Mailing List lml@lancaironline.net Message #52811
From: F. Barry Knotts <bknotts@buckeye-express.com>
Sender: <marv@lancaironline.net>
Subject: Re: [LML] Re: Fuel Flow Issue Solved
Date: Sat, 29 Aug 2009 13:21:57 -0400
To: <lml@lancaironline.net>
Mea culpa! 

I'm probably the most recent source of the low fuel flow figures that Bob quoted.  I went back today to try and check those figures.  They are from a superseded Continental maintenance manual.  (I seem to have collected more than my share.) 

I have attached both the page from the superseded manual and the current (1 December 2006) TSIO-550E, M-18 manual.  The current recommendation from Continental for fuel flow and unmetered fuel pressure is just as Charlie says.

Sorry, Bob, for my inaccurate information.

Barry Knotts
L-IV P, TSIO-550E running too lean!


Charlie Kohler wrote:

Hey Bob

 

Bob, you are getting your figures mixed up. You are quoting figures that match up to the TSIO 550 C. engine.

This is a 310 hp operating at 2600 rpm and 35.5 inches manifold pressure to achieve that 310 hp. Hence the 36.11/ 38.16 gph.

 

 

Continental still recommends the fuel flow for the TSIO 550 B. or E. to 41.73 gph/ 43.44 gph

 

And unmetered  fuel pressure at 2700 rpm and 38.5 mp (full power) 32-36 psi and 41.73 GPH / 43.44 GPH.

 
 
These figures are from Continentals latest Maintenance manual (M-18).
 

It is listed on page 6-3 in figure (6-2) Engine Operating Limits dated 1 December 2006.


 
Charlie K.
 
See me on the web at
 



From: Robert Pastusek <rpastusek@htii.com>
To: lml@lancaironline.net
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 11:41:55 AM
Subject: [LML] Re: Fuel Flow Issue Solved

Scott,
A very nice summary of your troubleshooting. Glad you were able to find and fix the problem!

 

As to your last question, I have set up my system (IV-P with TSIO-550E) to flow 43 GPH on takeoff at 2700 RPM and 38.5” MP--using the engine-driven fuel pump only. My rationale was/is that if the engine is set up to flow 43 GPH with both pumps running, it will run very lean--and may stall--if either pump fails. By depending upon the engine-driven pump only for normal operation, I can quickly turn on the boost pump should I need it. I have not experienced a failure, nor tested this on takeoff, but have simulated this at altitude during flight test and am comfortable it will work in an emergency.

 

A couple of notes/comments: Several experienced Lancair builder/flyers do not agree with this concept, and you should also consider their views in deciding what is right for you. Secondly, the 43 GPH fuel flow I’m using was the Continental recommendation for several years, but they have reduced the fuel flow spec to 38-39 GPH in the latest setup instruction. I re-set mine back to 43 GPH after trying the lower flow and experiencing cylinder and TIT over-temps during climb through the teens. The return to 43 GPH solved these issues, BUT there are some considerations. Selecting high boost at full throttle on takeoff will definitely flood/stall the engine with my current set up. It stalls at anything above about 47 GPH at full throttle, and both pumps working at full throttle  generates at least 50 GPH in my airplane. I plan to use the mixture control as part of my power  management in an emergency situation. Also, I have twice had the engine roll back (my wife is pretty sure this is a technical term for quitting L) during climb out after takeoff when the plane was heat-soaked (100+ degrees on the ramp). This occurred passing 12-13,000’ when I failed to turn the electric pump to low boost at 10,000’ as recommended in the Lancair flight manual for my airplane. I am more careful to get the low boost on earlier on hot days, and actually turned it on before TO from Las Vegas earlier this week when the surface temp was 113 degrees. I watched the fuel flow carefully but no problems at all in the climb to 16,500 for a VFR flight to Inyokern, CA with the electric pump on low boost for the duration of flight.

 

Hope this helps…


Bob

 

 

 

From: Lancair Mailing List [mailto:lml@lancaironline.net] On Behalf Of Scott Keighan
Sent: Monday, August 24, 2009 10:25 PM
To: lml@lancaironline.net
Subject: [LML] Fuel Flow Issue Solved

 

Hello Everyone,

 

I just thought I would update everyone on my Fuel Flow issue.

 About a month back I asked for advise about a sudden lack of fuel flow.

Where I used to get 20-21gph on Take off I has suddenly getting 12-14gph.

All run ups were normal but when applying full power for takeoff I would not

get enough flow.  When initiating the Electric fuel pump everything turned to

normal.

 

Well this problem turned into quit the hunt to find the issue.

To make a long story short I had disassembled and reassembled the majority of

the fuel system from the:

Engine driven fuel pump

Throttle control unit

Manifold spider valve

Injectors and lines

gascolator

fuel flow meter

all fuel lines

tank vents

Electric fuel pump

 

What did it come down to??

 

A broken O-ring on the inlet side of the Electric Fuel pump fitting.

Air was being sucked into the system.  I finally discovered it by putting a vaccum

on the fuel lines from the engine to the tanks.  When a vaccum could not be held

I traced it to the O-ring.

 

Four weeks of down time and about 80hrs of work to find the .50 cent problem.

Of course I had to reset all my flows of which I now get 24gph and 22psi on Takeoff.

 

Now I am still not using my Electric Boost for Take Off.  Should I or should I not???

What is the concensis of people in the know.

 

Thanks to everyone whom gave me some input.

 

Scott Keighan

L-IV   IO-550G  

 


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