X-Virus-Scanned: clean according to Sophos on Logan.com From: "Todd Bartrim" Received: from mail-ua0-f182.google.com ([209.85.217.182] verified) by logan.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 6.1.11) with ESMTPS id 8926666 for flyrotary@lancaironline.net; Wed, 07 Sep 2016 10:46:16 -0400 Received-SPF: pass receiver=logan.com; client-ip=209.85.217.182; envelope-from=bartrim@gmail.com Received: by mail-ua0-f182.google.com with SMTP id u68so14836594uau.1 for ; Wed, 07 Sep 2016 07:46:15 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=lZFpJbR7L/K9vtcyril3sDxxnoL1ZmUyET9Xby05wUw=; b=eDotjuf1o7mlI/qmMfpyGqWq27CG5amON0F73Mcp7Bo7zTMFngUNDT3h3KzwU0xGkN R6T+HxnzpR7kpD8O6Vxg1k0WoSSDre0P3NUpXnsNZxXMQOnoMrKNYfPZejsZdYQ8NVbO fskon9eMbdmuKGlzuLahYpzplcAESq+0Jv5uxsvTmHKHA/zmPeXzyPaj03d6AmmLOu8N z6ESfXWCDN79O1qmlmWe8Hn9CMEfoWITQE/N0/PWaKaYWVY6LwRon4PzvAeE8rzMLLBE iUhFwMxfnrXj4u0lqbMKBx83HTE8NclbHQ7+6veMn5YLfaQQ3bSum6WpvKVVFJgRKBak 1mQQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=lZFpJbR7L/K9vtcyril3sDxxnoL1ZmUyET9Xby05wUw=; b=QjAXJ/c7/Xc6zK4sJ3x74aR/duB8Ds0QeBtrSuRCYG3J9R0VDJCc6oITJfvc8AUqcI gHACGec1zGPXrb4334Ww/FI3adHtkgWHjWOuSCkdTJLEXvB8Vs1jfQfmRLdE47jDZJUq sXTvqmFqU1Ub4rrJlhGdjIlSm7f5FycvStRxbSgeTcnBvjI+kNItZAf9lPgRWQQCdUY+ zJDMA7KcxXexz2J8LYZ0rrlQHpb8VNiptJcVfW5Om8EuZmFCD31EI5+TUwGTqDwgRysK 00AO8Gj4iKwfIuShXdrJIp95mblXstXCgUdRbSTvlV6OlD6glimFfRvAe61mR3z/IAlF +/QQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AE9vXwOFV64fZcOMqpyu68WYaI3JRNnq/ZwUX3jRiUO896tF2drZ5ZRZCaOnZ7nNpS2TSgzmS6cp1yrOVBLBZA== X-Received: by 10.159.54.225 with SMTP id p88mr3529738uap.123.1473259557652; Wed, 07 Sep 2016 07:45:57 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.176.65.104 with HTTP; Wed, 7 Sep 2016 07:45:56 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2016 07:45:56 -0700 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [FlyRotary] Re: Fw: Big day tomorrow ! To: Rotary motors in aircraft Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=94eb2c03c0de989153053bebf88d --94eb2c03c0de989153053bebf88d Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable any word yet from Max today? Todd Bartrim On Tue, Sep 6, 2016 at 6:32 PM, Todd Bartrim wrote: > A couple of hours staring at steam guages in a snow storm while over wate= r > with no auto pilot. .... Iron man in a wooden plane. Bet he has a hairy > chest too =F0=9F=98=86! > I'm just thinking about autopilot as I'm thinking about pulling the > trigger and ordering a set of servos for my Dynon tonight. And to convinc= e > myself to do it I try to imagine myself in Max's place. > I sure hope his engine problem is as simple as your long distance > diagnosis. > Further to that, I just installed a canister fuel filter/water separater > with a water detection probe to avoid that very problem. > > On Tue, Sep 6, 2016, 5:17 PM Ed Anderson > wrote: > >> Thanks, Alex >> >> I passed your suggestion on to Max. Have not yet heard from him whether >> he checked for water in his fuel. >> >> Ed >> >> *From:* alex >> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 06, 2016 4:05 PM >> *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft >> *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Re: Fw: Big day tomorrow ! >> >> >> I don't know the construction of the falconavia wing, but if there's low >> spots in the tanks eternity ribs for instance for water to gather he mi= ght >> want to consider doing a few wing tank drains and moving the wings fore = and >> aft between draining, leave to settle for 30 min between each drain. See= if >> he can get more water out, minimize his chances of getting problems agai= n >> >> Alex Molteno >> >> On Sep 6, 2016 6:16 PM, "Ed Anderson" >> wrote: >> >>> When I had spark plug sag, the engine did not sputter, it just lost rpm >>> and power. >>> >>> He had 14 hours with the engine running fine and after a night of heavy >>> rain with it left outside (which he normally does not do) and then the >>> sputtering does not start until 5 minutes after take off, sure makes it >>> sound like water in the fuel to me. >>> >>> Ed >>> >>> *From:* Kelly Troyer >>> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 06, 2016 12:44 PM >>> *To:* Rotary motors in aircraft >>> *Subject:* [FlyRotary] Re: Fw: Big day tomorrow ! >>> >>> Ed, >>> I think you may have diagnosed the problem..........It does not sound >>> like spark plug "SAG"...........Hope So ??............. >>> >>> Kelly Troyer >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Tue, Sep 6, 2016 at 11:28 AM, Ed Anderson < >>> flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Bummer, Max - to hear you had a problem after such a great start. >>>> Grateful that >>>> you made it back to the airport. >>>> >>>> Here is my best guess as to the problem. IF it rained all night long >>>> and >>>> the engine was running fine when you landed, it sure sounds like you g= ot >>>> water