Return-Path: Received: from [24.25.9.101] (HELO ms-smtp-02-eri0.southeast.rr.com) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.2b6) with ESMTP id 233989 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Thu, 01 Jul 2004 23:04:21 -0400 Received: from EDWARD (clt25-78-058.carolina.rr.com [24.25.78.58]) by ms-smtp-02-eri0.southeast.rr.com (8.12.10/8.12.7) with SMTP id i6233mNs023711 for ; Thu, 1 Jul 2004 23:03:49 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <001401c45fe1$333fdc40$2402a8c0@EDWARD> From: "Ed Anderson" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] EC2 programming Date: Thu, 1 Jul 2004 23:03:50 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0011_01C45FBF.ABE91CF0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C45FBF.ABE91CF0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable John, Perhaps Tracy will jump in here, but until then here is my shot. I get a different A/F indication just by moving the Mixture control = a 5-10 deg rotation my indicator lights will move up or down. First, how = movement of your manual mixture control affects your indicator depends = on where you have the programmed fuel mixture set. In other words, if = the your programmed value at the operating point is already on the lean = side, then even a small leaning by the manual mixture control can cause = the engine to stumble due to over lean condition. One the other hand, = if your stored program value at that operating point is set toward the = rich side, then you may be able to bring your manual mixture control all = the way to 0900 position and the engine will still be getting plenty of = fuel. =20 So the programmed value and the manual mixture control work in = conjunction. It still appears to me that your programmed value is way = rich. But, I understand you don't want to run too lean with a turbo = under the bonnet and risk detonation. But, still you should be able to = program it to get a nice (no soot) condition while not under boost and = still not risk detonation. I know this is very unlikely, but at one time there was an error in = the EC2 wiring diagram that was in Tracy's published instructions on how = to hook up the wiring. The effect of this error was to render any = program modes past two (I think - it may have been past mode three) = inoperative. I played with some of those modes for months and told = Tracy that if there were any change it was too small to separate from my = imagination. Well, several weeks later, Tracy announced the wiring = error. Soooo, just make certain you have the correct wiring diagram for = the EC2. I don't think even if you were miswire from the old diagram = that it would be having the kind of effect you are seeing - my EC2 ran = just fine with the wiring error, I just couldn't play with some of the = modes. Mode 0 worked fine. See my suggestion below in response to your no change with mode 1 =20 Ed Anderson RV-6A N494BW Rotary Powered Matthews, NC =20 Turn to mode 1. Move mixture to left. Move program knob to left. = Press button. No effect. Press button 4 times. Still no effect on AF = reading or engine. I turned on the cold start switch. No effect on the = engine or the AF reading.=20 John, something is definitely not right here. If you move the program = control mixture control all the way lean (0900) and still get no change = in your A/F indicator there is a problem. Turning the program mixture = control to 0900 and pushing it will most of the time cause the engine to = die from lack of fuel, even with the manual knob set near 12:00 or more. = It appears that your pushing the program store button is not actually = storing your setting in the program. Even if the A/F indicator was all = screwed up and not indicating properly, you should easily notice changes = in the engine operation condition due to the change in fuel it is = getting. =20 Try this(on the ground please). Set your throttle so you are getting = around 3500 rpm . Select mode 1. Put your manual mixture control at = 12:00. Place your program mixture control a 09:00 and push the store = button. Note if there is any change? RPM? EGT? EGO?, Sound? With my = aircraft, you would without doubt notice a change, it will immediately = run lean with the A/F off the bottom of the scale and will likely die. = If nothing changes, try moving the manual mixture control from 12:00 to = 0900 (lean) as well. With both your program value set to max lean and = your manual mixture set to max lean the engine should definitedly stop = running.=20 If none of this has any affect, then I suggest you recheck your = wiring AND your connector pins. Check to make certain that none of = those fine strands of wire have cross over and touched another pin in = the DIN connector. Either with a magnifying glass or at least run = something around each pin to make certain you don't have two connected = that should not be. Ed. ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C45FBF.ABE91CF0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
John,
 
    Perhaps Tracy will = jump in here,=20 but until then here is my shot.
 
