Return-Path: Received: from fed1rmmtao09.cox.net ([68.230.241.30] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.2b3) with ESMTP id 3229939 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Thu, 13 May 2004 01:33:22 -0400 Received: from davidandanne ([68.111.224.107]) by fed1rmmtao09.cox.net (InterMail vM.6.01.03.02 201-2131-111-104-20040324) with SMTP id <20040513053312.GBNP4190.fed1rmmtao09.cox.net@davidandanne> for ; Thu, 13 May 2004 01:33:12 -0400 From: "DaveLeonard" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" Subject: RE: [FlyRotary] Detonated! :-( Date: Wed, 12 May 2004 22:33:15 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_004A_01C43871.1E083210" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 Importance: Normal This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_004A_01C43871.1E083210 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Todd, Very sorry to hear this and am glad you are OK. I know what you are going through as I just did a re-build myself. Extremely curious to hear what caused the detonation and what you now feel are safe boost limits. Please don't forget to comment on what fuel you were using. There have been a ton of engines and 13B parts on e-bay lately. Don't forget to look there for parts. I just got a quality front plate for $100 and a set of 4 injectors for $88 - not to mention an auto flex plate for $1. There is (or was) a low time TT engine going for about $600. Good Luck, Dave Leonard -----Original Message----- From: Rotary motors in aircraft [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]On Behalf Of Haywire Sent: Wednesday, May 12, 2004 10:03 PM To: Rotary motors in aircraft Subject: [FlyRotary] Detonated! :-( Hi Guys; Got some good news and bad news. Bad news first. During a flight on Monday, during climb-out I inadvertently over-boosted and detonated the engine (more on why later), destroying 1 apex seal in each rotor. It also caused some damage at the rotor tip. At first inspection I thought I had no damage to the rest of the engine, but I just discovered a small scuff mark on the rear end housing. The attached picture shows it rather poorly, but due to the shiny reflective surface is it hard to take a pic to show it clearly. I'm uncertain if this means the rotor is now NFG. The apex of the #2 rotor is where the worst detonation occurred and there is a small notch in the rotor at this location. Again, I don't know yet if this is any good. The pic of the seals pretty much says it all. It also shows one of the side seals that broke. There was another side seal broken as well, but with only a small 2mm piece cleanly broken off the end, would have been easy to miss. The pic of the rotor apex also clearly shows remnants of the ceramic coating that was applied to the rotor faces. So if anything at least this shows that don't waste your money on this mod. Oh yeah, the good news (hey it's my attempt at finding a silver lining). While I knew something was definitely amiss, the engine continued to run and produce good power while I made a circuit (called tower for a precautionary landing... didn't want to see them damn fire trucks come out to meet me) and continued to run until I was on the ground at which time it quietly died. This is one of the aspects of the rotary that initially attracted me to this engine. I just didn't expect to find out first-hand. I really don't doubt that it would have lasted at least a little while longer. It actually ran so good that I really didn't believe that there was much if any damage and tried everything yesterday trying to start it in an effort to avoid removing the engine. After no success and a call to Tracy, I finally pulled it and took it home. Tore it down this morning. Viewing the apex seals through the exhaust ports, everything looked fine. The damage was just past the edge of the port. Surprisingly they actually still felt solid and had spring in them with no indication of the true amount of damage. I was beginning to second guess my decision to teardown. I'll be using Tracy's new apex seals in the rebuild and am now just trying to decide which other parts I need. S. Todd Bartrim (now into beer drinking mode... lots of beer :-( Turbo 13B RV-9Endurance C-FSTB http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm "Whatever you vividly imagine, Ardently desire, Sincerely believe in, Enthusiastically act upon, Must inevitably come to pass". ------=_NextPart_000_004A_01C43871.1E083210 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Todd,  Very sorry to hear this and am glad you are = OK.  I know=20 what you are going through as I just did a re-build = myself.
 
Extremely curious to hear what caused the detonation and what = you now=20 feel are safe boost limits.  Please don't forget to comment on what = fuel=20 you were using.
 
There=20 have been a ton of engines and 13B parts on e-bay lately.  Don't = forget to=20 look there for parts.  I just got a quality front plate for $100 = and a set=20 of 4 injectors for $88 - not to mention an auto flex plate for = $1. =20 There is (or was) a low time TT engine going for about = $600.
 
Good=20 Luck,
Dave=20 Leonard
-----Original Message-----
From: Rotary motors in = aircraft=20 [mailto:flyrotary@lancaironline.net]On Behalf Of=20 Haywire
Sent: Wednesday, May 12, 2004 10:03 = PM
To:=20 Rotary motors in aircraft
Subject: [FlyRotary] Detonated!=20 :-(

Hi=20 Guys;
    Got some good news and bad news. Bad news first. During a = flight on=20 Monday, during climb-out I inadvertently over-boosted and detonated = the engine=20 (more on why later), destroying 1 apex seal in each rotor. It also = caused some=20 damage at the rotor tip. At first inspection I thought I had no damage = to the=20 rest of the engine, but I just discovered a small scuff mark on the = rear end=20 housing. The attached picture shows it rather poorly, but due to the = shiny=20 reflective surface is it hard to take a pic to show it clearly. I'm = uncertain=20 if this means the rotor is now NFG. The apex of the #2 rotor is where = the=20 worst detonation occurred and there is a small notch in the rotor at = this=20 location. Again, I don't know yet if this is any good. The pic of the = seals=20 pretty much says it all. It also shows one of the side seals that = broke. There=20 was another side seal broken as well, but with only a small 2mm piece = cleanly=20 broken off the end, would have been easy to miss.
    The pic of the rotor apex also clearly shows remnants of the = ceramic=20 coating that was applied to the rotor faces. So if anything at least = this=20 shows that don't waste your money on this mod.
    Oh yeah, the good news (hey it's my attempt at finding a = silver=20 lining). While I knew something was definitely amiss, the engine = continued to=20 run and produce good power while I made a circuit (called tower for a=20 precautionary landing... didn't want to see them damn fire trucks come = out to=20 meet me) and continued to run until I was on the ground at which time = it=20 quietly died. This is one of the aspects of the rotary that initially=20 attracted me to this engine. I just didn't expect to find out = first-hand. I=20 really don't doubt that it would have lasted at least a little while=20 longer.
     It actually ran so good that I = really=20 didn't believe that there was much if any damage and tried everything=20 yesterday trying to start it in an effort to avoid removing the = engine. After=20 no success and a call to Tracy, I finally pulled it and took it home. = Tore it=20 down this morning. Viewing the apex seals through the exhaust ports,=20 everything looked fine. The damage was just past the edge of the port. = Surprisingly they actually still felt solid and had spring in them = with no=20 indication of the true amount of damage. I was beginning to second = guess my=20 decision to teardown.
    I'll be using Tracy's new apex seals in the rebuild and am = now just=20 trying to decide which other parts I need.

S. Todd Bartrim    (now into beer drinking = mode...=20 lots of beer :-(
Turbo 13B = RV-9Endurance
C-FSTB
http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm

=    "Whatever you vividly imagine, Ardently desire, = Sincerely=20 believe in, Enthusiastically act upon, Must inevitably come to pass".=20

 
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