X-CGP-ClamAV-Result: CLEAN X-VirusScanner: Niversoft's CGPClamav Helper v1.23.0 (ClamAV engine v0.103.0) X-Junk-Score: 0 [] X-Cloudmark-Score: 0 [] X-Cloudmark-Analysis: v=2.3 cv=XpSExmN9 c=1 sm=1 tr=0 a=zH84+iQVYCMqht19D97Ieg==:117 a=xqWC_Br6kY4A:10 a=3YhXtTcJ-WEA:10 a=x7bEGLp0ZPQA:10 a=A-0mRrAPPO4A:10 a=r77TgQKjGQsHNAKrUKIA:9 a=pGLkceISAAAA:8 a=5lucXWJGAAAA:8 a=Ia-xEzejAAAA:8 a=_6GpL_ENAAAA:8 a=o1OHuDzbAAAA:8 a=pW8B2vQ6AAAA:8 a=7g1VtSJxAAAA:8 a=zKEF5_lGZzTARtELFZgA:9 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=Qa1je4BO31QA:10 a=gvSQh4r-fQ0A:10 a=4PR2P7QzAAAA:8 a=dDZimZLleCfthtPlCAsA:9 a=iX7O2dkl98eSvzVG:21 a=_W_S_7VecoQA:10 a=sIFWCFSNc_AA:10 a=tjNemD4wtFR24VrVMQME:22 a=Urk15JJjZg1Xo0ryW_k8:22 a=5YQ6H4ZxyGn-KoBYtt8s:22 a=NM4QHZ20jVRG-2vQPwNQ:22 a=grOzbf7U_OpcSX4AJOnl:22 a=4dqwQCo7Po2mVW515mGf:22 From: "Charlie England ceengland7@gmail.com" Received: from mail-oi1-f180.google.com ([209.85.167.180] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.2.14) with ESMTPS id 1461658 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 28 Apr 2021 19:38:00 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.167.180; envelope-from=ceengland7@gmail.com Received: by mail-oi1-f180.google.com with SMTP id i11so2784425oig.8 for ; Wed, 28 Apr 2021 16:38:01 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :in-reply-to:content-language; bh=qyWHfv2pJat75lGj19cFqRZpsuRTI4wCGJljNgHUXuM=; b=q9e1cSiWiL1gqPVDlPfWQ2RJ6RKgVhrWTpXtfP4B+tde14VYF+mj9eGpuMMszIyAhJ w5urNt0lUoFHk3EqSK9e7TSZ5sv7jAsPk4198Pad6K0TWPOw8upng23gzBiEqosyK9P4 S0JKm1yXMERBJZ+xryB+xX2+7z34UzfsRhrd1sG6HdflT5RSKx5vFp5QxVuOp1EXvjh6 R+Q/KCIsDnnXrj/QLHH32xecEt/nZ3LYBwo43KDwxcxE8oXO5pA4tEwkhDTHq3DTwdXk eSuefc7TWt4FQQdUvZ08uzU+G4bnxWnPHsJwIELaDBdBK7IKq0LazYe+vKeRF+vC7eMo My2w== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language; bh=qyWHfv2pJat75lGj19cFqRZpsuRTI4wCGJljNgHUXuM=; b=NLIWEtOJvn8Nqq2ifCWHynkycG4crW0auCuX4r2DDKDyoiQIWMVJ0JEvOAUlwdickX ipMeL7T4dpOsIV9VCYz+kijGq1pcd+8Z2MT5MOXSLYQHjpiebTRMhwQDxBNYjbP+SRWF tGwQyRrjQMis79mrIowgnHo9op1McnGZNdOXkl0QUSBEmuxLkMPde70IRGKqWIRUAcDW lL/1U6PDO17Q4zaRsuMTGjk2hJ1SgAyBJ7JhY7syzmV4wFzvWn1ucO42AqmXNklLL8t6 WS+yfsyibWzI/NdSVFraYEhiqZYQY9+L9k8HXpJOWmbemGoMEp8fmvTxX86JhTikj9ih kHWQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531H9y4H9GCKVjn9VKRD7jxWnLukqF0eE+4P2iHqIswtgvKMsqlE NYKw7LfGYHLsoUlt+iJMZI/0OYrIRZ8= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzjoh6RJyRgnIgqY9bhQmiRK/AKWY9UvbuII1456BIijFaP144XiRzDE9wrFyvkQHKsyOmt9Q== X-Received: by 2002:aca:4bc2:: with SMTP id y185mr4207042oia.64.1619653063353; Wed, 28 Apr 2021 16:37:43 -0700 (PDT) Return-Path: Received: from ?IPv6:::1? ([2607:fb90:d082:9756:c13f:4302:cf56:962f]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id n17sm277875oie.11.2021.04.28.16.37.41 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 28 Apr 2021 16:37:42 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: PSRU thrust bearing/washer To: Rotary motors in aircraft References: Message-ID: Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2021 18:40:53 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.10.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------95BFAA27CC5457B826F831DE" Content-Language: en-US X-Antivirus: Avast (VPS 210428-4, 04/28/2021), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------95BFAA27CC5457B826F831DE Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Does 'glass filled' mean fiberglass? Any abrasive risk if the PTFE does start to wear? Looks like they also have straight PTFE sheet stock, but I didn't look at durometer. Are you running some monster 8' diameter prop with that ratio? Charlie On 4/28/2021 5:46 PM, Matt