    I get a different = A/F indication=20 just by moving the Mixture control a 5-10 deg rotation my indicator = lights will=20 move up or down. First, how movement of your manual mixture control = affects=20 your indicator depends on where you have the programmed fuel mixture = set. =20 In other words, if the your programmed value at the operating point is = already=20 on the lean side, then even a small leaning by the manual mixture = control can=20 cause the engine to stumble due to over lean condition.  One the = other=20 hand, if your stored program value at that operating point is set toward = the=20 rich side, then you may be able to bring your manual mixture control all = the way=20 to 0900 position and the engine will still be getting plenty of = fuel. =20
 
   So the programmed value = and the manual=20 mixture control work in conjunction.  It still appears to me that = your=20 programmed value is way rich.  But, I understand you don't want to = run too=20 lean with a turbo under the bonnet and risk detonation.  But, still = you=20 should be able to program it to get a nice (no soot) condition while not = under=20 boost and still not risk detonation.
 
   I know this is very = unlikely, but at=20 one time there was an error in the EC2 wiring diagram that was = in Tracy's=20 published instructions on how to hook up the wiring.  The effect of = this=20 error was to render any program modes past two (I think - it may have = been past=20 mode three) inoperative.  I played with some of those modes for = months and=20 told Tracy that if there were any change it was too small to separate = from my=20 imagination.  Well, several weeks later, Tracy announced the wiring = error.=20 Soooo, just make certain you have the correct wiring diagram for the = EC2. =20 I don't think even if you were miswire from the old diagram that it = would be=20 having the kind of effect you are seeing - my EC2 ran just fine with the = wiring=20 error, I just couldn't play with some of the modes.  Mode 0 worked=20 fine.
 
See my suggestion below in response to = your no=20 change with mode 1
  
Ed Anderson
RV-6A N494BW Rotary Powered
Matthews, NC
 
 Turn to mode 1. Move mixture to left. Move program knob = to left.=20 Press button. No effect. Press button 4 times. Still no effect on AF = reading=20 or engine. I turned on the cold start switch. No effect on the engine = or the=20 AF reading.
 
John, something is=20 definitely not right here.  If you move the program control = mixture=20 control all the way lean (0900) and still get no change in your A/F = indicator=20 there is a problem.  Turning the program mixture control to 0900 = and=20 pushing it will most of the time cause the engine to die from lack of = fuel,=20 even with the manual knob set near 12:00 or more. It appears that your = pushing=20 the program store button is not actually storing your setting in the = program.=20 Even if the A/F indicator was all screwed up and not indicating = properly, you=20 should easily notice changes in the engine operation condition due to = the=20 change in fuel it is getting. 
 
Try = this(on the=20 ground please).  Set your throttle so you are getting around 3500 = rpm=20 .  Select mode 1.  Put your manual mixture control at = 12:00. =20 Place your program mixture control a 09:00 and push the store = button. =20 Note if there is any change? RPM? EGT? EGO?, Sound? With my aircraft, = you=20 would without doubt notice a change, it will immediately run lean with = the A/F=20 off the bottom of the scale and will likely die. If nothing changes, = try=20 moving the manual mixture control from 12:00 to 0900 (lean) as = well. =20 With both your program value set to max lean and your manual mixture = set to=20 max lean the engine should definitedly stop = running. 
 
 If none of=20 this has any affect, then I suggest you recheck your wiring AND your = connector=20 pins.  Check to make certain that none of those fine strands of = wire have=20 cross over and touched another pin in the DIN connector.  Either = with a=20 magnifying glass or at least run something around each pin to make = certain you=20 don't have two  connected that should not be.
 
 
 Ed.
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