in your fuel tanks. >>>> >>>> Five minutes is enough to burn all the >>>> uncontaminated fuel out of the lines and your fuel sump and start >>>> sucking in >>>> water contaminated fuel. By playing with the fuel mixture you probabl= y >>>> made >>>> it rich enough (more fuel) to sort of counteract the water in the fuel= . >>>> >>>> I would drain some fuel from each tank and check it for water - I'll >>>> bet you >>>> find some. >>>> >>>> IF you can somehow turn off your wing tanks fuel feed and turn on the >>>> aux >>>> tank in the cockpit (which should not have water in it), then see how = it >>>> runs. >>>> >>>> If you run the engine on the ground and it is the water causing the >>>> problem, >>>> you should use up the water in a few minutes and then it should start >>>> running normally. IF that happens then, in my opinion, that increase >>>> the >>>> odds that it was water in the fuel that caused your problem. >>>> >>>> I'll bet you normally keep you aircraft in the hangar when its >>>> raining. IF >>>> so its not uncommon when left out in the rain that rain could leak >>>> past old >>>> hard rubber seals around your filler caps - are they located on the to= p >>>> of >>>> the wing?? >>>> >>>> Let me know what you find. >>>> >>>> Ed >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- From: (null) maximilian >>>> Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2016 12:06 PM >>>> To: Ed Anderson >>>> Subject: Re: Big day tomorrow ! >>>> >>>> What could have happened? >>>> it was raining all night long! >>>> 5 min after takeoff it started loosening power like sputtering! >>>> thank god after playing with the mixture it ran just enough to get me >>>> back >>>> to airport >>>> very scary! I was fully loaded with fuel! >>>> most likely I leave the plane here! >>>> >>>> max >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On Sep 6, 2016, at 10:52 AM, Ed Anderson >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Great going, Max - you put Lindberg to shame {:>). Onward to Iceland >>>>> >>>>> Ed >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- From: (null) maximilian >>>>> Sent: Monday, September 05, 2016 2:04 PM >>>>> To: Ed Anderson >>>>> Cc: Stefan.Kohout@t-online.de ; s-kocher@hotmail.com ; dibora@sbg.at >>>>> ; Karin Raab ; chuck55@optonline.net ; Joseph DiPalermo >>>>> Subject: Re: Big day tomorrow ! >>>>> >>>>> I'm in Narsasuak Greenland after completing my most difficult Flight >>>>> ever! >>>>> Icing, snow, rain and fog! >>>>> Mashine and pilot went through the most difficult! >>>>> 5 hours 20 min total >>>>> more then 2 hours in solid IFR! >>>>> >>>>> wunderbar! >>>>> Max >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>> >>>>> On Sep 4, 2016, at 3:59 PM, Ed Anderson >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Stay High and dry my friend. Let us know as soon as you get to >>>>>> Greenland. >>>>>> >>>>>> Ed >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- From: Max >>>>>> Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2016 11:12 AM >>>>>> To: eanderson@carolina.rr.com ; Stefan.Kohout@t-online.de ; >>>>>> s-kocher@hotmail.com ; dibora@sbg.at ; Karin Raab ; >>>>>> chuck55@optonline.net ; Joseph DiPalermo >>>>>> Subject: Big day tomorrow ! >>>>>> >>>>>> Got my survival gear, Flieger is loaded with gas, weather looks good >>>>>> tail wind >>>>>> Going straight from Goose bay to Greenland 5 hours over water! >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ----- >>>>>> No virus found in this message. >>>>>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >>>>>> Version: 2016.0.7442 / Virus Database: 4649/12942 - Release Date: >>>>>> 09/04/16 >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ----- >>>>> No virus found in this message. >>>>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >>>>> Version: 2016.0.7442 / Virus Database: 4649/12949 - Release Date: >>>>> 09/05/16 >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- >>>> No virus found in this message. >>>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >>>> Version: 2016.0.7442 / Virus Database: 4649/12956 - Release Date: >>>> 09/06/16 >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Homepage: http://www.flyrotary.com/ >>>> Archive and UnSub: http://mail.lancaironline.net: >>>> 81/lists/flyrotary/List.html >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Kelly Troyer >>> Dyke Delta_"Eventually" >>> 13B_RD1C_EC2_EM2 >>> >>> No virus found in this message. >>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >>> Version: 2016.0.7442 / Virus Database: 4649/12956 - Release Date: >>> 09/06/16 >>> >> No virus found in this message. >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >> Version: 2016.0.7442 / Virus Database: 4649/12956 - Release Date: 09/06/= 16 >> > --94eb2c03c0de989153053bebf88d Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
any word yet from Max today?

