Return-Path: Received: from [209.144.36.35] (HELO mail.hansoninfosys.com) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 4.2b2) with SMTP id 3204043 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Mon, 03 May 2004 15:42:03 -0400 Received: (qmail 20283 invoked by uid 89); 3 May 2004 19:42:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO dv) (216.89.133.186) by 0 with SMTP; 3 May 2004 19:42:03 -0000 Message-ID: <00dd01c43146$e9498dc0$800010ac@royell.net> From: "Dean" To: "Rotary motors in aircraft" References: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Tail Wing Incident Date: Mon, 3 May 2004 14:43:29 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00DA_01C4311C.FFAA1B40" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00DA_01C4311C.FFAA1B40 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Ed Anderson=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Monday, May 03, 2004 2:10 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Tail Wing Incident -----=20 From: Tracy Crook=20 To: Rotary motors in aircraft=20 Sent: Monday, May 03, 2004 2:42 PM Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Injector testing I probably am overpropped at static and low speed. I told Clark = Lydick to build me a speed prop. I figured that being overpropped on = take-off doesnt matter if you have lots of HP and can get off the ground = in 1200 ft and climb like a banshee anyway. I'll be sending the prop = back for adjustment once I get solid numbers, but I don't think I'll = want him to cut it back much. john Slade=20 What sort of top speed, and cruise speed do you expect? What = would be common for an O-360 powered plane?=20 Cheers, Rusty (wishing the RV airfoil wasn't so draggy over 220 mph) I used to think the same thing (draggy airfoil) but I think the = problem with RVs over 220 is related to wing / tail / fuselage = incidence. At 220 I get the visual impression that I am in a dive = during level flight. The early Citation jets used the same airfoil as the lowly RV. Tracy Tracy,=20 As you known, the airflow over the horizontal tail is such as = to exert down force on the tail (Nose up) to overcome the forward = pitching movement of the CL of the wing airfoil. I suspect that at the = higher airspeeds the airflow over the wing could be changed sufficiently = that the tail surface might be providing less downforce (nose up ) than = required. In otherwords the downforce on the horizontal stab is = sufficiently lessened that the nose lowers until the horizontal stab = finds a new equilibrium point at your higher airspeed. As nose goes = down, more of the upper surface of the horiz stab is exposed to the = airflow causing more down force/nose up until the new equilibrium is = reached. Just a thought. Ed Ed Not questioning anything you just stated. Keep in mind also, that = with the dynamic pressure increasing as the square of the speed, the = required angle of attack of the wing is reduced and the nose goes down = from that alone. I am not sure what the CL shift is as the AOA = decreases with increase in speed. Tracy is seeing AS numbers that I = will never see on my 9A. Dean Van Winkle RV-9A 13B ------=_NextPart_000_00DA_01C4311C.FFAA1B40 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Ed=20 Anderson
Sent: Monday, May 03, 2004 2:10 = PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Tail Wing=20 Incident

-----
From:=20 Tracy = Crook
To: Rotary motors in = aircraft=20
Sent: Monday, May 03, 2004 = 2:42=20 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: = Injector=20 testing

 
I = probably am=20 overpropped at static and low speed.  I told Clark Lydick to = build me=20 a speed prop. I figured that being overpropped on take-off doesnt = matter=20 if you have lots of HP and can get off the ground in 1200 ft and = climb=20 like a banshee anyway. I'll be sending the prop back for = adjustment once I=20 get solid numbers, but I don't think I'll want him to cut it back=20 much.
john = Slade 
 
What sort of top speed, = and cruise=20 speed do you expect?  What would be common for = an=20 O-360 powered=20 = plane? 
 
Cheers,
Rusty (wishing the RV = airfoil wasn't=20 so draggy over 220=20 mph)
 
I used to think the same thing (draggy=20 airfoil)  but I think the problem with RVs over 220 is = related to=20 wing / tail / fuselage incidence.   At 220 = I get the=20 visual impression that I am in a dive during level=20 flight.
&nbs= p;
The early Citation jets used the same = airfoil as=20 the lowly RV.
&nbs= p;
Tracy
&nbs= p;
Tracy,=20
&nbs= p;
   As you known, the airflow = over the=20 horizontal tail is such as to exert down force on the tail (Nose = up) to=20 overcome the forward pitching movement of the CL of the wing=20 airfoil.  I suspect that at the higher airspeeds the airflow = over the=20 wing could be changed sufficiently that the tail surface might be=20 providing less downforce (nose up ) than = required.  =20  In otherwords the downforce on the horizontal stab  is=20 sufficiently lessened that the nose lowers until the horizontal = stab finds=20 a new equilibrium point at your higher airspeed.  As nose = goes down,=20 more of the upper surface of the horiz stab is exposed to the = airflow=20 causing more down force/nose up until the new equilibrium is=20 reached.  Just a=20 thought.
&nbs= p;
&nbs= p;
&nbs= p;
Ed
 
Ed
 
Not questioning anything you just = stated.  Keep in mind also, that with the dynamic pressure = increasing=20 as the square of the speed, the required angle of attack of the = wing is=20 reduced and the nose goes down from that alone.  I am not = sure what=20 the CL shift is as the AOA decreases with increase in speed.  = Tracy=20 is seeing AS numbers that I will never see on my 9A.
 
Dean Van Winkle    = RV-9A  =20 13B
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