Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 11:19:39 -0500
From: Tracy Wilkins <tracyw@vt.edu>
Subject: LNC2 - landing speed incident
To: lancair.list@olsusa.com
Message-id: <4.1.19991102091413.00b9a5f0@mail.vt.edu>
Mime-Version: 1.0

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	Lorn Olson said an instructor told him to land his 320 (small tail) over
the fence at 80 mph.  I would worry about that unless his airspeed
indicator gives a lot different reading than our large tail 360.

I was in the right seat (no rudder pedals) when another pilot took a 360 in
to land on a totally calm day with exciting results.  He had a very stable
approach at about 100 mph steady, flaps deployed, good final approach angle
= looked perfect.  Airspeed was about 90 over the fence.  Then he got
worried about the lights at the end of the runway - which were in fact no
problem at all - and pulled back on the stick "to clear the lights".
Airspeed dropped immediately and we dropped straight down on the runway
from about 20+ feet.  He got in the power only after we started the bounce.
 The nose was very high, full flaps were out and with full power we stalled
and fell off to the right with the P-factor.  With extreme rudder he
managed to catch it just before the wing tip hit the dirt off the runway,
and we then tried to go up at too steep an angle before we stalled and
rolled off to the left side of the runway, hit the tail and then the left
wing tip  without hitting the wheels as far as I could tell.  He caught it
again and stalled again and rolled to the right and almost hit that
wingtip, he had almost zero control, - he finally regained a measure of
control and we weaved down the runway.  We should have landed straight
ahead but by then we were too high (altitude and adrenaline) and I took
over to calm his nerves.  Our home airport was ten miles straight ahead so
I stayed slow and he did a straight in landing with no trouble. (I didn't
want to risk a turn to land and it was flying OK).  
	The wing tip had pushed into the aileron, but the aileron had broken off a
small piece that allowed it to move - otherwise I might not be writing this
account.  There was extensive damage to the wing tip (top was sprung loose,
scrape hole in the bottom etc.), a drag hole in the tail and the rudder had
a superficial crack where the cables attach - the rudder had been deployed
in such an extreme fashion that there was composite broken off where the
cables come through)  
	He has been in extensive conversations with Lancair about what to check
(even with this abuse the gear was fine without the AD fix) and he is doing
a good once over of the entire plane.  So far no other problems.

	My 360 stalls at just under 80 mph on the indicator so I try to come over
the fence at 100 mph and not under 95.  If it starts to drop I try hard to
give it gas immediately.  Our problem in this incident was that he pulled
up slightly, didn't give it gas when it started to drop, had too high a
nose attitude after the high bounce with full flaps, then didn't lower the
nose, and even with that 360 whailing he didn't have enough power to go up
at a 70 - degree angle!  This happened so fast there wasn't time to think -
it is easy to armchair quarterback the incident.  We all know what to do -
it is doing it instinctively that is the problem - and trying to keep from
getting into that position in the first place.
	The moral for me is that when I have plenty of runway I don't conserve on
the airspeed on final - I practice slow speed landings for those 2500 foot
runways, but on a regular basis coming in close to stall speed can bite you
unless you are a very experienced pilot and react instinctively with power
addition, attitude adjustment and rudder at the right time.  Even then a
sudden drop in wind speed - like dropping below the level of the trees on
the approach into First Flight on the Outer Banks of NC -can  increase your
heart rate.


Marv - 	One more little airadventure if you think your readers would be
interested...  We took off from Blacksburg Va going to Gaithersburg
Maryland VFR under a 4000 or so foot ceiling (clear at Gaithersburg).
Roanoke's Class C is 20 miles ahead so we called in and told them our
cruise altitude (3500 just over the mountains)) our intentions etc and got
a code for the transponder.  We cruised on until we were in sight of the
Roanoke airport when I noticed a helicopter coming right at us about 500
feet below - no call from the controller but I mentioned to my partner who
was driving that the controller should have said something...  When we were
off the approach end of the main ILS runway I noticed a Lear on final - we
would intersect that approach over the threshold - where the heck was the
controller.  He was talking to the Lear but not us.  We called him and
asked what goes...  All hell broke loose.  He had forgotten us, their
primary radar was out, our transponder was evidently not working (although
5 minutes later it was), and they had no idea we were in their airspace!  I
think we had a new controller (trainee?) - he started sputtering that we
had no right to enter the airspace without prior approval etc then the
supervisor's calm voice came on wanting to know exactly where we were -
thank god for the Garmin 195!  He then directed us by vectors and then our
transponder started working and we were on our way to Gaithersburg with his
blessing.  The supervisor was very nice to us and thanked us for working
with him so fast.
	My reading is that yes we should have wondered when we did not receive
that  "radar contact" transmission, but we were legal since he had given us
a transponder code and knew our direction, altitude etc.  Three things went
wrong that could have kiled us and some other inocent people - their
primary radar was down, he forgot us and the transponder did not seem to
work....
Tracy Wilkins
Director of Biotechnology
Va Tech, Blacksburg, Va 24061
540-231-6935  231-7126 FAX
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