flying (steep departures and descents as well as hard = braking during short field practice). Sump capacity is 8 quarts although the dip stick goes up to 12. = We normally run at 6 quarts since prior experience is that more than 6 = quarts blows oil out the breather an on to the belly. After shutdown we = measured approximately 5 quarts on the dip stick. A day later it still = read 5 quarts. (For reference, I found that Lycoming says the absolute = minimum is 2 quarts, but Cirrus recommends a minimum of 6 on the = IO-550N, same engine. Presumably there is allowance for oil loss during = flight with the Cirrus numbers.) I put a piece of welding rod down the = dipstick hole, and found the oil to be just shy of 2 inches deep in the = pan. The dipstick comes to within about 0.4 inches of the bottom of the = pan. We measured the oil pan and then calculated the oil volume based = on the area and depth of oil, and came up with about 5.5 quarts. We had = also checked the dipstick at the last oil change, and while not perfect, = it checked reasonably well with the oil as we added it quart by quart.=20 Since the oil pressure alarm was on and off for 37 seconds, we = pulled the engine for a full inspection. Current guess work suggests = something wrong in the oil pump pick up area. The engine is under = warranty, so I am driving it up to the shop and we will disassemble it = while we are all present and watching.=20 So, again, what are you IO-550 guys using for normal oil level, = and when do you add oil? What oil stories can others tell? Curious Fred =20 =20 =20 ------=_NextPart_000_0265_01CC1F9A.2F83C050 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
  I had a situation enroute where the oil pressure indication=20 (Electronics International gauge) on my IO-550B started drifting = downwards after=20 two hours. By the time I made a hurried landing it was reading about 15 = when it=20 normally reads 55. The local shop put a mechanical gauge on and = confirmed oil=20 pressure was okay. Taxi and climbout showed customary pressure but once = in=20 cruise the pressure drifted downward again. The engine ran fine so I = continued=20 to my destination. I replaced all the connectors and changed the oil to = single=20 weight but on the return trip it again started out fine then showed low = after a=20 while. EI checked the sender and couldn=E2=80=99t find anything wrong. A = replacement had=20 the same issue.
 
  I finally cut out the spade connectors in the engine = compartment and=20 soldered the leads together. Problem solved.
 
  I use 9 quarts, sometimes 10 in hot weather- the engine is = about=20 2090 SNEW, of which I=E2=80=99ve contributed 350. The belly stays pretty = clean and there=20 are no leaks in the compartment- I usually add 2 quarts between 25-hour = oil=20 changes. The engine is FWF off a Bonanza and it has their breather tube = that=20 rises a few inches above the connection before turning downward so = hopefully oil=20 will condense and drain back instead of going overboard.
 
  How about mounting a mechanical gauge temporarily for = comparison?=20 The data readout would show the senders=E2=80=99 output but that could = be faulty, as I=20 found.  -Bill Wade
 
Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2011 8:16 AM
Subject: [LML] Optimum IO-550 oil level - zero oil pressure=20 event
 
We have been over this issue in the past, and I have reviewed = the=20 archives, but with a lot of new Legacies flying, it is time to ask = the=20 question: what is the optimum oil level for the IO-550?
 
The reason I ask is that I had an incident during final when = my MVP=20 50 engine monitor lit up the red Master Warning light on a two = mile final=20 and I got voice alerts from the Chelton and the engine monitor: = "Check=20 Engine" and "Check oil pressure."  A check of the oil = pressure on the=20 engine monitor showed a big red zero.  This went on for a few = seconds, then the alarm went off, then it went on and off several = times.=20
 
Taxiing back on the runway I twice hit the brakes, first = while moving=20 fairly slowly and second while moving faster, but holding engine = RPM=20 constant (about 900 RM according to the data).  Both times = the oil=20 pressure sagged momentarily (but not low enough to trigger an=20 alarm).
 
I downloaded the engine monitor data and sure enough the oil = pressure=20 dropped to zero for several seconds, then went up and down to zero = several=20 times, total elapsed time of 37 seconds.  I downloaded and = studied=20 the data for the entire flight and found an oil pressure sag while = taxiing=20 out for take off when I braked before the U turn at the end of the = runway,=20 but not low enough for an alarm.  I also found an oil = pressure sag=20 (not low enough to trip the alarm) during deceleration during = landing roll=20 out.
 
I had another engineer in the right seat who watched all of=20 this.  We examined the  data traces.  None of it = looked=20 like an electrical intermittent on the oil pressure sensor which = is=20 mounted on the fire wall.  Our conclusion: we had sucked air. =
 
We check oil pressure at every stop.  During a = multi-stop long=20 cross country in March, we landed with as little as 5 quarts after = some=20 long legs.  The engine has about 30 hours on it since = overhaul, and=20 is still breaking in, but we have never seen an oil alarm even = with some=20 severe test flying (steep departures and descents as well as hard = braking=20 during short field practice).
 
Sump capacity is 8 quarts although the dip stick goes up to = 12. =20 We normally run at 6 quarts since prior experience is that more = than 6=20 quarts blows oil out the breather an on to the belly.  After = shutdown=20 we measured approximately 5 quarts on the dip stick.  A day = later it=20 still read 5 quarts.  (For reference, I found that Lycoming = says=20 the  absolute minimum is 2 quarts, but  Cirrus  = recommends=20 a minimum of 6 on the IO-550N, same engine.  Presumably there = is=20 allowance for oil loss during flight with the Cirrus = numbers.)  I put=20 a piece of welding rod down the dipstick hole, and found the oil = to be=20 just shy of 2 inches deep in the pan.  The dipstick comes to = within=20 about 0.4 inches of the bottom of the pan.  We measured the = oil pan=20 and then calculated the oil volume based on the area and depth of = oil, and=20 came up with about 5.5 quarts.  We had also checked the = dipstick at=20 the last oil change, and while not perfect, it checked reasonably = well=20 with the oil as we added it quart by quart.
 
Since the oil pressure alarm was on and off for 37 seconds, = we =20 pulled the engine for a full inspection. Current guess work = suggests=20 something wrong in the oil pump pick up area.   The = engine is=20 under warranty, so I am driving it up to the shop and we will = disassemble=20 it while we are all present and watching.
 
So, again, what are you IO-550 guys using for normal oil = level, and=20 when do you add oil?  What oil stories can others tell?
 
Curious Fred
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