X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com Return-Path: Sender: To: lml Date: Wed, 02 Dec 2009 09:37:25 -0500 Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: Received: from blu0-omc3-s32.blu0.hotmail.com ([65.55.116.107] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.3c3) with ESMTP id 3998596 for lml@lancaironline.net; Tue, 01 Dec 2009 22:30:38 -0500 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=65.55.116.107; envelope-from=randystuart@hotmail.com Received: from BLU0-SMTP48 ([65.55.116.73]) by blu0-omc3-s32.blu0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Tue, 1 Dec 2009 19:30:02 -0800 X-Originating-IP: [99.163.183.207] X-Originating-Email: [randystuart@hotmail.com] X-Original-Message-ID: X-Original-Return-Path: randystuart@hotmail.com Received: from laptop ([99.163.183.207]) by BLU0-SMTP48.blu0.hotmail.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Tue, 1 Dec 2009 19:30:00 -0800 From: "Randy" X-Original-To: "Lancair Mailing List" References: Subject: Re: [LML] Re: Vne is NOT a meaningless number X-Original-Date: Tue, 1 Dec 2009 19:30:02 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0088_01CA72BC.AD871650" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5843 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Dec 2009 03:30:01.0252 (UTC) FILETIME=[BAF7F640:01CA72FF] This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0088_01CA72BC.AD871650 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Well, I will say some planes are built better then others and some = pilots have less ability then others. That being said, a poorly built = Lancair would have less structural integrity then an expertly built = Lancair. This would include materials used, quality of build and finish, = W & B.. just to name a few. Then there's pilot ability. I believe Clint = said it best when he said " A man's got to know his limitations"..... It = is quite obvious that a quality built Lancair will most always exceed = it's pilots abilities.=20 If Lance was afraid to exceed the status quo of his time there would be = no Lancair's. If the Rutan brothers were afraid to exceed Vne they would = never have touched the stars. Every plane at Reno exceeds Vne.. But, = then again, there are Cessna drivers as well.=20 Again, I ask what the stats are for Lancair's coming apart from = exceeding Vne in clear smooth air??? I can't recall a one. Anyone??? Lance designed and manufactured a very strong very advanced kit, if = built right, as intended, it will far exceed your expectations. And the = only flutter you'll get is when your heart flutters from the performance = Lance designed for pilots that are willing to enjoy it.=20 Randy Stuart LNC-2 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Skip Slater=20 To: lml=20 Sent: Tuesday, December 01, 2009 5:51 PM Subject: [LML] Re: Vne is NOT a meaningless number Randy, Count me in Robert's corner on this - exceed VNE at your own peril, = but please don't do it with unwitting passengers onboard. I've seen too many films in the military of what happens to airplanes = when flutter begins at excessive airspeed. It's not something you feel = coming on like stall buffet and recover from. It can tear an airframe = apart in the blink of an eye. Sure, differently built planes will = experience flutter onset at differing airspeeds, but why would any sane = person intentionally exceed a limitation set by the plane's (or kit's) = manufacturer? In the absence of a detailed set of data, including = testing an airframe to failure in a wind tunnel, that limitation is all = you have. Sure, it likely has a buffer built into it, but intentional = ignorance of the redline on the ASI in any airplane that wasn't = specifically designed and modified to do it, experimental or not, is a = bad idea. Skip Slater N540ES ------=_NextPart_000_0088_01CA72BC.AD871650 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =EF=BB=BF
Well, I will say = some planes=20 are built better then others and some pilots have less ability then = others. That=20 being said, a poorly built Lancair would have less structural integrity = then an=20 expertly built Lancair. This would include materials used, quality of = build and=20 finish, W & B.. just to name a few. Then there's pilot ability. I = believe=20 Clint said it best when he said " A man's got to know his = limitations".....=20 It = is quite=20 obvious that a quality built Lancair will most always exceed it's = pilots=20 abilities.
If Lance was = afraid to exceed=20 the status quo of his time there would be no Lancair's. If the Rutan = brothers=20 were afraid to exceed Vne they would never have touched the stars.  = Every=20 plane at Reno exceeds Vne.. But, then again, there are Cessna drivers as = well.=20
Again, I ask what = the stats=20 are for Lancair's coming apart from exceeding Vne in clear smooth air??? = I can't=20 recall a one. Anyone???
Lance designed and = manufactured a very strong very advanced kit, if built right, as = intended, it=20 will far exceed your expectations. And the only flutter you'll get is = when your=20 heart flutters from the performance Lance designed for pilots that are = willing=20 to enjoy it.
 
Randy=20 Stuart
LNC-2
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Skip=20 Slater
To: lml
Sent: Tuesday, December 01, = 2009 5:51=20 PM
Subject: [LML] Re: Vne is NOT a = meaningless number

Randy,
 
Count me in Robert's corner on this - = exceed VNE=20 at your own peril, but please don't do it with unwitting passengers=20 onboard.
 
I've seen too many films in the = military of what=20 happens to airplanes when flutter begins at excessive = airspeed. It's=20 not something you feel coming on like stall buffet and = recover=20 from.  It can tear an airframe apart in the blink of an = eye.  Sure,=20 differently built planes will experience flutter onset at = differing=20 airspeeds, but why would any sane person intentionally exceed a = limitation set=20 by the plane's (or kit's) manufacturer?  In the absence of a = detailed set=20 of data, including testing an airframe to failure in a wind tunnel, = that=20 limitation is all you have.  Sure, it likely has a buffer built = into it,=20 but intentional ignorance of the redline on the ASI in = any=20 airplane that wasn't specifically designed and modified to do it, = experimental or not, is a bad idea.
 
Skip Slater
N540ES
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