Todd Bartrim

On Tue, Sep 6, 2016 at 6:32 PM, Todd Bartrim= <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:

A couple of hours staring at steam guages in a snow storm while over wate= r with no auto pilot. .... Iron man in a wooden plane. Bet he has a hairy c= hest too =F0=9F=98=86!
=C2=A0=C2=A0 I'm just thinking about autopilot as I'm thinking abou= t pulling the trigger and ordering a set of servos for my Dynon tonight. An= d to convince myself to do it I try to imagine myself in Max's place. <= br> =C2=A0 I sure hope his engine problem is as simple as your long distance di= agnosis.
Further to that, I just installed a canister fuel filter/water separater wi= th a water detection probe to avoid that very problem.


On Tue, Sep 6, 2016, 5:17 P= M Ed Anderson <flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:
Thanks, Alex
=C2=A0
I passed your suggestion on to Max.=C2=A0 Have not yet heard from him= =20 whether he checked for water in his fuel.
=C2=A0
Ed
=C2=A0
From: alex
Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2016 4:05 PM
To: Rotary motors in aircraft <= /div>
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Fw: Big day tomorrow !
=C2=A0

I don't know the construction of the falconavia wing, bu= t if there's=20 low spots in the tanks=C2=A0 eternity ribs for instance for water to gather= he=20 might want to consider doing a few wing tank drains and moving the wings fo= re=20 and aft between draining, leave to settle for 30 min between each drain. Se= e if=20 he can get more water out, minimize his chances of getting problems again

Alex Molteno

=C2=A0
On= Sep 6, 2016 6:16 PM, "Ed Anderson" <flyrotary@lancaironline.net>= =20 wrote:
When I had spark plug sag, the engine did not sputter, it just lost = rpm=20 and power.
=C2=A0
He had 14 hours with the engine running fine and after a night of he= avy=20 rain with it left outside (which he normally does not do) and then the=20 sputtering does not start until 5 minutes after take off, sure makes it s= ound=20 like water in the fuel to me.
=C2=A0
Ed
=C2=A0
From: Kelly Troyer=20
Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2016 12:44 PM
Subject: [FlyRotary] Re: Fw: Big day tomorrow !
=C2=A0
Ed,
=C2=A0 I think you may have diagnosed the problem..........It does n= ot=20 sound like spark plug "SAG"...........Hope So ??.............
=C2=A0
Kelly Troyer
=C2=A0
=C2=A0
=C2=A0
=C2=A0
=C2=A0
On Tue, Sep 6, 2016 at 11:28 AM, Ed Anderson <= span dir=3D"ltr"><flyrotary@lancaironline.net> wrote:


Bummer,=20 Max -=C2=A0 to hear you had a problem after such a great start. Gratefu= l=20 that
you made it back to the airport.