Boiteau mattboiteau@gmail.com wrote: > Squished / deformed is the verbage I used back in 2019 about it. I > can't seem to find any pictures on it, but I remember it being > deformed up pretty good. I've been battling issues in the past with > the vulcanization rubber of Neil's cushion drive was coming apart. > I've put on Tracey's Cushion drive in the meanwhile. > > Dry fitting everything (no oring and no snubber) with the input shaft > sitting all the way down on the prop shaft, I have 0.085" clearance. > To get the 5-10thou gap, I would need a snubber 0.075" - 0.080" thick. > The closest I can get is 1/16" thick, which is 0.0625. > > I found this stuff for the snubber, high temp. Can cut out a washer > from it. > https://www.mcmaster.com/8636K11/ > > There is a restrictor in the fitting going into the PSRU. I have a > temp gauge on the PSRU, and it stays consistent with the oil. I have > parts to add a PSI sensor to the back half of the PSRU to see if > things are draining okay. > > - Matt Boiteau > > > On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 5:29 PM Charlie England ceengland7@gmail.com > > wrote: > > The confusing thing to me is how it got hot enough to melt nylon; > over 400 degrees F. That seems a lot hotter than than the shaft or > bearings should ever get. > > > Virus-free. www.avast.com > > > > > On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 3:13 PM Matt Boiteau mattboiteau@gmail.com > > wrote: > > The end play was good. Metal ruler across and could just see > daylight across. > > Neil's uses a rubber oring, so we test endplay without it. > Then adding the oring will add the nessessary clearance in end > play. > > The one Neil supplied was either nylon or Teflon flat washer > and it melted, so removed it. So talking with him, switched it > out to the oil embedded one. Again, just a flat washer. > > Anyone have more details what Tracey used? Like a spring > washer made out of nylon? > > > > > > On Wed., Apr. 28, 2021, 14:16 Finn Lassen > finn.lassen@verizon.net , > > wrote: > > Too little or too much end play? > > Tracy specifies 0.005 to 0.035" > > Note that if you check it without RTV, it may increase > when you assemble it. > > Finn > > On 4/28/2021 1:05 PM, Matt Boiteau mattboiteau@gmail.com > wrote: >> I have one of Neil's 3.17 psru with Tracey's cushion >> drive. *I also sent Neil an email but it's late in the >> night in Australia. >> >> After my fly off hours, tearing down the plane to inspect >> everything. The Ultra-Low-Friction Oil-Embedded Thrust >> Bearing is broken into pieces. >> https://wwwmcmaster.com/7421K28/ >> >> >> The nylon or teflon washer supplied just melted. I >> thought I nailed it with a fix using the oil-embedded, >> but I guess not. >> >> I think in Tracey's documentation, he called it a snubber >> ? Any ideas what I can use, or why this happens? >> - Matt Boiteau >> >> >> -- >> Homepage:http://www.flyrotary.com/ >> Archive and UnSub:http://mail.lancaironline.net:81/lists/flyrotary/List.html > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Avast logo > > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus > software. > www.avast.com > > > <#m_8500599527585685214_m_8865818780860055044_m_-123363309103512791_m_1371103534129407806_m_-7051677788530083193_m_7353984697272831048_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2> > -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus --------------95BFAA27CC5457B826F831DE Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Does 'glass filled' mean fiberglass? Any abrasive risk if the PTFE does start to wear? Looks like they also have straight PTFE sheet stock, but I didn't look at durometer.

Are you running some monster 8' diameter prop with that ratio?

Charlie

On 4/28/2021 5:46 PM, Matt Boiteau mattboiteau@gmail.com wrote:
Squished / deformed is the verbage I used back in 2019 about it. I can't seem to find any pictures on it, but I remember it being deformed up pretty good. I've been battling issues in the past with the vulcanization rubber of Neil's cushion drive was coming apart. I've put on Tracey's Cushion drive in the meanwhile.

Dry fitting everything (no oring and no snubber) with the input shaft sitting all the way down on the prop shaft, I have 0.085" clearance. To get the 5-10thou gap, I would need a snubber 0.075" - 0.080" thick. The closest I can get is 1/16" thick, which is 0.0625.

I found this stuff for the snubber, high temp. Can cut out a washer from it. 
https://www.mcmaster.com/8636K11/

There is a restrictor in the fitting going into the PSRU. I have a temp gauge on the PSRU, and it stays consistent with the oil. I have parts to add a PSI sensor to the back half of the PSRU to see if things are draining okay.

- Matt Boiteau


On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 5:29 PM Charlie England ceengland7@gmail.com <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:
The confusing thing to me is how it got hot enough to melt nylon; over 400 degrees F. That seems a lot hotter than than the shaft or bearings should ever get. 

Virus-free. www.avast.com

On Wed, Apr 28, 2021 at 3:13 PM Matt Boiteau mattboiteau@gmail.com <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:
The end play was good. Metal ruler across and could just see daylight across.

Neil's uses a rubber oring, so we test endplay without it. Then adding the oring will add the nessessary clearance in end play.

The one Neil supplied was either nylon or Teflon flat washer and it melted, so removed it. So talking with him, switched it out to the oil embedded one. Again, just a flat washer.

Anyone have more details what Tracey used? Like a spring washer made out of nylon?





On Wed., Apr. 28, 2021, 14:16 Finn Lassen finn.lassen@verizon.net, <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:
Too little or too much end play?

Tracy specifies 0.005 to 0.035"

Note that if you check it without RTV, it may increase when you assemble it.

Finn

On 4/28/2021 1:05 PM, Matt Boiteau mattboiteau@gmail.com wrote:
I have one of Neil's 3.17 psru with Tracey's cushion drive. *I also sent Neil an email but it's late in the night in Australia.

After my fly off hours, tearing down the plane to inspect everything. The Ultra-Low-Friction Oil-Embedded Thrust Bearing is broken into pieces. 
https://wwwmcmaster.com/7421K28/

The nylon or teflon washer supplied just melted. I thought I nailed it with a fix using the oil-embedded, but I guess not.

I think in Tracey's documentation, he called it a snubber ? Any ideas what I can use, or why this happens?
- Matt Boiteau


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