Here is my best guess a= s to=20 the problem.=C2=A0 IF it rained all night long and
the engine was ru= nning=20 fine when you landed, it sure sounds like you got
water in your fuel= =20 tanks.

Five minutes is enough to burn all the
uncontaminated = fuel=20 out of the lines and your fuel sump and start sucking in
water=20 contaminated fuel.=C2=A0 By playing with the fuel mixture you probably= =20 made
it rich enough (more fuel) to sort of counteract the water in t= he=20 fuel.

I would drain some fuel from each tank and check it for wa= ter -=20 I'll bet you
find some.

IF you can somehow turn off your = wing=20 tanks fuel feed and turn on the aux
tank in the cockpit (which shoul= d not=20 have water in it), then see how it
runs.

If you run the engin= e on=20 the ground and it is the water causing the problem,
you should use u= p the=20 water in a few minutes and then it should start
running normally.=C2= =A0=20 IF that happens then, in my opinion, that increase the
odds that it = was=20 water in the fuel that caused your problem.

I'll bet you nor= mally=20 keep you aircraft in the hangar when its raining.=C2=A0 IF
so its no= t=20 uncommon when left out in the rain that rain=C2=A0 could leak past=20 old
hard rubber seals around your filler caps - are they located on = the=20 top of
the wing??

Let me know what you=20 find.

Ed



-----Original Message----- From: (null)= =20 maximilian
Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2016 12:06 PM
To: Ed=20 Anderson
Subject: Re: Big day tomorrow !

What could have=20 happened?
it was raining all night long!
5 min after takeoff it= =20 started loosening power like sputtering!
thank god after playing wit= h the=20 mixture it ran just enough to get me back
to airport
very scary! = I was=20 fully loaded with fuel!
most likely I leave the plane=20 here!

max

Sent from my iPad

On=20 Sep 6, 2016, at 10:52 AM, Ed Anderson <eanderson@carolina.rr.com> wrote= :

Great going,=20 Max - you put Lindberg to shame {:>).=C2=A0 Onward to=20 Iceland

Ed

-----Original Message----- From: (null)=20 maximilian
Sent: Monday, September 05, 2016 2:04 PM
To: Ed=20 Anderson
Cc: Stefan.Kohout@t-online.de ; s-kocher@hotmail.com=20 ; dibora@sbg.at ; Karin=20 Raab ; chu= ck55@optonline.net ; Joseph DiPalermo
Subject: Re:=20 Big day tomorrow !

I'm in Narsasuak Greenland after comple= ting my=20 most difficult Flight ever!
Icing, snow, rain and fog!
Mashine = and=20 pilot went through the most difficult!
5 hours 20 min total
mor= e=20 then 2 hours in solid IFR!

wunderbar!
Max

Sent from = my=20 iPad

On=20 Sep 4, 2016, at 3:59 PM, Ed Anderson <eanderson@carolina.rr.com> wrot= e:

Stay High=20 and dry my friend.=C2=A0 Let us know as soon as you get to=20 Greenland.

Ed

-----Original Message----- From:=20 Max
Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2016 11:12 AM
To: eanderson@carolina.rr.c= om ; Ste= fan.Kohout@t-online.de ; s-kocher@hotmail.com ; dibora@sbg.at ; Karin Raab ; chuck55@optonline.net ; Joseph DiPalerm= o
Subject:=20 Big day tomorrow !

Got my survival gear, Flieger is lo= aded=20 with gas, weather looks good tail wind
Going straight from Goose= bay=20 to Greenland 5 hours over=20 water!










Sent from my=20 iPhone





-----
No virus found in this=20 message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2016.0.7442 / Vir= us Database:=20 4649/12942 - Release Date:=20 09/04/16



-----
No virus f= ound=20 in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version:=20 2016.0.7442 / Virus Database: 4649/12949 - Release Date:=20 09/05/16




-----
No virus found = in=20 this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2016.0.74= 42=20 / Virus Database: 4649/12956 - Release Date: 09/06/16


=C2=A0
--
Kelly Troyer
Dyke=20 Delta_"Eventually"
13B_RD1C_EC2_EM2

No virus found in this message.
Ch= ecked by=20 AVG - www.avg.comVersion:=20 2016.0.7442 / Virus Database: 4649/12956 - Release Date:=20 09/06/16

=

No virus found in this=20 message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2016.0.7442 / Virus=20 Database: 4649/12956 - Release Date:=20 09/06/16


--94eb2c03c0de989153053bebf88d--